DENVER | Main Development Thread #7

[Sam Hill]

Originally Posted by rml213

Renzo does NOT have an equity partner in place and I know that with 100% certainty.

So when Renzi confidently tells a journalist an equity partner is already in place and that financing will be “no problem,” he’s flat out lying? If that’s the case, then this is something new that I haven’t seen before. These El Jebel-esque pipe dreams keep coming around year after year, but normally the mysterious, shady developers proposing them remain in the shadows for the most part. If this washed-up, inept developer actually knows this thing is a long shot but is nevertheless reaching out to journalists with a made-up story about having an equity partner he doesn’t really have, then this is some weird shit the likes of which I’ve never seen take place in the Denver market before – at least not during the past 10 years or so that I’ve been paying close attention. Don’t get me wrong; I’m still very skeptical and definitely betting against this project ever coming to fruition. I’m just saying, this is some pretty weird shit.

[EngiNerd]

Originally Posted by CherryCreek

What exactly does that do? Is it for groundwater?

They are de-watering the basement excavations during construction. Some sites (and cities) allow you take that water and dump it right back into the storm sewer system (which in Denver, dumps straight out to the S Platte). But whatever they found on site at that particular location required the contractor to have to filter it before it is dumped back into the storm sewer. That is what those four giant tanks and red dumpster looking thing in the foreground are for.

I seem to recall that the Union Station excavations had to go through the same process.

That big crawler crane is for precast erection, a tower crane can't handle the weight of precast concrete members typically, so this one will go precast it looks like.

[mhays]

Originally Posted by Sam Hill

So when Renzi confidently tells a journalist an equity partner is already in place and that financing will be “no problem,” he’s flat out lying? If that’s the case, then this is something new that I haven’t seen before. These El Jebel-esque pipe dreams keep coming around year after year, but normally the mysterious, shady developers proposing them remain in the shadows for the most part. If this washed-up, inept developer actually knows this thing is a long shot but is nevertheless reaching out to journalists with a made-up story about having an equity partner he doesn’t really have, then this is some weird shit the likes of which I’ve never seen take place in the Denver market before – at least not during the past 10 years or so that I’ve been paying close attention. Don’t get me wrong; I’m still very skeptical and definitely betting against this project ever coming to fruition. I’m just saying, this is some pretty weird shit.

Sometimes that's a euphamism for "I'm talking to a potential partner and think my charm and narrative will close the deal."

And obviously nothing is ever solid until the value/terms of the construction contract are known, the financing terms are known, and the market is re-re-re-evaluated, all last minute before a project breaks ground.

[Ich]

Elitch Gardens owner exploring redevelopment of amusement park’s sea of surface parking

https://www.denverpost.com/2017/04/1...rface-parking/

[Sam Hill]

Originally Posted by Ich

Elitch Gardens owner exploring redevelopment of amusement park’s sea of surface parking

https://www.denverpost.com/2017/04/1...rface-parking/

oh my!

[CastleScott]

^ Yep I was just about to post the link as well, most of us remember a grand mixed-use idea was once floated for the lots south of Pepsi Center and as we all know nothing happened...

[twister244]

Originally Posted by Ich

Elitch Gardens owner exploring redevelopment of amusement park’s sea of surface parking

https://www.denverpost.com/2017/04/1...rface-parking/

Obviously, the sea of parking lots will have to be developed into something. At some point, the value of the land is going to get to be too high as surface lots begin to get swallowed by development. Just a matter of when and how. I think this is a great opportunity for the city to begin slowly transforming this immediate area with long-term vision in mind.

[EngiNerd]

Wow, that is fantastic news! If you look at the map, between the Pepsi Center and Elitch's, those lots basically cover a similar amount of area to the Union Station area....tons of possibilities there! Huge land bank there, I wonder how much all that surface area is worth these days.

[CharlesCO]

Elitch's *will not* be where it is in ten years. Kroenke is smart; you think he was going to keep it there forever? Before you know it, it'll be out in Commerce City or whatever suburb their limited clientele comes from, and Kroenke will redevelop the whole thing pending any flood plain restrictions.

[Robert.hampton]

Originally Posted by Sam Hill

So when Renzi confidently tells a journalist an equity partner is already in place and that financing will be “no problem,” he’s flat out lying? If that’s the case, then this is something new that I haven’t seen before. These El Jebel-esque pipe dreams keep coming around year after year, but normally the mysterious, shady developers proposing them remain in the shadows for the most part. If this washed-up, inept developer actually knows this thing is a long shot but is nevertheless reaching out to journalists with a made-up story about having an equity partner he doesn’t really have, then this is some weird shit the likes of which I’ve never seen take place in the Denver market before – at least not during the past 10 years or so that I’ve been paying close attention. Don’t get me wrong; I’m still very skeptical and definitely betting against this project ever coming to fruition. I’m just saying, this is some pretty weird shit.

I mean get past the second page of this: http://paradiselivingdenver.com/wp-c...mpressed-1.pdf


I mean holy fuck that is awful. Your portfolio of projects is beyond terrible, and you manage to highlight it with cut off google maps shots, washed out prints from 35mm film, and renderings that didnt match the final building. Then top it off with some shitty, low quality renderings of projects that never ended up happening because you went bankrupt!!!

Weird shit for sure.

[FunctionForm]

Originally Posted by Robert.hampton

I mean get past the second page of this: http://paradiselivingdenver.com/wp-c...mpressed-1.pdf


I mean holy fuck that is awful. Your portfolio of projects is beyond terrible, and you manage to highlight it with cut off google maps shots, washed out prints from 35mm film, and renderings that didnt match the final building. Then top it off with some shitty, low quality renderings of projects that never ended up happening because you went bankrupt!!!

Weird shit for sure.

That's too bad. If that link is supposed to be their resume, they aren't qualified to manage a project like this. I wouldn't put down $0.10.

[COtoOC]

Originally Posted by CharlesCO

Elitch's *will not* be where it is in ten years. Kroenke is smart; you think he was going to keep it there forever? Before you know it, it'll be out in Commerce City or whatever suburb their limited clientele comes from, and Kroenke will redevelop the whole thing pending any flood plain restrictions.

I personally would hate to see it move. I guess I'm part of their limited clientele, but I live in Denver. When you have kids and it's close by, it's a fun place to spend some time. We get seasons tickets every year.

[BG918]

Originally Posted by CharlesCO

Elitch's *will not* be where it is in ten years. Kroenke is smart; you think he was going to keep it there forever? Before you know it, it'll be out in Commerce City or whatever suburb their limited clientele comes from, and Kroenke will redevelop the whole thing pending any flood plain restrictions.

I've wondered about where the "next" Union Station will be once it's entirely built-out by 2020. Pepsi Center makes a lot of sense because it's all owned by one entity and is adjacent to Union Station/downtown. It also has the river on one side which could be an asset. I would think the city and Kroenke would already be discussing the options and zoning for this area. I just hope Mayor Hancock and his administration get behind it instead of continuing to fully support the Aerotropolis. The National Western Complex is also a transformative project but seems to be more geared toward tourism and education (new CSU buildings) rather than mixed-use residential and commercial which the Pepsi Center would likely have in spades, especially residential.

[CherryCreek]

Originally Posted by BG918

I've wondered about where the "next" Union Station will be once it's entirely built-out by 2020. Pepsi Center makes a lot of sense because it's all owned by one entity and is adjacent to Union Station/downtown. It also has the river on one side which could be an asset. I would think the city and Kroenke would already be discussing the options and zoning for this area. I just hope Mayor Hancock and his administration get behind it instead of continuing to fully support the Aerotropolis. The National Western Complex is also a transformative project but seems to be more geared toward tourism and education (new CSU buildings) rather than mixed-use residential and commercial which the Pepsi Center would likely have in spades, especially residential.

I do wonder what Kroenke is thinking long term. Does it make sense for Elitches to stay where it is? What is the cost of moving it? What about the Pepsi Center?

When both were built the city was desperate for anything to fill two massive holes in the urban fabric. Now, it does not seem like highest and best use.

I suppose whatever happens will likely be incremental. It would be easy to develop the Elitches parking lot directly south of Speer and adjacent to the river without much material impact on parking for either the Pepsi Center or Elitches. I bet that happens first.

Next up might be the parking lots along the the north and east sides for Pepsi Center. I suspect Pepsi Center would be fine without those parking lots too. After that, you would have to think about the whole use of the properties. I would tend to think that moving Elitches out of the Central Platte Valley in 10-15 years is what probably makes sense. The Pepsi Center (or a new arena at that point) might stay put, but with more efficient parking structures to free up land for development.

[trubador]

Just move Elitches to 61st and Pena and call it a day. Aurora will probably pay for the land and give them no taxes for 50 years.

[DenverPoke]

Originally Posted by trubador

Just move Elitches to 61st and Pena and call it a day. Aurora will probably pay for the land and give them no taxes for 50 years.

Once Kroenke took over I figured it would just be a matter of time before it was moved near the airport and greatly expanded. The land is just too valuable to keep it in the CPV.

[twister244]

Originally Posted by DenverPoke

Once Kroenke took over I figured it would just be a matter of time before it was moved near the airport and greatly expanded. The land is just too valuable to keep it in the CPV.

Right. I don't expect this to happen overnight. Perhaps they will see what happens with the first batch of land, then go from there. Assuming the economy keeps going, the pressure will grow year by year. It will take time to move the park (maybe not? I am not an expert in amusement parks), then clear the land. It's a win for the city. As others have posted, it was definitely a good catalyst to get people into the city at the time Elitch was put there. However, this city has matured, and continues to mature past beyond this need. Plus, moving it out allows for a much larger park to exist (for those of us who like massive steel roller coasters!). Will be interesting to see how this plays out.

[semiurban]

I see that the flesh colored building at 17th and Curtis has topped off. Any word on the office portion starting? I hope they haven't ruined the design.

http://www.workzonecam.com/projects/...is/workzonecam

[seventwenty]

Haven't seen this case for a bit.

Group’s Battle With Townhome Developer Heading To Supreme Court

Originally Posted by CBS4 Denver

After a two-year battle, residents in Denver’s Crestmoor neighborhood are taking their fight against a townhome developer all the way to the state Supreme Court.

Plaintiff neighbors were unsuccessful in challenging the development from being built in both district and appeals courts.

Historically, the East Denver neighborhood has been zoned for houses only. A rezoning in 2015 approved the area for condos and townhomes.

Metropolitan Homes is the developer currently building townhomes under construction at Monaco and Cedar.

Residents worry about traffic congestion and parking problems that they believe the development will cause. They say they tried to negotiate with the developer prior to pursuing litigation, but felt ignored by both the developer and the city.

. . .

As for a Supreme Court decision, Kerwin said that it could take 3-6 months for the Colorado Supreme Court to decide if it would hear the case, followed by another 6-12 months for a ruling to be issued.

News from when the case was in the district court.

Oral argument from the appeals court.

Appeals court ruling.

[RyanD]

There's a special place for the Crestmoor Park residents. From them shaming 'renters' using the park (personal experience) to this, we should build towers around their precious park. Oh yeah... Here's what they are crying about:

(I live across the street in the multi 7-story midrise complex)