Alarm Fatigue, or "How I learned to HATE the ontario ready alert system" - Page 5

YOWflier · #81 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 4:32 PM**

The 3AM wake-up seems to me an argument used for dramatic effect.

Abductions can and do happen at any time.
The first few hours in any abduction are crucial to a successful rescue.

Ergo, the alert is sent whenever it needs to be sent, 3AM or otherwise.

But since this discussion is hung up on the dramatic 3AM wake-up, let's realize that an alarm at that time isn't intending on making people jump out of bed and go searching (but hey, if they do, great!). Its intended audience is those who are already out and about at that time, such late night commuters/travelers/truckers/delivery people, etc., and may make a spotting.

So I see the value, but I'm also a parent of young kids so I'm used to being awakened at ungodly hours.

I'll also go out on a limb and suggest that people who are apt to experience fatigue about these alarms would probably do so whether sent twice or twenty times a year.

esquire · #82 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 5:03 PM**

^ No one minds irrelevant alarms sent at 2 pm. It's no worse than getting a spam text from your telco provider that iPhones are now on sale. It's the ones that needlessly wake you up in the middle of the night that are an issue.

MolsonExport · #83 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 5:54 PM**

I am also the parent of two young kids. I guess that piece of information is needed for virtue-signalling purposes?

The point is (re)defining the criteria of when such intrusive alarms are needed, and the scope of people that are on the receiving end of these alarms. Yeah, we love our children and would be the first to want an APB if it was our kid abducted. But to what end? Every single abduction, including those that have yet to be substantiated? Across the entire country? No matter how often, no matter what time, no matter that with every single additional alarm over some undefined threshold that the effectiveness of such an alarm starts falling rapidly to zero?

by all means, go out on that limb, but don't be too surprised if it starts giving way.

YOWflier · #84 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 7:43 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

...But to what end?

Every end necessary.

Quote:

Every single abduction

Yes.

Quote:

including those that have yet to be substantiated?

Obviously not. Is this happening currently or is it another strawman?

Quote:

Across the entire country?

No, within an appropriate radius within a jurisdiction's control (I don't think Ontario can alert phones in Manitoba, for example). If there's reason to believe the abductor boarded a plane to wherever, then obviously authorities in wherever could be notified to issue an alert of their own.

Quote:

No matter how often

Correct, as often as the abductions occur.

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no matter what time

Correct, at whatever time the abduction occurs plus the requisite investigative time.

Quote:

no matter that with every single additional alarm over some undefined threshold that the effectiveness of such an alarm starts falling rapidly to zero?

So which ones do you leave out so we don't get to zero?

As you can see it's not so hard to answer someone's questions.

Acajack · #85 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 7:52 PM**

A quick scan of Twitter and Facebook reveals that Amber Alerts in Ontario averaged about 3 a year in recent years.

The probability of all of them happening at 3 am (or even in the middle of the night) is fairly minimal, but as AC said: there is no specific time for an abduction. Abductors don't just act from 9 to 5, Monday to Friday.

Everyone's beauty sleep seems pretty safe for now, even if as I already mentioned some easy (I assume) technological tweaking and geographic targeting might be in oder.

MolsonExport · #86 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 8:02 PM**

Acajack the empiricist has settled it. No further discussion required.

jamincan · #87 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 8:38 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ac888yow

So which ones do you leave out so we don't get to zero?

As you can see it's not so hard to answer someone's questions.

Perhaps the choice for notifying about child abductions isn't between a nuclear meltdown alarm and nothing, but instead a nuclear meltdown alarm, some other reasonable notification, and nothing. Call me crazy, but I'll choose some other reasonable notification.

YOWflier · #88 Posted **Nov 30, 2020, 9:30 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by jamincan

Perhaps the choice for notifying about child abductions isn't between a nuclear meltdown alarm and nothing, but instead a nuclear meltdown alarm, some other reasonable notification, and nothing. Call me crazy, but I'll choose some other reasonable notification.

I don't think you're crazy. In fact if you look at my prior post I mentioned that I could get on board with that kind of tweak.

lio45 · #89 Posted **Dec 1, 2020, 1:16 AM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ac888yow

Its intended audience is those who are already out and about at that time, such late night commuters/travelers/truckers/delivery people, etc., and may make a spotting.

Exactly, and that's precisely our point - since the only people who can hope to be useful are the ones who are already out and about, no need for a Nuclear Meltdown Alarm that'll wake everyone up in a panic; instead, just send in a notification with sound, and anyone who's in a position to do anything about it at the time will get the message.

YOWflier · #90 Posted **Dec 1, 2020, 1:57 AM**

If only I ever disagreed with that then we'd have a point to debate.

vid · #91 Posted **Dec 1, 2020, 6:59 PM**

For the record, 6 of the 10 amber alerts sent out since March 2019 (when I upgraded my phone to receive them) happened between 10pm and 7am.

Quote:

Originally Posted by ac888yow

If only I ever disagreed with that then we'd have a point to debate.

Don't let them get you, they love to argue at you for the most nitpicky things! Don't be like me and take the bait and start arguing things that you don't care about at them! It's not worth it!

Their only real goal is to steal your time and mental wellbeing!

Acajack · #92 Posted **Dec 1, 2020, 7:14 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by vid

For the record, 6 of the 10 amber alerts sent out since March 2019 (when I upgraded my phone to receive them) happened between 10pm and 7am.

Don't let them get you, they love to argue at you for the most nitpicky things! Don't be like me and take the bait and start arguing things that you don't care about at them! It's not worth it!

Their only real goal is to steal your time and mental wellbeing!

If one's mental well-being is being affected by anonymous forum opinions that should simply make one reflect or at most uncomfortable (as unlike me most on here are not subject to personal attacks), then one has to wonder who it is that has a problem?

MolsonExport · #93 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 8:15 PM**

Just got another one. Amber Alert for child in Ottawa.

urbandreamer · #94 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 8:18 PM**

Yeah interestingly I'd turned off the alert on settings a month ago yet it still went off. I had the volume on loud as I was just watching the NFL highlights from yesterday's game.

Acajack · #95 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 8:23 PM**

I am in Gatineau and we have at least one phone with a 613 (Ottawa) area code number in the house and nothing has gone off yet.

niwell · #96 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 8:26 PM**

First time I've actually heard one! Was on a work call using Microsoft Teams on my phone and it cut out the audio for the meeting. Had to log back in.

MolsonExport · #97 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 8:54 PM**

Dipso duo. It just went off again. Second warning, same incident. Ottawa.

YOWflier · #98 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 9:00 PM**

I got today's as well on both my personal and work cells (both 613 numbers) about a minute or two apart. First thing I thought about was this thread and second "ruh-roh".

First time I can remember it being a kid from Ottawa.

About a week(?) ago I also got one from QC on my work cell only. Getting that one was interesting.

Edit: I got the second one a while ago too, same incident and message. What's the point if there's no new info provided? I was expecting to see vehicle info or kid found or something useful.

MonkeyRonin · #99 Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 10:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by ac888yow

Edit: I got the second one a while ago too, same incident and message. What's the point if there's no new info provided? I was expecting to see vehicle info or kid found or something useful.

One's in English and one in French, no? (why they aren't all just bilingual I do not know)

I got the French one about a half an hour after the English one. If that's how it works, unilingual Francophones are gonna be screwed in the event of an actual imminent disaster!

YOWflier · #**100** Posted **Dec 18, 2020, 11:09 PM**

^ Ha! I didn't notice that the first one is in English and says in French only that the French message will be available soon. The second one is bilingual.

It took them 30min to get a translator. Yep, unilingual francophones are doomed if they don't fix that.