CHICAGO: ORD & MDW discussion - Page 135

the urban politician · #**2681** Posted **Mar 28, 2019, 7:47 PM**

^ Yes, I realize why it has to wait 4 years.

But it's still a bummer that we have to wait so long

glowrock · #**2682** Posted **Mar 28, 2019, 8:35 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Steely Dan

^ it's like you're not even reading this thread.

several other forumers have tried informing you, but you apparently refuse to listen/comprehend.

- construction on the new global terminal can't begin until the current T2 is demolished.

- the current T2 can't be demolished until all of its 30 gates can be accommodated in a new satellite concourse that has to be designed and built first.

- the new satellite concourses aren't going to start until the T5 expansion that just started last week is finished.

what are you not understanding about the timeline of how this project has to be phased?

Kinda sucks when you've got to tear down existing terminals/concourses in order to have enough space for new ones. Even worse when you've got to first add satellite concourses before you can tear down terminals in order to build new ones!

Alas, O'Hare's not like Denver, where all they need to do is continue to add to their existing concourses, and eventually build another one parallel to the current three. The luxury of having unlimited room, eh?

Aaron (Glowrock)

ardecila · #**2683** Posted **Mar 28, 2019, 9:01 PM**

^ Well, O’Hare will have that flexibility once the new T2 is done. Plans call for up to 3 more satellite concourses to suit future growth, and the underground train will be in place.

Re staging, I don’t see how they can possibly start building T2 in 4 years if they need to wait on the T5 expansion AND the satellite concourse to happen in succession. I assume it will take around 18 months to finish design on the satellite concourse and probably another three months to mobilize a contractor. A design-build process could speed up the timeline, but I’m not sure if it’s legal under FAA and city procurement rules.

F1 Tommy · #**2684** Posted **Mar 28, 2019, 9:26 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowrock

Kinda sucks when you've got to tear down existing terminals/concourses in order to have enough space for new ones. Even worse when you've got to first add satellite concourses before you can tear down terminals in order to build new ones!

Alas, O'Hare's not like Denver, where all they need to do is continue to add to their existing concourses, and eventually build another one parallel to the current three. The luxury of having unlimited room, eh?

Aaron (Glowrock)

O'Hare's older T2 and T3 terminals are way to close together and because of that they cause a lot of ramp congestion and need an update. Denver is not that busy so not a good comparison but ATL like DEN also has a lot of space between its terminals and that helps limit ramp traffic congestion.

glowrock · #**2685** Posted **Mar 28, 2019, 11:37 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by F1 Tommy

O'Hare's older T2 and T3 terminals are way to close together and because of that they cause a lot of ramp congestion and need an update. Denver is not that busy so not a good comparison but ATL like DEN also has a lot of space between its terminals and that helps limit ramp traffic congestion.

That was kind of my point...

It's not like there's enough space at O'Hare to just build a new terminal next to the current ones. Same would be true for most of the major airports in the U.S., I would imagine. Only a few have the room to build new terminals/concourses without tearing down existing ones, and Denver's one of those.

As for traffic, while of course O'Hare's busier, it's not like Denver's exactly small. Believe it was something like 63,000,000 passenger count for 2018?

At any rate, it is obvious my somewhat facetious original comment must not have worked very well, anyhow... Heh

Aaron (Glowrock)

2PRUROCKS! · #**2686** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 12:07 AM**

I will admit that I am a little disappointed that the Calatrava team wasn't selected for T2. However Studio ORD was my second choice. I do find this competition a bit odd. I understand selecting a winner but why have the runner up design the satellites? What if a team came in 2nd based on their T2 design but their satellite design wasn't as good as others. I think the designer of the satellites should be the team that did the best design on that portion of the design not the overall runner up. I thought Calatrava had the best T2 design and Studio ORD had the best satellites design but now it would appear Studio ORD can't do the satellites. I guess I am rooting for Calatrava to do the satellites. I don't remember the satellite designs very well other than Studio ORD's and Calatrava's.

donnie · #**2687** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 3:32 AM**

Somebody having a hard time finding work in da Chi?

https://chicago.curbed.com/2019/3/28...-note#comments

Kenmore · #**2688** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 10:48 AM**

gang design looks good and lol @ jahn, what an idiot

glowrock · #**2689** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 12:29 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by donnie

Somebody having a hard time finding work in da Chi?

https://chicago.curbed.com/2019/3/28...-note#comments

Methinks Jahn needs a Snickers, it appears he's quite hangry.

Aaron (Glowrock)

Steely Dan · #**2690** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 1:37 PM**

* posts deleted *

we're NOT doing culture war stupidity in this thread.

take that shit somewhere else!

k1052 · #**2691** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 1:44 PM**

n/m

F1 Tommy · #**2692** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 2:21 PM**

Great news on Air New Zealand!!

Maybe this will push Qantas and Singapore to start direct flights to ORD faster. Singapore does have cargo 747 flights and did fly the 1 stop service via Europe with a 777 a few years ago but nothing direct. Qantas has never had direct service other than blocked seats on AA. Little by little this will eat away at the west coast hubs. The 787 and A350 are international east and west coast hub busters due to their range on Asian and African routes.

" Air New Zealand Taipei and Chicago services, which both operate thrice weekly, will be upgraded to five weekly due to significant success on the routes. The upgrades will take place from the Winter. "

https://airwaysmag.com/airlines/air-...seoul-flights/

Jim in Chicago · #**2693** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 2:47 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by glowrock

Methinks Jahn needs a Snickers, it appears he's quite hangry.

Aaron (Glowrock)

Beyond the general hissy fit, he seems focused on how closed the process was. Are competitive processes like these ever fully open? Or, do they typically get a "thank you for your submission, we'll let you know", and then at the end of the process "thank you again, we've selected someone else"?

Steely Dan · #**2694** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 2:57 PM**

studio gang wasn't my 1st choice, but i can certainly get on board with this.

source: https://www.archdaily.com/913991/stu...port-expansion

k1052 · #**2695** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 3:07 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim in Chicago

Beyond the general hissy fit, he seems focused on how closed the process was. Are competitive processes like these ever fully open? Or, do they typically get a "thank you for your submission, we'll let you know", and then at the end of the process "thank you again, we've selected someone else"?

A closed process is of course the rule, not the exception. I am entirely unsympathetic to his complaint. Really just reads like he's pissed that Gang gets to build something next to his building instead of someone HE regards as a peer.

Baronvonellis · #**2696** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 3:20 PM**

Well that looks alot better than the video. I havn't seen those renderings before, I would have like to see more detail from the others as well. I'd also like to see what the actual gate areas look like. I don't think any of the teams showed the actual gates. They just showed soaring lobby areas. I don't know if I really like that soaring giant lobby with 100 foot ceilings. It just makes you feel small and unimportant. I'd rather have a bit more intimate feel frankly.

Why don't any of them just copy famous industrial era train station designs? Everyone loves old train stations, and that would be an instant Chicago feel, something to match the L tracks downtown. Any of these designs look like they could be in any international city, and they don't say anything about being in Chicago other than the Y municipal device which is a subtle thing which most people don't know about unless your from Chicago.

Actually this reminds me of a giant mall. I just googled trees in malls and found a mall in Joliet that looks almost the same! With wood ceilings even.

http://iciinc.com/portfolio/retail/d...s-joliet-mall/

galleyfox · #**2697** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 5:01 PM**

The image that convinced me on the Studio ORD terminal is the one below when it transitions from T1 to T2. If I'm a new visitor trying to find my connecting flight and moving between terminals, this is the yellow brick road (or brown wooden ceiling) of airport navigation.

More than aesthetics or even price, wayfinding and proximity to amenities is the mark of a fine terminal.

https://mobile.twitter.com/airportar...104512/photo/1

woodrow · #**2698** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 5:16 PM**

^^WOW! Now let's see interior of T2 to T3!!! I know they are keeping the Rotunda, but I haven't seen how they will make a clean connection, a la T1 to T2

LouisVanDerWright · #**2699** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 5:23 PM**

Quote:

Originally Posted by galleyfox

The image that convinced me on the Studio ORD terminal is the one below when it transitions from T1 to T2. If I'm a new visitor trying to find my connecting flight and moving between terminals, this is the yellow brick road (or brown wooden ceiling) of airport navigation.

More than aesthetics or even price, wayfinding and proximity to amenities is the mark of a fine terminal.

https://mobile.twitter.com/airportar...104512/photo/1

That's probably what Jahn is really pissed about, Gang's terminal is going to upstage his own work...

sentinel · #**2700** Posted **Mar 29, 2019, 6:13 PM**

Some more photos from the twitter:

https://twitter.com/fly2ohare

I am personally happy as my firm is part of the winning team, and we can hopefully contribute something of significance for this project...assuming that the contract is finalized with the overall A/E team.

As for Jahn, fuck that guy. I've heard numerous horror stories about him over the years from people who've worked for him, and he's nothing but a self-absorbed, misogynistic, homophobic anti-semite. And fuck Blair Kamin for giving him a platform. I've worked with Studio Gang as a partner firm in the past and Jeannie Gange is gracious, thoughtful, extremely talented and able to provide alternative solutions to issues right on the spot. I strongly believe any backlash to her TEAM winning the competition is a perpetuation of gross, systemic misogyny in my profession.