Why is Miami so underrated for its urbanity?

[LA21st]

Probably, but the Wilshire corridor isn't one of LAs walkable areas. Although maybe half of those towers are walking distance to Westwood village.

Again, it's the highrises don't mean urban/walkable thing.
I thought this was common knowledge on this site, but apparently not.

Century city isn't, mid rise Beverly hills is.

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by Segun

If you're comparing Miami Beach to LA, I'd say its like a mash up of Westwood and Santa Monica. Santa Monica because of the beach setting and the Lincoln Ave Promenade, and Westwood with the high rises lining the road.

There's also the Wynwood area which is kinda like the Arts District in LA.

[bobdreamz]

Having been born & raised across from Manhattan in W. New York, NJ and moving to Miami the city is Urban enough for me. Some of you seem to forget the Miami was actually built & developed by Northerners (Flagler/Julia Tuttle) who laid out the grid system for the entire metro. You can actually live in Miami without a car because I have done it.
My schools were 8-10 blocks away and we walked to them growing up.
But I forgot this is SSP so if it isn't hyper dense like SF or NYC then Miami isn't "Urban" or "walkable" enough so continue the Miami bashing.

[LA21st]

Nobody ever said nyc and sf are the only walkable cities.
Clearly places like Chicago or Boston or DC are walkable.

Mismi is properly rated, because I don't know where people expect it to be? It's not a old city, it's more urban than the sunbelt.(aside from la)

[craigs]

Originally Posted by bobdreamz

Having been born & raised across from Manhattan in W. New York, NJ and moving to Miami the city is Urban enough for me. Some of you seem to forget the Miami was actually built & developed by Northerners (Flagler/Julia Tuttle) who laid out the grid system for the entire metro. You can actually live in Miami without a car because I have done it.
My schools were 8-10 blocks away and we walked to them growing up.
But I forgot this is SSP so if it isn't hyper dense like SF or NYC then Miami isn't "Urban" or "walkable" enough so continue the Miami bashing.

It's not obviously true that anyone is "bashing" Miami in this thread--which posts, exactly, are you talking about?

[ue]

This is a very goofy thread, from the start. Most hilarious is the notion that a forumer who has been active on here for *checks notes* over 16 years would never have come across any Miami content in that time, indicating the very obvious Art Deco urbanism of South Beach, the proliferation of condo towers, such that he would assume that Miami is "far more sprawly, low-rise, and not particularly dynamic in vibe", you know, like Houston .

I guess sometimes pretty is enough and you just need a #gaycation in the middle of a pandemic.

Originally Posted by lio45

It's been a long time since my last visit to Miami, but I find downtown Vancouver to be sterile, which is also the level of urbanity I'd expect from Miami. (Lots of shiny new glass towers for international investors, little ground floor retail.)

Yes.... this is totally the same as this .

I don't give Vancouver credit for much, and to be sure the glass condo districts are sterile, but their urban design (which will influence a nebulous term like 'urbanity' well) is generally quite good. Nice sidewalks, generous greenery, good podiums of either light commercial or townhouses to create less of a 'canyon' effect with more of a stepped back approach, all of which enhances pedestrian friendliness. All within a city that is nowhere near as car-centric as Miami/South Florida is.

[LA21st]

I thought it was strange too.
This site has talked about Miami quite a bit in the years I've been here.

[destroycreate]

Man, the vitriol is out for me this week.

Ok guys, you win! Miami is tacky AF, a Las Vegas by the sea, devoid of all culture and tailor-made for the SUV. Nobody who visits should be impressed or have their expectations exceeded!

[Crawford]

I mean, your first sentence, while a bit exaggerated, is essentially true. Miami does primarily serve as a leisure destination analogous to Vegas, Miami does have very minimal cultural gravitas, and Miami is absolutely built for the automobile.

The second sentence is kinda weird, in that you're claiming you were unaware of Miami's global reputation for glitz/glamour, and tropical playground for wealthy celebs, and you were expecting something analogous to an anonymous Texas sprawl metro? Miami Beach as Plano?

[destroycreate]

Since this thread is hostility-central, let's break down my views since people seem to be twisting my words.

I've been super impressed by how relatively dense, walkable, and urban so much of the city is. I'm equally impressed by how many highrises and commercial town centers there are scattered around the metro.

By and large, I'm a big fan of this place and it's much less honky-tonk/tacky than I was expecting it to be

Nowhere does this initial opening state that I was unaware of Miami's art deco offerings or its place as a luxury hotspot for celebs. I knew that existed, but I didn't realize that there would be a lot more areas of walkability and many areas with high rose nodes outside of SoBe/Downtown. I of course have seen threads with condo towers featured, but actually being here, the skyline was far more massive/impactful than I'd anticipated. Maybe because it's totally flat, the skyscrapers really stand out or are visible in all directions in a way they aren't where I live. Reminded me of being in Singapore as I said.

By no means was I ever saying Miami is up there with the NYCs, Phillys, or even LA, but considering the negativity, I DO hear on this forum and even how it's portrayed in the media, I was expecting Miami to be far more sprawly, low-rise, and not particularly dynamic in vibe. Maybe like a Houston.

Slit my wrists, not sure how else you want me to say it. By dynamic I mean like a world-class sophisticated city, Miami TO ME does feel that way, I guess I was expecting it to feel a bit more provincial. Houston to me and based on my visits there feels a lot more sprawly save it for a small area downtown.

I think people don't realize that prior to this, I've never been to Florida outside of Jacksonville, and never (in my mind) really had a reason to come here being from SoCal. Unlike many people from the Midwest/East Coast, Florida was never much in my conscious because I don't have friends, family, or work obligations that take me here and it wasn't my warm-weather playground like it is for many, since it's a long flight and I already live somewhere warm. So forgive me for not really being as knowledgeable about this part of the country.

You would think a thread like this would be subject for praise, lol. I think it's cool when people have little expectation and then are pleasantly surprised. If I wrote a similar thread about I don't know, Denver, it would be a total wankfest. But the Brownstone warrior snobs here apparently will hear no positive of this sundrenched hellhole.

[cabasse]

i completely agree with your sentiments and was also quite impressed the first time i visited. miami is nothing like its sunbelt peers in GA/TX. it definitely feels much more walkable, and yeah, its weird how people are jumping on your case.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by destroycreate

Brownstone warrior snobs

^ My next band side project name. Some type of prog-rock punk sound.


Like I said earlier, after my intial mocking post saying you were snorting too much Miami coke, I got what you were saying... for someone from far outside Miami's "orbit" and as a first-time visitor, the place exceeeded your expectations on a number of fronts, particularly if you were going in with many others' negative perceptions in your mind.

[pj3000]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Miami does primarily serve as a leisure destination analogous to Vegas, Miami does have very minimal cultural gravitas, and Miami is absolutely built for the automobile.

No doubt that Miami has a "let's go party" Vegas-style quality to it. But it's far from analagous to Las Vegas, even if only considering its "leisure destination" status. Miami is just a MUCH more substantial city than Las Vegas, by any measure we could come up with. Tourism in one way or another is still the principal industry, but tourism in Miami encompasses such a broad array of commercial activities here. And trade, finance, health care, construction/real estate, and energy sectors have significant international presence in Miami.

Las Vegas is where the school custodian from Youngstown goes to blow some of his savings for a long weekend. Miami is where a billionaire from South Africa goes to race his yacht for a month in the winter.

On the "cultural gravitas" front... that's a tricky topic fraught with all sorts of tinges of Anglo supremacy.

[lio45]

Originally Posted by ue

Yes.... this is totally the same as this .

Actually yes, those are extremely similar. (Drop a Street View pin in any Montreal inner city neighborhood for contrast.) If you weren't sarcastic, can you highlight the differences? I'm curious.

I don't give Vancouver credit for much, and to be sure the glass condo districts are sterile, but their urban design (which will influence a nebulous term like 'urbanity' well) is generally quite good. Nice sidewalks, generous greenery, good podiums of either light commercial or townhouses ...

Nice sidewalks... so people can walk to... where? They only serve to walk one's dog around the block.

I had to visit someone in Coal Harbor once and I walked (from Strathcona where I lived), I was one of very few walkers as soon as I left DTES behind. Super sterile, nowhere to walk to. It may look urban at first sight because shiny condo towers, but it's not. Pretty sure that's also the "problem" in many newer Miami areas, at least according to this thread.

And IIRC from my last visit, there's sidewalks and "generous greenery" in Miami too.

[destroycreate]

Originally Posted by pj3000

On the "cultural gravitas" front... that's a tricky topic fraught with all sorts of tinges of Anglo supremacy.

100%. Miami is one of the most important cities within the Latin American sphere--economically, culturally, etc.--to downplay or argue otherwise is insanely ignorant.

[Crawford]

Miami isn't a cultural heavyweight, and this has nothing to do with Western/Anglo bias. It just developed too late to the party to develop traditional cultural markers.

In fact Miami is a very white city, much moreso than other leading U.S. cities. It's much whiter than NY, LA, SF, Chi, DC, Atl, Houston, Dallas, etc.

And, yes, it's very important to South America and the Carribean (but not to Mexico, easily the most important Spanish-speaking Latin American country), but not for the reasons under discussion.

[lio45]

Lol Crawford. "The Dow Jones is at record lows, and there are nearly no Latinos among Miami's population, it's all WASPs. Also, the election was totally stolen"

[Crawford]

Originally Posted by lio45

Lol Crawford. "The Dow Jones is at record lows, and there are nearly no Latinos among Miami's population, it's all WASPs. Also, the election was totally stolen"

Um, no one is talking about WASPs.

Miami is a white city. You don't have to have northern European origins to be white. Miami's Latin population overwhelmingly identifies as white.

[lio45]

I'll let the internet do the owning for me - just look up what the Census figures are for the "(Non-Hispanic) White" demographic category for Miami and come back to us.

[destroycreate]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Um, no one is talking about WASPs.

Miami is a white city. You don't have to have northern European origins to be white. Miami's Latin population overwhelmingly identifies as white.

Let's be real here, what it means to be White Hispanic =/= White American. There's a lot to unpack and you're being misleading.