I-5 Bridge Replacement - Formerly Columbia River Crossing | Proposed - Page 3

Urbanpdx · #41 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 3:54 AM**

Why the hell does it take 12 years to plan this bridge?

http://www.portlandtribune.com/news/...63685471509900

pdxman · #42 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 5:17 AM**

Haha because its Portland!

Urbanpdx · #43 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 5:42 PM**

Or is the whole point of both the delays and the gold-plating is that Portland does not want to add any capacity to any of its roads, for that might relieve congestion?

tworivers · #44 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 6:10 PM**

Cars bring out my nihilistic streak. I could give a shit if those who choose/have to drive around the city spend much of their time driving in congestion (Same goes for industrial food addicts dying of obesity and diabetes. You reap what you sow.), and I support the city's attempts to right the transportation mistakes of the last half-century plus. From the view on my free-moving bicycle, it looks like a bunch of retarded lemmings on the road every day. In numbers, the auto-dependent still rule, but I definitely sense that the tide has solidly turned on the political battlefield. Thankfully. You are losing, Urbanpdx. Good luck out there.

Drmyeyes · #45 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 7:19 PM**

Here's a link to an interesting article, not directly, but somewhat related to the discussion here. Urbanpdx, you'll love it...lots of numbers, and raises the issue of government contrasted with private enterprise, balanced with the realities of modern transportation. (nwig over at portlandarchitecture "give amtrack tracks" article provided the link.

http://www.glscs.com/archives/4.00.rfocus.htm?adcode=90

Urbanpdx · #46 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 7:20 PM**

If not for all those "retarded lemmings" you would starve in the streets on that bicycle. Those "lemmings" are the reason there is food in the store and a roof over your head at night and a bicycle to ride.

The automobile is the greatest invention in our nation's history.

http://americandreamcoalition.org/Greatest.pdf

edgepdx · #47 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 8:32 PM**

Yah' know I remember when this forum was actually about skyscrapers, cities and development and not a libertarian troll fest like every other F'ing forum on the Internets. Hmm, anyone want to guess as to when that changed (and I largely stopped posting). Just leave us alone UrbanPDX, talk to your buds over at the Cascade Policy Institute and start your own forum. I promise, we won't go over there and troll.

pdxman · #48 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 9:10 PM**

Here, here! I second that motion

Drmyeyes · #49 Posted **Mar 3, 2007, 10:21 PM**

Tworivers never said all those trapped motorists were lemmings, just that they looke like lemmings. What they really are is victims of the auto obsessed mindset exploited by the usual profiteers. Autos were fun and practical for quite a few decades, but now look where we are. We have this huge highway system that will be devilishly hard to maintain in the decades to come, yet much of the population is desperately dependant on it to get from home to job, etc.

bvpcvm · #50 Posted **Mar 4, 2007, 2:09 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by edgepdx

Yah' know I remember when this forum was actually about skyscrapers, cities and development and not a libertarian troll fest like every other F'ing forum on the Internets. Hmm, anyone want to guess as to when that changed (and I largely stopped posting). Just leave us alone UrbanPDX, talk to your buds over at the Cascade Policy Institute and start your own forum. I promise, we won't go over there and troll.

This is really too bad. I've noticed you hardly post here anymore and there are others too who seem to have left - Cab rarely posts nowdays, Mitch-e hardly ever, even Tworivers. But the minute we stop, the minute we give up, The Terrorist (UrbanPDX, obv) has won. He's ruined what was once a nice place to share news but hijacking it and turning it, as you said, into a trollfest. He's practicing his own little privatized version of censorship. Honestly, I've wondered if there's anywhere else we can go. I like this board, but as things have been going lately...

brandonpdx · #51 Posted **Mar 4, 2007, 6:02 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by bvpcvm

This is really too bad. I've noticed you hardly post here anymore and there are others too who seem to have left - Cab rarely posts nowdays, Mitch-e hardly ever, even Tworivers. But the minute we stop, the minute we give up, The Terrorist (UrbanPDX, obv) has won. He's ruined what was once a nice place to share news but hijacking it and turning it, as you said, into a trollfest. He's practicing his own little privatized version of censorship. Honestly, I've wondered if there's anywhere else we can go. I like this board, but as things have been going lately...

just ignore posts by the trolls. there's still lots of good stuff going on here; there's just a few pop up adds (posts) for libertarian rhetoric that I choose to skip over.

65MAX · #52 Posted **Mar 4, 2007, 8:49 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by brandonpdx

just ignore posts by the trolls. there's still lots of good stuff going on here; there's just a few pop up adds (posts) for libertarian rhetoric that I choose to skip over.

Don't feed the trolls, or just like stray cats, they'll keep coming back. Portland Transport has gotten so bad I rarely post there anymore. It's just constant ideological bickering. Unfortunately, Chris Smith feels that he can convert them, so he is always engaging them (feeding them).

It's very easy to skip over diatribes by Urbanpdx and his ilk. It just takes practice.

tworivers · #53 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 1:58 AM**

Quote:

The automobile is the greatest invention in our nation's history.

Thank you for supplying me with my new signature. I'm tempted to respond to the other lobotomized statement you coughed up for that post, but I'll refrain out of respect for the other posters here.

Quote:

It's very easy to skip over diatribes by Urbanpdx and his ilk. It just takes practice.

I agree. However, just like many of you, I stumble occasionally.

Quote:

Honestly, I've wondered if there's anywhere else we can go.

I've periodically (during the Cascadia debate; while thinking about the effect The Troll has had on this forum) thought about trying to figure out what it would take to start something up like SSP, focused entirely on the cities of Portland, Seattle, and Vancouver. Just a forum. And strictly moderated to exclude the Wendell Cox's of the world.

Drmyeyes · #54 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 3:06 AM**

Oh c'mon. Sometimes you guys are just too much (just like me?) Urbanpdx is just one guy. Forget about it. It's the real world and you can't get your knickers in a twist everytime some dude nearby creates an annoyance as they work out their personal idiosyncracies. I prefer to know what people are really thinking, even though I might not like it. It's worse when some of these characters hide off in their secret corners with their buddies creating real poison that hardly anybody knows about until the day they start infecting an usnsuspecting world.

zilfondel · #55 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 4:16 AM**

I agree. This is all pretty dumb.

65MAX · #56 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 6:12 AM**

I still don't understand why the existing bridges can't just be seismically upgraded. Then all we need is a four lane bridge for freight and local port and Hayden Island traffic, two light rail tracks and three freight rail tracks.

tworivers · #57 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 6:37 AM**

^^^There are multiple issues to contend with, obviously, but that does seem like the best idea for the best value. Basically, we need to be doing everything we can to NOT make I-5 the route of choice, not building a giant bridge that will attract even more traffic and drop even more vehicles into a PDX bottleneck. There are lots of creative options at hand.

pdxman · #58 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 6:57 AM**

What about a tunnel and keep the current bridges? A tunnel can't be more expensive than the current 6 bil estimate, can it?

PuyoPiyo · #59 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 11:23 AM**

^^^Tunnel through the under river? That's crazy to me *nervous chuckles*

WonderlandPark · #60 Posted **Mar 5, 2007, 4:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by PuyoPiyo

^^^Tunnel through the under river? That's crazy to me *nervous chuckles*

What is wrong with a tunnel under the river? It is done all the time: Holland, Lincoln, Brooklyn Battery, Queens Midtown (NY), Ted Williams (Boston), Detroit to Canada to name a few. BART goes under SF bay, Baltimore has a couple under its bay.

I think a tunnel combined with using the existing bridges is a good way to go. It would have to start in Delta Park and end up just past downtown Vancouver, but the majority of traffic on I-5 does doesn't need to stop at Jantzen or Downtown Vancouver, so that traffic would use the existing bridges.