Will any other metro host multiple teams in the same sport? - Page 3

JManc · #41 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:31 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Acajack

The Meadowlands is much more easily accessible from NYC than the Yankees/Mets are from NJ though.

NJ to Yankee Stadium is doable. NJ to Citi Field is a different story..

Acajack · #42 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:45 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by xzmattzx

I wonder if a second NHL team could go in Montreal. There used to be the Maroons, which were the Anglophone team, and the Canadiens were originally the Francophone team. Are there enough people in the Montreal area who are not Canadien fans?
.

The Montreal Canadiens rule over the Montreal area, and even the entire province of Quebec. Similarly to a European soccer team that has no rivals in the immediate vicinity. The Habs even have a significant number of fans outside Quebec - even in Ontario, whereas the Leafs have very few fans on Habs turf in Quebec.

So a second NHL team in Montreal is extremely unlikely. There are anti-Habs fans in Montreal and even more in various regions of Quebec (they even have special names for them, and they have names for Habs fans) but not enough to justify a second team in Montreal.

The best that might happen in the return of the Nordiques to Quebec City (2.5 hours from Montreal), and the anti-Habs fans from wherever in the province would naturally gravitate to them. (As they did prior to 1995.)

JManc · #43 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:47 PM**

Habs are popular in in Upstate NY as well. Close 3rd after Rangers and Sabres.

iheartthed · #44 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:48 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crawford

Right, but the Meadowlands is easily accessible by rail from NY State. The same is not true for either baseball stadium from NJ.

If you're coming from, say, LI, you can take LIRR to Penn, and NJ Transit to Meadowlands. The agencies bundle the tickets and coordinate the schedules. You can buy NJ Transit from LIRR app (or ticket machine) and vice-versa.

You can do the reverse to get to CitiField from NJ using the NJT and LIRR.

Chisouthside · #45 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:50 PM**

I can see Dupage county being able to host a second NBA team in the Chicagoland area.

SIGSEGV · #46 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:53 PM**

If another Chicagoland region would have a team it would probably be Da Region. But it won't happen.

Steely Dan · #47 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 4:54 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handro

People don't give a shit about the Bulls anymore, and this is a basketball city.

yeah, it's sad how far the franchise has fallen from glory.

the NBA has to be more than a little bit pissed that what once was, and still should be, one of the league's premiere teams in one of its biggest and most B-ball crazed cities is such a fucking embarrassment now.

ditto for new york and the knicks.

Quote:

Originally Posted by SIGSEGV

If another Chicagoland region would have a team it would probably be Da Region. But it won't happen.

yeah, probably.

but it ain't big enough.

nor does it have enough money.

da region =/= orange county. not by a long shot.

Obadno · #48 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:01 PM**

Not with current sports. Maybe down the line if some new sport gains popularity.

the most popular sport now and for the foreseeable future is Football, competition leagues have been tried twice, soon to be 3 times and likely all three will fail the NFL seems like it has no interest in expansion teams even though there are several multi-million person metros that could support teams population wise.

I think the NFL competes too much with College NCAA football for fans. Every large university has basically a semi-pro football organization.

homebucket · #49 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:03 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handro

Los Angeles is a giant market, both in population and reach, yet the Chargers are laughably unpopular in the city and there are already whispers that they will need to be moved again, although San Diego absolutely despises the owners now so they sorta screwed themselves out of a move back to their home city.

If LA can't handle a second franchise in the nation's most popular sport, I don't see how any city can add another franchise.

Chargers "home" games are actually home games for away teams. At least from a fan support standpoint.

LA21st · #50 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:05 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handro

You're probably right that a second NBA has about a .001% chance of coming to Chicago, but of the four major sports I'd say it's the most likely (i.e. compared to 0% for NFL or MLB and .0001% for NHL).

I'm basing it anecdotally on conversations I've had throughout Chicagoland and the dwindling attendance (after years of league-leading attendance despite shitty play). People don't give a shit about the Bulls anymore, and this is a basketball city. With the right placement of a new stadium, some stellar marketing, and some luck in the draft they could (theoretically) become the Sox/Mets/Clippers/Jets to the Chicago Bulls.

And yea, D-Rose is one of hte worst sports stories this city has ever seen. He was something special

The only place to be newly minted as a two-franchise city in any sport in the last 50-odd years is Los Angeles when the Rams (basically a legacy team for LA, despite moving) were joined by the Los Angeles (née San Diego) Chargers. (Not counting the Nets move from Jersey to Brooklyn, that's basically just a new stadium for the same team.)

Los Angeles is a giant market, both in population and reach, yet the Chargers are laughably unpopular in the city and there are already whispers that they will need to be moved again, although San Diego absolutely despises the owners now so they sorta screwed themselves out of a move back to their home city.

If LA can't handle a second franchise in the nation's most popular sport, I don't see how any city can add another franchise.

Anyone expecting LA to love and embrace the Chargers right away doesn't know sports. If the Chargers went to Chicago and played in a soccer stadium, they're just going to be loved there? Yea, I don't see that at all. I'd imagine it'd be full of the city's transplants too.

It's going to take years to develop the fan base, and that's what the owner is counting on. Whispers? The Owner laughs it off, and he's the only one who counts. The Chargers also play in A TEMPORARY SOCCER stadium at the moment. Let's see what happens next year when their permanment home is ready.

I'm a 49er fan, but the Rams/Chargers expecations never made any sense. There wasnt a team here for 20 years, so millions of sports fans had to find other teams instead.
The NFL screwed up by taking the teams away in the 1990s, and now they're paying for that mistake. It can be corrected, but it won't be overnight. It's the younger fan base
that will embrace the Chargers/Rams and we know that might take 10 years or so.

Handro · #51 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:20 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by LA21st

Anyone expecting LA to love and embrace the Chargers right away doesn't know sports. If the Chargers went to Chicago and played in a soccer stadium, they're just going to be loved there? Yea, I don't see that at all. I'd imagine it'd be full of the city's transplants too.

What does Chicago have to do with this? Clearly not, as I said if LA can't do it no city can. Calm down, nobody is insulting LA.

Quote:

It's going to take years to develop the fan base, and that's what the owner is counting on. Whispers? The Owner laughs it off, and he's the only one who counts. The Chargers also play in A TEMPORARY SOCCER stadium at the moment. Let's see what happens next year when their permanment home is ready.

We'll see. Sure, in 20 years the Chargers might be a Jacksonville-level team in terms of popularity and revenue if they have a little bit of success and maybe some luck drafting superstar QB. But I think it's pretty clear ROI would be way better for a team to be introduced to a city with no current franchise than to compete with a legacy franchise as the #2 show in town. Watch Vegas embrace the Raiders way beyond what we've seen with the Chargers in LA.

LA21st · #52 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:26 PM**

It was an example. It could've been true for any city. I lived 10 years there, so...

Would they do better in San Antonio or something? Maybe, who knows. I don't think that's a given either, when I see a bunch of empty seats in places like Jacksonville and Miami.

Of course the Raiders will do better in Vegas. They've been starving for this for decades and have tons of ex LA residents. . And of course, LA people visit Vegas, which will include Raiders fans. It's a given it will be succcessful. But there's alot of reasons why. That's not a fair comparison at all.

Handro · #53 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:27 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by LA21st

It was an example. It could've been true for any city.

Right exactly, so you agree with me then.

LA21st · #54 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:34 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handro

Right exactly, so you agree with me then.

Sure, just not sure why you're taking issue with it.

I mentioned Chicago because it's a great football/sports city. But even for them, I just can't see them getting excited if you threw a new team
in they have zero connection to.

xzmattzx · #55 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:42 PM**

Is it just me, or would it have made more sense that if the Chargers moved from San Diego, that they move just halfway to Los Angeles (so not Carson) and call themselves the Southern California Chargers? A stadium could've been built in Escondido, Oceanside, Irvine, or San Clemente, for instance (assuming it got approval, for the sake of argument). Then the team is close enough to San Diego to keep those fans, and shows that it isn't going all-in with Los Angeles (including with the name), but at the same time, maybe the Chargers would get a slice of the Los Angeles TV market.

LA21st · #56 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:47 PM**

Orange County probably would've been better, sure.
But I don't think the Chargers are screwed in LA in the long run.

Handro · #57 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:54 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by LA21st

Sure, just not sure why you're taking issue with it.

I mentioned Chicago because it's a great football/sports city. But even for them, I just can't see them getting excited if you threw a new team
in they have zero connection to.

Oh, I guess I mis-understood your whole point? I was saying if LA can't handle a new team (the Chargers) then no city can. It seemed like you were arguing that the chargers are fine in LA, and threw in a "you don't know sports if you don't think so"! for good measure and compared their luck in LA to another random city as if my point was that LA specifically won't support a second franchise while another city could.

Just a mis-read on my part, I suppose.

So yea, back to my (our) original point

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handro

if LA can't handle a second franchise in the nation's most popular sport, no city can.

I wonder if the sports landscape will be different in 10 years--perhaps MLS will gain enough popularity to change the discussion.

LA21st · #58 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 5:58 PM**

Ah, got ya. Yes, I agree they'd have the same struggles. Not to say they'd struggle in another city forever, but they would be in the same boat LA is in.

You could make the casse it worked for the Baltimore Ravens, but that was in the 90s, when the two cities were far less connected than they are now. IMO, Baltimore always felt like it's own city/metro and I grew up 50 miles away. I remember NOVA residents saying "that's Baltimore's team, not ours etc".

maru2501 · #59 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 7:57 PM**

https://www.chicagotribune.com/sport...16-column.html

there is periodically chatter about a second NFL team in Chi under a dome that could host super bowls and whatnot

xzmattzx · #60 Posted **Dec 11, 2019, 8:21 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by LA21st

Ah, got ya. Yes, I agree they'd have the same struggles. Not to say they'd struggle in another city forever, but they would be in the same boat LA is in.

You could make the casse it worked for the Baltimore Ravens, but that was in the 90s, when the two cities were far less connected than they are now. IMO, Baltimore always felt like it's own city/metro and I grew up 50 miles away. I remember NOVA residents saying "that's Baltimore's team, not ours etc".

Don't forget that Baltimore had the Colts until 1984. So there is a history of separation of fan bases. In fact, many in Baltimore were "Baltimore NFL" fans before they got the Ravens. They weren't Colts fans, but they were always lobbying for a new NFL team.