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  #5041  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 2:52 PM
Prezrezc Prezrezc is offline
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https://newyorkyimby.com/2020/01/nor...manhattan.html

Apparently, dated @8AM...from me via VIMBY. Truly sorry about the uplinking gaff.

Last edited by Prezrezc; Jan 19, 2020 at 3:57 PM.
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  #5042  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 4:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Zapatan View Post
I doubt it it/hope not, read the previous posts about the spiral plan. The building visually needs to be between 3 one 1WTC in mass/height.
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Originally Posted by SkyHigher View Post
The original 2006 concept would still be one of the top buildings in the city. No need for a redesign. But it will probably will be....to top off how inferior and underwhelming what was built compared to what was there before.

I think you people still don't get it. There would be no need for Silverstein to redesign Foster's original plan if it were going to look exactly the same. Silverstein is going to build to the market, and if you look at what is getting built and leased now, it is the towers with the terraces, or open spaces, trees, etc. It's all about the amenity space, and large floorplates. Factor in Foster's last three office towers in the City (425 Park, 50 Hudson, 270 Park) to get a taste for what could happen here. A lot of you wanted Foster to return to the project, but I feel you should temper your expectations for just how much it resembles the original design.
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  #5043  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 4:47 PM
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Might of just been a miscommunication with the substance of the article (the YIMBY one) and the Post article. Hence why word play and the right words can make a difference to avoid discrepancies.

"Design" should of been "Redesign" based on the Post source, The rest is just a backdrop into prior history.

What we do know, is that the tower will see change to accommodate the anticipated trends and needs. How it will look, and the changes, both internal/external, that is the suspense.
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  #5044  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 4:48 PM
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I cant seem to find it, but isn't there a diagram explaining the reasoning behind the diamonds being lopsided and asymmetrical. That always bugged the shit out of me until I saw the actual explanation.
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  #5045  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 4:52 PM
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The most important piece in that Post story:


Quote:
now that BIG’s quirky tower of stacked boxes has no takers, the old Foster design is being “significantly modified to be more reflective of contemporary needs and taste,” Silverstein says. (No rendering is available yet as it’s still a work in progress.)

And a little more from that:


Quote:
Foster’s old vision might be too stodgy for today’s market. BIG’s, meanwhile, may be too esoteric.

Foster’s first iteration was made for a pre-crash world — a handsome but conventional supertall tower with massive trading floors intended for banks in the base, crowned with four ornamental diamonds at the top.

After Two World Trade went on hold, Silverstein swiftly leased up Four World Trade, which opened in late 2013. Three World Trade, which opened in 2018, is 75% leased — and on track to be 80% full as a few deals are completed in the next few months.

The go-slow at Two World Trade has perplexed industry observers. Huge new office towers in Midtown and Hudson Yards have gone up in the past five years.

Most started work with pre-signed tenant commitments. But companies have shown no resistance to moving to the World Trade Center. Silverstein’s towers have drawn Spotify, GroupM/WPP, Media Math, Uber, IEX, Moody’s, Wilmer Hale, Hudson River Trading, McKinsey, Cozen O’Connor and most recently Kelley Drye & Warren. Conde Nast anchors the Port Authority and Durst Organization’s One World Trade.
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  #5046  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 4:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rgarri4 View Post
I cant seem to find it, but isn't there a diagram explaining the reasoning behind the diamonds being lopsided and asymmetrical. That always bugged the shit out of me until I saw the actual explanation.


Here yah go.


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  #5047  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 6:02 PM
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Im surely no architect; but:

I would suggest:

1. Horizontally, slowly undulating diamiond bow windows @the east profile,

2. Same fenestration treatment as aforementioned but vertical...

Or how about angular?

Look into that technology along with hue-shifting windows!

Last edited by Prezrezc; Jan 19, 2020 at 7:05 PM.
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  #5048  
Old Posted Jan 19, 2020, 9:04 PM
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However much they value murder it, this tower will match Tower 1 for overbuilding, warproof materials, reinforced glass, bunker grade concrete core and all the rest, right? What about Tower 3 & Tower 4?
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  #5049  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 12:17 AM
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For "overbuilding""?

Are you seriously/clinically daft?

If the presence of other things on your checklist for your (I heartily assume) semi-rhetorical questionnaire have not yet been answered to your satisfaction (i.e. articles, figures from said articles, forum posters, hand-written drawings etc.), I'm quite sure that there're enough here to go around who can/will soon enough.

But actually to your question: If they can do something about a little more east facade treatment (most likely not as radical as I suggested earlier on), I'll be happy.
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  #5050  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 12:33 AM
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Unlikely. There isn't enough space up there for all that goes with that. Those diamond levels with their modest terraced balconies between diamonds are the prime office space in the building.
The Restaurant doesn't need to be in the Diamond area directly ... perhaps the top floor BEFORE the diamonds could be the Restaurant ... still quite high up ...
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  #5051  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 12:37 AM
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what ever redesigns I just hope the height is not reduced
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  #5052  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 9:37 AM
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In the design for Tower 1 it was made clear when the final design came out that the 1,362' of the original Tower 2 and and the 1,368' of the original Tower 1 were both going to be acknowledged. However; only the 1,368' figure was. Since the official height of Tower 1 is well over that, Tower 2 could and should have a roof height of 1,362 feet to compliment Tower 1's 1,368' and even an ornamental extension above it. This would give the complex the completion it deserves yet still not undermine the 'spiral' effect. There is high demand for those extra floors on top to serve as alternative purposes such as banquet and restaurant space. Just my two cents.
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  #5053  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 2:46 PM
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What a silly pigeonhole that spiral plan has become... Talk about boxing yourself into a corner.
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  #5054  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 3:18 PM
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They might attempt to justify a height cut by paying lip service to not wanting to block the observatory's views in Tower 1.
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  #5055  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 5:10 PM
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I liked Foster's diamonds. I have no expectation they will remain but don't see any reason why they could not while still redesigning to better meet the needs of today from a functional perspective.
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  #5056  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2020, 9:31 PM
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It would be great if the new design incorporated Foster's signature diagrid. I also really hope they maintain an interesting crown that isn't flat looking. The spiral needs something angular. Particularly since they eliminated the four spires on the top of 3WTC.
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  #5057  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2020, 4:36 AM
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back in the day, when the Bjarke Ingles' 2WTC design
was unveiled . . & frequently throughout the years subsequently . .
I railed ferociously on SSP against its heinous form being built at the WTC
After a few years of discouragement about the prospect, I just let it go . .
too depressing to think about . . and I'd squawked plenty enough . .
Now, it's truly a great day for America & NYC, that the design for 2 WTC
is being returned to Foster's excellence, gravitas & capability . .
Dont get me wrong, I love Bjarke Ingles' mid-sized towers . .
his W57th Pyramid & the XI, his twisted highline towers are genius . .
But design for his supertalls, fall way short . . Spiral & 2WTC by Ingles, suck . .
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  #5058  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2020, 5:01 AM
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“. . significantly modified to be more reflective of contemporary needs and taste”
- Silverstein

the aesthetics of Foster's crown of diamond forms aint out of date . .
look closely at the incredible complexity of its form . .
It's a ton of extra work, extra materials, extra expertise and expense . .
& mostly that's not a bad thing for architecture . .
but this baby's gonna be value engineered . .
just not to the disastrous extent of the Ingles' comedown . .
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  #5059  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2020, 4:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by artspook View Post
“. . significantly modified to be more reflective of contemporary needs and taste”
- Silverstein

the aesthetics of Foster's crown of diamond forms aint out of date . .
look closely at the incredible complexity of its form . .
It's a ton of extra work, extra materials, extra expertise and expense . .
& mostly that's not a bad thing for architecture . .
but this baby's gonna be value engineered . .
just not to the disastrous extent of the Ingles' comedown . .
I don't think the complexity is what they are referring to being out of date. I think by 'contemporary needs and taste' they mean maximum leasable floorspace which always translates to boxy and fat and boring. I fully expect a value engineered box. The optimist in me hopes for at least some sort of crown element though.
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  #5060  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2020, 5:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by O-tacular View Post
I think by 'contemporary needs and taste' they mean maximum leasable floorspace which always translates to boxy and fat and boring.

Foster's original design, for the most part, was a more straightforward, and traditional (meaning older) design, once you get over the "diamonds", and nobody was going to lease space up there.
But if you look at what is being built and leased today, that's not it, so of course they'll have to redo it. They can put a crown on top of anything.












We know that the tower will fall in height somewhere between the Freedom Tower and tower 3. That much is given, we just don't know what an updated design will bring.

But we don't have to fantasize about the two, we have FOSTER and BIG designed towers rising head to head on the west side right now, with all of the modern amenities.







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