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  #21  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 7:37 PM
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Instead of a beautiful city in Montreal or some pleasant natural scenery in the background with Vancouver, one of the windows to Canada we'll be presenting to the world will be...Edmonton?

Yeesh. Oh well, I guess you can argue that most people aren't watching the pregame shows, and are more concerned with the matches themselves.

Still though, this is confounding. Toronto and Montreal, or Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver, should be a given. And the limit, fer crissakes.

We are not a footballing nation, this much is clear.
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  #22  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 7:59 PM
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Terrible isn't it.

Maybe go for a little tour before you speak:
https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=247172





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  #23  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:06 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
Instead of a beautiful city in Montreal or some pleasant natural scenery in the background with Vancouver, one of the windows to Canada we'll be presenting to the world will be...Edmonton?

Yeesh. Oh well, I guess you can argue that most people aren't watching the pregame shows, and are more concerned with the matches themselves.

Still though, this is confounding. Toronto and Montreal, or Toronto, Montreal and Vancouver, should be a given. And the limit, fer crissakes.

We are not a footballing nation, this much is clear.
Objectively, Commonwealth Stadium is of a significantly better quality and more visually appealing to the TV audience than the FrankenStadium known as BMO Field. It's symmetric and has a much greater big league feel to it than any other outdoor stadium in the country given its nearly 60,000 seat capacity.
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  #24  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:07 PM
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You're always going to step on someone's toes, but let's be real. It's not a World Cup calibre city, and not a very interesting city generally. Certainly far from the top pick for showing off the country to the world.

Toronto, Montreal. And maybe Vancouver. That those two, or maybe three, aren't axiomatic for this is totally bizarre.
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  #25  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:10 PM
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Objectively, Commonwealth Stadium is of a significantly better quality and more visually appealing to the TV audience than the FrankenStadium known as BMO Field. It's symmetric and has a much greater big league feel to it than any other outdoor stadium in the country given its nearly 60,000 seat capacity.
Yeah, to reiterate, we're not a footballing nation. If we simply accept that, we can decline the World Cup and go on with our lives.

Obviously Toronto and Montreal will need new stadiums for this. That Montreal has pulled out and Toronto doesn't have drawings for a new football stadium...is still more evidence that we're not a footballing nation.
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  #26  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:19 PM
blueandgoldguy blueandgoldguy is offline
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Rousseau's comments remind me of Caval Kelly from 6 years ago when Edmonton hosted the inaugural game of the Women's World Cup.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/spor...ticle24817480/

Four years ago, they opened the Women's World Cup in Berlin's Olympic Stadium, the place in which Jesse Owens took the arc of sports and history and tilted it toward decency.

Inside one of the globe's most recognizable gathering places, that occasion was a spectacle – 74,000 in attendance, sold out weeks beforehand, a frenzied atmosphere. It was a priceless advertisement for Germany, which is the only sane reason anyone goes to the trouble and expense of hosting one of these things.

On Saturday, they'll open the next one in Edmonton's Commonwealth Stadium.

The arena is not famous, or suited to soccer, or attractive. Scratch that. It's actively ugly. The field is circled by a track – the perfect bush-league touch that says "high school."

In order to maintain the televised illusion of grass – the surface is artificial turf – they've haphazardly laid long, near-green carpets on the sidelines. Like your weirdo cousins do in their paved-over backyard.


The global audience is used to seeing this level of event played on landscape architecture so pristine it makes Versailles look like urban farmland. Canada's version is going to look like the house that gets cleaned by piling all the junk behind the couch.

Maybe the enthusiasm of the crowd can make up for the aesthetic shortcomings. Or maybe not. The locals don't seem all that interested. As of Thursday, the game was 5,000 seats short of a sellout according to organizers.

As an ad for the country, then, the marketing tag line of the opening match of the 2015 World Cup goes something like, "Canada: Well, you know."

What we know is where this game should be played, and why it isn't.

It should be in Toronto, where there is a very expensive, purpose-designed structure of which its proper name is the National Soccer Stadium (BMO Field).

You and I paid for it to be built. Why did we do that if it's not going to be used for the most important national soccer game that has ever been played in this country? Taxpayers got talked into buying a fridge, and now the bureaucrats want to use it as a bookshelf.

Also, there is the small matter of Edmonton. This requires some delicacy.

Edmonton, God love you. In some ways you are the romantic home of soccer in Canada. But when the whole country has to stand up in front of the rest of the world, you can't be the first one talking. We just need you to stand there quietly, looking supportive.

No, no, not in front. They'll see you. Stand behind Vancouver. No, on the other side of Montreal. All right, why don't you just crouch down behind Halifax and we'll hope everyone thinks you're Ottawa.


When England has to make a good impression, they don't spend hours debating if it should be highlighting Sunderland or Liverpool. You know, for the sake of fairness.

They go to London, straight off and every time, because that's what the world wants.

The world is going to tune in on Saturday expecting Toronto because that's the city that matters. It may hurt to hear it, but it doesn't make it less true.

This might be marginally palatable if any games of the Women's World Cup were slated to be played in the city. But there are none. Not a single element of the most important summer-sports tournament played here since the 1976 Olympics will take place in the country's largest, most cosmopolitan, most soccer-loving city.

(Words are too poor a vehicle here. Just imagine me staring at you for a long time, until one eye starts to twitch and you start to get a little afraid.)

Sure, why not? Why the hell not?

Hey, why don't we move Parliament to a parking lot in Timmins, Ont.? The next time the G8 leaders swing by, we'll take them to Rimouski, Que., and put them up in a Holiday Inn Express. Maybe the Prime Minister can start doing all televised addresses in a tank top from his garage.

If we don't care what people think of us, why don't we just give up altogether?

This outrageous oversight does allow me to write the most unlikely sentence ever printed in this newspaper: The real victim here is Toronto.

Being left out is one thing. But for all its deeds, good and otherwise, Toronto is to be punished with the Pan American Games. What are they? Who's in them? Why are they here? Good questions. Since no one plans to watch the thing, they're good questions that will never be answered.

Currently in Toronto, the Pan Ams mean one thing – a commuting apocalypse. City officials are asking people to stay off the roads for a sizable chunk of July. Another great idea.

"If you must leave your home for any reason – including childbirth and house fires – please use public transportation," they're saying, which would make sense if they'd bothered to build us any serviceable public transportation.

I suppose we should all call work and tell them we'll be staying home for those two weeks. No, we're not sick. We'll probably spend most of the time lying in a turtle pool, day drinking and alarming the neighbours. But this isn't about what we want. It's about the country.

The Pan Ams are the reason Toronto got passed over for the World Cup, a governmental scare job done by an event that didn't want even a small echo of its inconsiderable thunder stolen by a much more popular sports tournament.

It's a small national embarrassment so nitwitted, nobody wants to talk about it. But don't worry. The rest of the world won't either. They'll just think we're charmingly small-town and save their awe for countries that trumpet their biggest and brightest.
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  #27  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:26 PM
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I love Commonwealth Stadium. It's one of my favourites in the country. It's older in style but still looks big time to me.

But I can't help but be disappointed that this event isn't going to be a showcase for our biggest cities (with impressive stadiums) like it always is in other countries.

I was really hoping that this event would mark the turning of a corner for Canada.
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  #28  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:29 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
Yeah, to reiterate, we're not a footballing nation. If we simply accept that, we can decline the World Cup and go on with our lives.

Obviously Toronto and Montreal will need new stadiums for this. That Montreal has pulled out and Toronto doesn't have drawings for a new football stadium...is still more evidence that we're not a footballing nation.
I think our global rank makes that point pretty clearly.

It's an awkward situation. The city and venue that the world is most likely to be impressed by (Vancouver and BC Place) is out. So that leaves you with lively Montreal with its big obsolete mausoleum of a stadium, plain Toronto with its small frankenstadium, and plucky Edmonton which actually has a good stadium but brings out everyone's petty jealousy and insecurities (the embarrassing Kelly column being a great example) because it's not as big a city as the others.
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  #29  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I love Commonwealth Stadium. It's one of my favourites in the country. It's older in style but still looks big time to me.

But I can't help but be disappointed that this event isn't going to be a showcase for our biggest cities (with impressive stadiums) like it always is in other countries.

I was really hoping that this event would mark the turning of a corner for Canada.
It's too bad Skydome couldn't have been used as a venue. That would have had a certain glam factor. BMO looks more CPL than World Cup.

Commonwealth is a good looking stadium. It is obviously not cutting edge like the newest Euro stadiums, but it certainly fits into the global vernacular of big stadiums with tracks, which are hardly an unusual sight.
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  #30  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:32 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
I love Commonwealth Stadium. It's one of my favourites in the country. It's older in style but still looks big time to me.

But I can't help but be disappointed that this event isn't going to be a showcase for our biggest cities (with impressive stadiums) like it always is in other countries.

I was really hoping that this event would mark the turning of a corner for Canada.
I think 'turning the corner' would be an overstatement, given how FIFA 2026 is shared among three countries. Canada was always going to be in the shadow of the US and Mexico in this particular event, even if there was big buy-in from all 3 of Canada's major cities.

rousseau said it best: We're not a footballing nation. Maybe in a couple of generations as Canada changes?
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  #31  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:37 PM
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Originally Posted by blueandgoldguy View Post
Rousseau's comments remind me of Caval Kelly from 6 years ago when Edmonton hosted the inaugural game of the Women's World Cup.
He wasn't wrong. If that thing in Edmonton, and Edmonton itself, are the best we can do, then we should just shut it down right now.

Here are the stadiums in Russia where the matches were played in 2018.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2018_FIFA_World_Cup

We are not a footballing nation.
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  #32  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:39 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
...the embarrassing Kelly column being a great example...
Come again? He was spot on.

Sorry, I'm exercised because I'm watching Spain-Italy in Wembley right now. A knife-edge exciting match in the world's most prominent stadium for football (well, at least the name). Sigh...
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  #33  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:49 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
I think our global rank makes that point pretty clearly.

It's an awkward situation. The city and venue that the world is most likely to be impressed by (Vancouver and BC Place) is out. So that leaves you with lively Montreal with its big obsolete mausoleum of a stadium, plain Toronto with its small frankenstadium, and plucky Edmonton which actually has a good stadium but brings out everyone's petty jealousy and insecurities (the embarrassing Kelly column being a great example) because it's not as big a city as the others.
When buy-in was so marginal to begin with, I'm not surprised.

We're in this weird neither-nor stage right now in Canada. We'd never be able to host given the timid buy-in, so we hitched our horse to the US/Mexico. Now, we're not even sloppy seconds in the game consideration department, so spending money and putting our best foot forward is even harder to justify.

To wit: Vancouver would have had the best stadium, but bailed before it even started. Toronto settled for the secondary venue in the city, not the big guns. Now Montreal/Quebec doesn't even want to spend the money on their stadium because they don't feel it's worth it. I guess it's a nice promotion for Commonwealth and Edmonton.

The Olympics (especially the Winter ones) are more our thing. At least there's buy-in and longer benefits to them.
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  #34  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 8:50 PM
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
You're always going to step on someone's toes, but let's be real. It's not a World Cup calibre city, and not a very interesting city generally. Certainly far from the top pick for showing off the country to the world.

Toronto, Montreal. And maybe Vancouver. That those two, or maybe three, aren't axiomatic for this is totally bizarre.
considering soccer's popularity in third world shitholes, I suspect most fans and players will find Edmonton to be just like home

in all seriousness tho, Commonwealth is pretty dope. as hard as it is to believe this city EVER did something that wasn't a colossal fuckup, Commonwealth is it. nicest stadium in the country imo. even came in under budget iirc...
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  #35  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 9:43 PM
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Looking at England's path at Euro 2020 (2021), some might say that their road to the doorstep of the title match is similar to that of the Montreal Canadiens in the 2021 Stanley Cup playoffs!

Sorry for the OT.
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  #36  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 10:10 PM
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Originally Posted by rousseau View Post
Come again? He was spot on.

Sorry, I'm exercised because I'm watching Spain-Italy in Wembley right now. A knife-edge exciting match in the world's most prominent stadium for football (well, at least the name). Sigh...
It's embarrassing because it's the classic Toronto media image-obsessed take on everything. What people remember from these tournaments are the matches, the players, the winners... not stupid things like the fact that there is a track around Commonwealth Stadium (even the most casual international soccer fan will know that tracks in soccer stadiums are a common fixture in much of the world... Edmonton is hardly some kind of outlier in that regard), or that Toronto didn't host a game.

On a scale of 1 to 100, the fact that Toronto didn't host games probably registered a 2 or 3 outside of Toronto sports media circles. Maybe a 4 if you live in Cleveland and were hoping to drive up to see a game.

Toronto and BMO are closer to Edmonton and Commonwealth than they are to London and Wembley. There is nothing in Canada that even remotely resembles in soccer terms the stature of what you're seeing on TV. So to that extent it doesn't really matter all that much where the World Cup games are being played if you're holding it up against London.
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  #37  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 10:57 PM
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imo it should have been limited to Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal and 3 new soccer specific stadiums should have been built that would be utilized by the MLS teams long term.
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  #38  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 11:15 PM
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Originally Posted by esquire View Post
I thought the World Cup was going to be the pretext for Quebec to sink a pile of money into modernizing Olympic Stadium. Since that is unlikely to happen now, I wonder what that means for the Big O?
Where's the wrecking ball emoji?

Quote:
Originally Posted by goodgrowth
imo it should have been limited to Toronto, Vancouver, Montreal and 3 new soccer specific stadiums should have been built that would be utilized by the MLS teams long term.
Canada's three MLS teams don't need new stadiums.
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  #39  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 11:25 PM
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Canada's three MLS teams don't need new stadiums.
Yeah but you would be building them for 2026...not today.
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  #40  
Old Posted Jul 6, 2021, 11:36 PM
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Yeah but you would be building them for 2026...not today.
So they can sit under-utilised after 2026 while sucking up huge costs to maintain them?
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