Official Fredericton, NB projects thread

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

For the record, I am all for intensification in Devon - but it needs corresponding development in retail, commercial, infrastructure, and public space. Putting another 100-200 people in an apartment building with nothing for them to do in the neighbourhood besides get in their car and go where they actually need to be does not build a community. My fear is that Devon, a historical working-class neighbourhood, will be turned into yet another of Fredericton's myriad car-use-only residential suburbs.

I think all your concerns are addressed in the Union Street Area Secondary Municipal Plan.

[NufCed57]

Originally Posted by OliverD

I think all your concerns are addressed in the Union Street Area Secondary Municipal Plan.

I've read the plan, I was hoping to use language from it in my address to the council. They have admirable goals in the plan but they're going about it the wrong way. You don't have an integrated or walkable neighbourhood with six blocks of apartment buildings beside a strip mall. I live in South Devon and I'd drive four minutes to the liquor store instead of the 15 minute walk every time. When I lived in Toronto a 20-30 minute walk to the store was just stepping out, it was natural.

They need small stores on all the main streets- Union, Gibson, McClaren. The kind of neighbourhood they want has convenience stores between your house and the bus stop, not a Giant Tiger 20 minutes away, or a Super Store at the other end of town. They need more retail space, period.

[starburns42]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

I've read the plan, I was hoping to use language from it in my address to the council. They have admirable goals in the plan but they're going about it the wrong way. You don't have an integrated or walkable neighbourhood with six blocks of apartment buildings beside a strip mall. I live in South Devon and I'd drive four minutes to the liquor store instead of the 15 minute walk every time. When I lived in Toronto a 20-30 minute walk to the store was just stepping out, it was natural.

They need small stores on all the main streets- Union, Gibson, McClaren. The kind of neighbourhood they want has convenience stores between your house and the bus stop, not a Giant Tiger 20 minutes away, or a Super Store at the other end of town. They need more retail space, period.

Apartments built last year on union/main/etc don't have retail spaces. They should've made it mixed use eh?

[NufCed57]

Originally Posted by starburns42

Apartments built last year on union/main/etc don't have retail spaces. They should've made it mixed use eh?

That would have been my goal. We don't need more shopping malls or 'retail zones', but you could overhaul the image of the neighbourhood in a hurry if the ground floor of these buildings was pharmacies and grocers and bakeries on the sidewalk, with parking lots behind, instead of more endless blocks of parking lots and corrugated-steel and vinyl siding apartment buildings. It only really bothers me because Devon is one of the last mostly-intact working-class neighbourhoods in the city, and it's going to be transformed into another apartment building suburb like the rest of the North side.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

I've read the plan, I was hoping to use language from it in my address to the council. They have admirable goals in the plan but they're going about it the wrong way. You don't have an integrated or walkable neighbourhood with six blocks of apartment buildings beside a strip mall. I live in South Devon and I'd drive four minutes to the liquor store instead of the 15 minute walk every time. When I lived in Toronto a 20-30 minute walk to the store was just stepping out, it was natural.

So you're saying that the issue in Devon is not the distance to the store? Walking along Union is admittedly not the most comfortable walk – is that what you're referring to? Coincidentally I'm a 15 minute walk to the liquor store on York and unless I'm running other errands my default is to walk it.

Originally Posted by starburns42

Apartments built last year on union/main/etc don't have retail spaces. They should've made it mixed use eh?

The ones at the bottom of Douglas have a phase two component that has commercial space. The new building beside A&W, the one being built at the west end of Main Street, and the one being proposed next to New England Pizza are all mixed-use.

Originally Posted by NufCed57

That would have been my goal. We don't need more shopping malls or 'retail zones', but you could overhaul the image of the neighbourhood in a hurry if the ground floor of these buildings was pharmacies and grocers and bakeries on the sidewalk, with parking lots behind, instead of more endless blocks of parking lots and corrugated-steel and vinyl siding apartment buildings. It only really bothers me because Devon is one of the last mostly-intact working-class neighbourhoods in the city, and it's going to be transformed into another apartment building suburb like the rest of the North side.

The city has already prescribed that kind of development along Main/Union. If that's what developers have to build along that corridor there's no way that Devon will resemble places like Brookside Drive or Bishop Heights.

I think the biggest issue here is that these retail operations require a critical mass of people to be successful. And it's easier to add to the population first. The city can't be strong-arming developers into including commercial components in every development because then they simply won't build in Devon.

Interesting piece about this very issue: https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/...?rq=Storefront

I think Devon is on the right track, as long as the city sticks to its plan. I used to own a house in Devon and I really enjoyed living there. It's really the only Fredericton neighbourhood I'd want to live in aside from downtown.

[NufCed57]

Originally Posted by OliverD

So you're saying that the issue in Devon is not the distance to the store? Walking along Union is admittedly not the most comfortable walk – is that what you're referring to? Coincidentally I'm a 15 minute walk to the liquor store on York and unless I'm running other errands my default is to walk it.

To be honest, I'm not terribly sure what the difference is - I just know that I've lived in other places (ranging from Sackville to Toronto) where walking felt natural, even if it took 20-30 minutes to get somewhere, and living in Devon and going to Giant Tiger or whatever feels like a drive to me.

Originally Posted by OliverD

The ones at the bottom of Douglas have a phase two component that has commercial space. The new building beside A&W, the one being built at the west end of Main Street, and the one being proposed next to New England Pizza are all mixed-use.

I was under the impression the one by New England Pizza was going to be another apartment building? Do you have alternate information? I can't seem to find anything to the contrary. Honestly a few more properties farther up Union toward Gibson would calm me down a bit lol.

Originally Posted by OliverD

The city has already prescribed that kind of development along Main/Union. If that's what developers have to build along that corridor there's no way that Devon will resemble places like Brookside Drive or Bishop Heights.

Is that in the Union St. Plan? What I've seen in it has the current zoning basically unchanged.

Originally Posted by OliverD

Interesting piece about this very issue: https://www.strongtowns.org/journal/...?rq=Storefront

I think Devon is on the right track, as long as the city sticks to its plan. I used to own a house in Devon and I really enjoyed living there. It's really the only Fredericton neighbourhood I'd want to live in aside from downtown.

Honestly, thanks for that article, it's very helpful to understanding the need for population before a diversifying business community.

[Matzel_27]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

I've read the plan, I was hoping to use language from it in my address to the council. They have admirable goals in the plan but they're going about it the wrong way. You don't have an integrated or walkable neighbourhood with six blocks of apartment buildings beside a strip mall. I live in South Devon and I'd drive four minutes to the liquor store instead of the 15 minute walk every time. When I lived in Toronto a 20-30 minute walk to the store was just stepping out, it was natural.

They need small stores on all the main streets- Union, Gibson, McClaren. The kind of neighbourhood they want has convenience stores between your house and the bus stop, not a Giant Tiger 20 minutes away, or a Super Store at the other end of town. They need more retail space, period.

I love your idea. Sadly, the mom-and-pop stores are closing everywhere in favor of the Giant Tigers and other larger stores. How can the city reverse that trend? There needs to be a business case to be made for the small stores. I don't see many opening, unless they have a gas bar attached.

Maybe the issue is a bit of a chicken-and-egg equation. Do you have workplaces first and build housing after or the other way around?

[Matzel_27]

Originally Posted by OliverD

The ones at the bottom of Douglas have a phase two component that has commercial space. The new building beside A&W, the one being built at the west end of Main Street, and the one being proposed next to New England Pizza are all mixed-use.

The new building beside A&W in particular has a lot of empty space in the commercial street level. I think that illustrates that the area does not really support that type of development at this time. No developer wants to sit on a newly finished development for years before finally leasing it.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by NufCed57

To be honest, I'm not terribly sure what the difference is - I just know that I've lived in other places (ranging from Sackville to Toronto) where walking felt natural, even if it took 20-30 minutes to get somewhere, and living in Devon and going to Giant Tiger or whatever feels like a drive to me.

The parking lots along Union certainly don't help that.

Originally Posted by NufCed57

I was under the impression the one by New England Pizza was going to be another apartment building? Do you have alternate information? I can't seem to find anything to the contrary. Honestly a few more properties farther up Union toward Gibson would calm me down a bit lol.

From the Jan 25 city council package:

Rezone from District Commercial Zone (DC) to Commercial Corridor Zone One (COR-1) to permit a 6-storey mixed use building with 41 residential units

Originally Posted by NufCed57

Is that in the Union St. Plan? What I've seen in it has the current zoning basically unchanged.

Some items of note in the plan:

Council recognizes the future redevelopment potential of the Devon Park Shopping Plaza site and will support residential redevelopment opportunities to a maximum of 4 storeys together with appropriate commercial uses at the ground floor street level that are intended to primarily serve the adjacent residential neighborhoods. Any new building, or buildings on this site, will be required to emphasize high quality building design and pedestrian linkages by incorporatingpedestrianscalelighting,signageandlandscaping. Redevelopmentproposals will be subject to a development application and review by the Design Review Subcommittee.

Council shall discourage the expansion of the Union Street secondary commercial area and will encourage new development that incorporates a mixed residential component.

Large scale new development or large redevelopment projects will be encouraged to include a residential component.

Council shall encourage the redevelopment of vacant properties with uses that are compatible with surrounding land uses and shall discourage stand alone parking lots.

Reduced parking standards will be considered and implemented through future zoning initiatives to encourage compact mixed use development.

All surface parking areas will be located in the side and rear yards. Front yard parking will be considered only for sites with unique site conditions.

All parking areas visible from Union Street will be screened from public view through landscaped buffers, low architectural screened walls or decorative fencing.

New development, particularly in residential areas, will be encouraged to provide vehicle parking at the side or rear of the principal structures. In addition, when it is practical given the site conditions, all loading bays associated with commercial activities shall be located at the rear or the side of any new development.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Matzel_27

The new building beside A&W in particular has a lot of empty space in the commercial street level. I think that illustrates that the area does not really support that type of development at this time. No developer wants to sit on a newly finished development for years before finally leasing it.

Right – probably best to concentrate on building the population first.

[Freddypop]

Originally Posted by Matzel_27

The new building beside A&W in particular has a lot of empty space in the commercial street level. I think that illustrates that the area does not really support that type of development at this time. No developer wants to sit on a newly finished development for years before finally leasing it.

That building next to A & W has a large portion that is currently being retrofitted to be the new and permanent Northside Market. It is due to open in late March/early April. It will be close to being full at that time

[Matzel_27]

Originally Posted by Freddypop

That building next to A & W has a large portion that is currently being retrofitted to be the new and permanent Northside Market. It is due to open in late March/early April. It will be close to being full at that time

I am glad to hear that and hope the market will do great. The developer will be happy to finally collect rent on the space, but he'll never recoup the revenue lost while it was sitting empty for a long time after being finished.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Matzel_27

I am glad to hear that and hope the market will do great. The developer will be happy to finally collect rent on the space, but he'll never recoup the revenue lost while it was sitting empty for a long time after being finished.

If you're going to build something like that you kind of need to expect it to remain vacant for a bit. Hopefully once it's fully leased he can start construction of the townhouses at the back of the property.

[OliverD]

On next month's PAC agenda:

- 616-618 Union Street: Rezone from District Commercial Zone (DC) to Commercial Corridor Zone One (COR-1) to permit a 6-storey mixed use building with 41 residential units (deferred from last month)

- 891 Riverside Drive: R-2 amendment. Not sure what exactly this is about.

- 184 Woodstock Road: Amend the Institutional Zone One (I-1) in order to permit a drop-in community centre and 9 supported housing units (assisted living)

- Lian Street & Langille Drive (extensions): Rezone portions of PID 75492850 from Future Development Zone (FD) to Residential Zone One Narrow (R- 1N), to Multi- Residential Zone Four (MR-4), and to Multi- Residential Zone Two (MR-2). That PID runs across the back of the current Bishop Heights neighbourhood. Guessing this will consist of a new street, possibly a court off of Langille for the R-1N lot and an extension of Lian for the multi-residential lots.

Fun fact: Between 2012-2019, 58 single family homes were built in this neighbourhood. In 2020, construction was started on 37 single family homes. Crazy.

[Justin6463]

There’s a small crane up at the new apartment site on Beaverbrook and I noticed they were clearing the lot along Waterloo where the new micro apartments is going.

[OliverD]

Originally Posted by Justin6463

There’s a small crane up at the new apartment site on Beaverbrook and I noticed they were clearing the lot along Waterloo where the new micro apartments is going.

Nice, I was thinking that project might have been dead in the water.

There's some signage up at the bottom of High Point Blvd. showing a site plan for that property. It includes three apartment buildings plus a "wellness centre". I believe the wellness centre is being constructed now as there is a smaller steel frame building going up in addition to an apartment building. Then there's another apartment building with construction well under way across the street.

There's also another apartment under construction on Brianna Drive that looks like it may be similar in configuration to the six-storey one down the street (which is actually parking + five levels). The lot looks big enough to hold two buildings.

[OliverD]

Fredericton Sees A Sharp Rise In Demand For Residential Building Construction

[FreddyGuy]

Confirmed- one of the new commercial buildings in the Hanwell industrial park that I had questioned in a prior post is indeed the new torque motorsports. Looks to be a sizable dealership.

[cj6286]

A little throwback. Westmorland Street Bridge circa 1981(?)

[OliverD]

Fredericton hopes bonus incentives attract affordable housing development

Battilana says the city is hoping to add to the bonus incentives under the zoning bylaw and that those plans will be made public at the next Planning Advisory Committee on March 17.