[Halifax] 22nd Commerce Square | 85 & 85 M | 24 & 20 fl | On Hold

[worldlyhaligonian]

To keith's point, those aren't wooden structures.

HT should be fighting for all stone/brick buildings... Like Keith, I don't really care for most of the wooden rowhouses.

The wooden victorians are nice and vinyl siding should be banned for their exterior.

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by scryer

I really hate to throw in an example from Brooklyn but:



Imagine something like this in East coast colours and trimmings; would it not work to add density (when needed), to gentrify, and to retain your signature east coast style? Just food for thought .

To be clear, I would fight hard to protect buildings like those if Halifax had any of them. We do not, at least not in any quantity. That is a perfect example of the quality vs cheap old building argument I was making.

[scooby074]

Originally Posted by JET

http://halforbes.com/5677.html this has the before and after of the same building. No need to knock her down, restored by craftsman using old techniques can do miracles. A lot of our old housing stock has very strong bones, and is still standing one to two hundred years later, whereas newer buildings are being torn down after 50 years.
Keith, I don't think you've answered the question: could you give an example of a old wooden Halifax building that you find remarkable?

an amazing transformation... A vinyl clad, run down apartment, to what is pictured above.

[Keith P.]

Originally Posted by JET

http://halforbes.com/5677.html this has the before and after of the same building. No need to knock her down, restored by craftsman using old techniques can do miracles. A lot of our old housing stock has very strong bones, and is still standing one to two hundred years later, whereas newer buildings are being torn down after 50 years.

Is it a "restoration" if the buildings never looked like that ever in their history?

It looks to me like he has taken old wooden boxes and affixed a bunch of gingerbread that they never had in their life.

[scryer]

http://halforbes.com/5677.html this has the before and after of the same building. No need to knock her down, restored by craftsman using old techniques can do miracles.

How did I miss this link?!

Those are some AMAZING restorations! His company's work really brings back the charm to those structures.

[portapetey]

Originally Posted by scryer

How did I miss this link?!

Those are some AMAZING restorations! His company's work really brings back the charm to those structures.

Hal has been doing fantastic restorations / renovations for I'm thinking 25 years or more, and his interiors are beautiful too.

But I think Keith P is right that Hal isn't simply restoring beautiful old homes to their former glory, but making them more than they ever were in the past.

That said, I don't totally share Keith's disdain for all square boxes. There are some beautiful and charming homes all over Halifax built in similar styles.

There are also lots of cheap, boring, and charmless shacks painted like a Newfoundland fishing village in some sort of attempt at "east coast" kitsch, and I wish they'd be replaced or at least upgraded to something less "rural poverty" looking.

[Ziobrop]

These vernacular structures are the Atlantic Canadian home style. It is unique to the region and they are not found elsewhere. I rather like them, though not after they have been clad in vinyl siding and not maintained.

Be as they may these our Halifax's brownstones. Cheap perhaps but they are wood more so due to abundance locally

[portapetey]

Originally Posted by Ziobrop

These vernacular structures are the Atlantic Canadian home style. It is unique to the region and they are not found elsewhere. I rather like them, though not after they have been clad in vinyl siding and not maintained.

Be as they may these our Halifax's brownstones. Cheap perhaps but they are wood more so due to abundance locally

I don't know. Aren't brownstones more akin to "townhouses" for the affluent? Whereas these austere little boxes seem a little more indicative of quiet desperation.

I'm not sure it's a very good analogy, personally.

[someone123]

Originally Posted by portapetey

I'm not sure it's a very good analogy, personally.

The 2.5/3 storey townhouse or rowhouse with dormers is closer to being the Halifax equivalent, and there are a lot of those around town. Morris Street has some good examples.

There are plenty of 3 storey wooden apartments too (like that one linked to on the Hal Forbes site). And brick or stone houses. There's a lot of nice housing in the older parts of Halifax, and those 2 storey boxes are the low end as far as pre-war construction is concerned. They're still interesting though, and worth keeping in most cases, although I think a lot of them are good candidates for adaptive reuse rather than faithful restoration.

[someone123]

By the way, here is a restoration thread with examples from around the country: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=203463

I thought this was particularly interesting since it is an example of a few floors being added onto an old masonry building in Old Montreal: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...6&postcount=53

One of the things I've noticed about heritage preservation in Halifax is that there doesn't seem to be a lot explicit attention given to one of its more fundamental goals, which is to preserve the character of the city and keep it interesting. Another goal that you do hear about is the preservation of links to the city's past. Adaptive reuse can achieve both of these goals, and thoughtful additions to older buildings can make them better than they were before. There aren't just the 3 options of facadism, demolition, and snowglobe-style preservation, and character can be added to the city through new construction.

[Ziobrop]

Originally Posted by portapetey

I don't know. Aren't brownstones more akin to "townhouses" for the affluent? Whereas these austere little boxes seem a little more indicative of quiet desperation.

I'm not sure it's a very good analogy, personally.

Brownstones are typically row housing, but I believe it's origins was very working class. It's only recently they have become desireable and sell for a lot of money..

[someone123]

Originally Posted by Ziobrop

Brownstones are typically row housing, but I believe it's origins was very working class. It's only recently they have become desireable and sell for a lot of money..

In Manhattan row housing in the 19th century ranged from low-end crowded tenements broken out into many units all the way up to extremely opulent Upper East Side townhouses owned by millionaires. London also has a huge range of row housing.

The word "brownstone" itself is a little weird since it refers to the stone used in the facade. Increasingly though I find people use it to refer to any kind of townhouse or rowhouse (it's just become an abused real estate term I guess), so I don't really know what the official meaning is. Of the very classic stone rowhouse brownstones, some were probably low-mid range apartments while others were large individual homes (which I guess you would have been able to afford as, say, a doctor or a lawyer).

In Halifax there are a few higher end rowhouses like the grey ones on Queen Street just south of Clyde, and there are a bunch of detached "townhouse" style ones like Uniacke House. I guess Keith House also qualifies, although it's a one-off.

[counterfactual]

I recently heard that this development may be delayed 3-4 years.

Anyone have any status updates? Anyone hear something similar?

[Ziobrop]

Originally Posted by counterfactual

I recently heard that this development may be delayed 3-4 years.

Anyone have any status updates? Anyone hear something similar?

I have heard that they are offering 2 year leases on the vacant rbc floors, but nothing beyond that.

[counterfactual]

Originally Posted by Ziobrop

I have heard that they are offering 2 year leases on the vacant rbc floors, but nothing beyond that.

Hm. So, I guess this suggests that the project won't get going at least for another two years?

[xanaxanax]

Ugh I thought they were all up in arms about this being delayed by heritage trust appeals and the such and wanted to move with this asap. Also on their website they have this listed as a timeline Halifax Regional Municipality site plan approval: end of 2013
Drawings for construction: 2014
Demolition, excavation: 2015
Construction: 2015-2018

Their fuss with delays really isn't justified if they don't even plan to start for 2-4 years

[counterfactual]

Originally Posted by xanaxanax

Ugh I thought they were all up in arms about this being delayed by heritage trust appeals and the such and wanted to move with this asap. Also on their website they have this listed as a timeline Halifax Regional Municipality site plan approval: end of 2013
Drawings for construction: 2014
Demolition, excavation: 2015
Construction: 2015-2018

Their fuss with delays really isn't justified if they don't even plan to start for 2-4 years

Well, let's not get ahead of ourselves in criticizing them before any delay is officially noted. I'm just wondering if others had heard the same.

[musicman]

I have heard that some of the tenants from RBC will be moving over to the new TD tower at some point. Also heard that the RBC building is in terrible shape and really needs to come down.... But who knows...

[Ziobrop]

Originally Posted by musicman

I have heard that some of the tenants from RBC will be moving over to the new TD tower at some point. Also heard that the RBC building is in terrible shape and really needs to come down.... But who knows...

the "bank towers" of Halifax are of the same vintage - it doesn't need to come down, but it is due for substantial refresh. - The Joseph Howe building is undergoing a complete gut and refresh, and some of the cladding was replaced as well. This is also the sort of work that was done with the Existing TD Tower.

[Dmajackson]

The Heritage Trust (HTNS) has dropped their appeal of this project. Theil is now clear to proceed with the development permit and any other requirements prior to construction.

Source : The Chronicle Herald