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  #61  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2014, 8:11 PM
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Jon Dalton Jon Dalton is offline
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Originally Posted by fizzle View Post
And some of the ideas...Shoppers, Walmart, etc., are pretty hilarious.
Why?

As I mentioned I'm not a fan of Walmart, but I should have chosen my words more carefully: I f*%#ing HATE Walmart. I don't want to see them here.

However, I can imagine them both wanting to and being successful at it. They're building stores everywhere and have somewhat embraced the urban format, and they have no presence downtown. There are a lot of people walking around with not much money and not many options for general retail.

I hope you're right though, and Walmart does not move downtown.

Shoppers Drug Mart has already invested in a big store near downtown at Cannon and Wellington. I don't think they would open a new one in Kresge's as it is large even for them and close to their existing store. Drug stores are not a rarity here either.

Rona would be awesome but they are losing money. Their management structure has been a disaster and franchises are sinking. One can dream though. Any building supply store there would be great.
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  #62  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2014, 8:30 PM
coalminecanary coalminecanary is offline
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I chose rona since they are canadian and would be preferable to the big orange or blue american guys - and would capture a specific market there rather than trying to compete with the big boxes.

But yes, any building supply place open til 9pm would be a huge benefit - even better if they offered inexpensive deliveries within the core
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  #63  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2014, 9:11 PM
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Rumor on the street is that Nordstrom is interested in the property, which would be AMAZING for downtown. I heard from a friend who's father is one of the organizers for the festival of friends, so it's kind of a decent source?

Either way, it'd be nice for the building to return to it's department store roots. I don't think a store like that would hurt the local businesses either.
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  #64  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2014, 10:09 PM
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Originally Posted by fizzle View Post
I think sometimes the ideas don't look beyond the initial excitement. If it was such a slam dunk to have a grocery store or a big SDM in a space like that, don't you think those companies would be all over it already?

So until that day comes, ANY business that wants to invest should be welcomed with open arms. Who am I to dictate what 'belongs' downtown and what doesn't? I'm not risking my money. I get a bit riled up when so much disdain is out there is all.

The ideas are often very good, but veer pretty closely to gentrification oftentimes. But it's ok, because those people can find cheap housing by the husk of Stelco, right?

Delta Bingo has had a stigma associated with it for YEARS, and for what reason? Because it doesn't make downtown look like Queen West in Toronto? Because it's entertainment for older folks? Poorer folks?

I'm a firm believer in housing first, and the rest will follow. No one will invest dollars into high population density business without high population density. And that population density needs to be inclusive of current residents. City Hall should be incentivizing the hell out of mixed use commercial/residential development, and full day service out of the train station should be priority number one for the city. Heck, there should be more train stations in the city extending east, serving the entire city.

But I've rambled now.
Fair to say that we all want housing in the core. Not just affordable housing, but luxury housing and family dwellings.

The problem is a chicken/egg one. How are you going to convince people to live downtown without adequate existing facilities? Grocery stores, drug stores, schools, etc.

There are a slew of condo developments in the planning stages, and hopefully these and more come to fruition.

One thing is certain though. A SDM or urban Sobeys is going to draw a lot more interest than a bingo hall.
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  #65  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2014, 11:09 PM
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One of my friends's family runs Grandad's donuts, and she said that they're finally getting their stuff back from the owner, who she refers to as a "Drunk and a cheat, who owes us about 20,000 dollars"

Yikes
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  #66  
Old Posted Jan 17, 2014, 11:10 PM
thistleclub thistleclub is offline
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Originally Posted by davidcappi View Post
Rumor on the street is that Nordstrom is interested in the property
Methinks someone is having a laugh.

Nordstrom’s flagship Canadian locations will include four in Ontario: Ottawa’s Rideau Centre (opening Spring 2015) and Toronto’s Yorkdale Centre (opening Fall 2016) and Sherway Gardens (opening Spring 2017) as well as the former Sears space in the Eaton Centre (opening Fall 2016).

The Globe & Mail reports that "Nordstrom and Saks also plan to open their lower price chains, Nordstrom Rack and Saks Off Fifth, to bolster their presence in Canada," and those might be more plausible but I suspect they will still go to conventional malls (eg. Mapleview Centre or Lime Ridge Mall) as is their tendency.
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Last edited by thistleclub; Jan 18, 2014 at 12:52 PM.
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  #67  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2014, 12:47 AM
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maybe this will be their expansion of their Nordstrom rack discount line? By the time you hear about the openings it's probably 2-3 years out from the actual decision, so not implausible that they would eye this for a next phase.
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  #68  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2014, 4:29 AM
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Originally Posted by oldcoote View Post
Fair to say that we all want housing in the core. Not just affordable housing, but luxury housing and family dwellings.

The problem is a chicken/egg one. How are you going to convince people to live downtown without adequate existing facilities? Grocery stores, drug stores, schools, etc.

There are a slew of condo developments in the planning stages, and hopefully these and more come to fruition.

One thing is certain though. A SDM or urban Sobeys is going to draw a lot more interest than a bingo hall.
Here's the thing- I don't think they're mutually exclusive. You're right in that it's hard to know what should come first. If you just slot a bunch of stores that exist everywhere else in the city downtown, nothing will happen. Why do the Smiths who live on Hamilton mountain come downtown to visit Walmart? Heck, why do the Jones who live downtown walk to Walmart when it's far easier to just bundle up into the car and drive to a big box version where they can load everything in and have a driveway to driveway experience.

I look at different neighborhoods in Toronto as great examples. The St. Lawrence Market neighborhood is obviously anchored by the market, but also has a huge amount of residential space side by side, and oftentimes right on top of existing commercial applications. The Danforth is really similar to, but with housing instead of condos.

The 95 King East project is EXACTLY the type of thing the core needs. With commercial space instead of artsy space on the bottom level. Don't get me wrong, there is room for the artsy stuff too! Imagine someone taking, let's say the corner of King and James, opposite of the Jackson Square entrance, and building a 20 story residential tower there. Modern, clean, commercial space underneath (that grocery store you're talking about). Instant 400-500 new residents downtown. Easy to market (crazy proximity to GO for commuters), in a ridiculously pretty neighborhood. Think big.

Going back to the original purpose of my rant. I don't think a bingo hall is out of place in scenarios like this. It's a business like any other. It gets magnified when it's surrounded by dollar stores and more dollar stores, but realistically it doesn't hurt anything by existing, even on the main drag. It drives traffic to the core, it brings people in who would otherwise not visit, and it gives local business a reason to exist outside of existing residents. I don't want a King Street that looks like Yorkville any more than I want a King Street that looks like..umm King Street. The beauty of the city is that it's not Toronto, and those two opposite ends of the spectrum can actually co-exist.
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  #69  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2014, 10:47 AM
bornagainbiking bornagainbiking is offline
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A 24 hour Gym.

Has anyone thought of a 24 hour gym. Essentially a simple conversion. Overlooking the Core with 24 hour movement. Eyes on the city. one way glass look out and mirror on outside to prevent looking in.
I believe there would be some spin offs. Sporting goods, Running room health food and supplements.
A nice addition to the concept of condos in the core.
This could be the retail on the ground level with offices or residential on the second floor.
Could be a new alternative to the dungeon gym in Jackson Sq.
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  #70  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2014, 6:07 PM
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The Spectator's View: What will replace Delta Bingo downtown?

We should all empathize with the clients of Delta Bingo, many of whom use the comparatively benign form of gambling as social networking and affordable entertainment. Once Delta closes this weekend, those clients are in for a long drive or ride to get their bingo fix.

That's unfortunate, but not surprising. The clock has been ticking on bingo since the advent of slots.

On the plus side, Delta's closure puts the former Kresge building in play in the downtown redevelopment puzzle. By all accounts the 84-year-old building is in decent shape. What should go there? Obviously the property owner will have a lot to say about that, but so should the ward councillor — in this case Jason Farr — and downtown redevelopment stakeholders in general. Will the prime real estate at King and Hughson be a sought-after gem?

There's no appetite for new gambling activities downtown, and happily that doesn't appear to be in the cards. But many other uses are being suggested, including a postsecondary campus and creative arts facility. We prefer a use that generates tax revenue, which requires a private-sector player. Regardless, here's another interesting story in an election year.

http://www.thespec.com/opinion-story...ngo-downtown-/
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  #71  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2014, 7:15 PM
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I work in e-gaming and I'm pretty sure you're not going to see it in Hamilton for quite a while.
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  #72  
Old Posted Jan 18, 2014, 7:46 PM
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While a children's museum, and campus are good ideas, I'd prefer something with night time activity, restaurant, bar, music venue, performances, etc...

Something that would produce nightlife and lottsa lights at night!
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  #73  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2014, 7:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fizzle View Post
The happiness about what seemed to be a viable business shutting down, just because it's not something people on this board like, kind of bothers me. And some of the ideas...Shoppers, Walmart, etc., are pretty hilarious.

Clearly, people liked going to the thing. It doesn't exist as long as it did unless that was the case. I get a real sense of elitism reading comments on here sometimes. That only 'certain' types of people and business should be in the 'new' downtown, and anything but organic supermarkets and art galleries cheapens everything.

Did I like Delta Bingo? God no. But it filled a large space downtown and DID being people to the core. And I don't see other big business rushing in during the last 20 years to fill a commercial vacancy like they did.
One could easily apply the same kinds of arguments for Show World.

I take your points... it did bring people to the core, and it has been a long-serving business that has paid taxes. But on the other hand, I'm not sure any other downtown businesses benefited much from the presence of the bingo hall, aside from the Tim Hortons across the street - money the patrons brought with them likely stayed in the bingo, and winnings probably went home with the winners (which is one of the knocks against a downtown casino).

As for posters here, I can't agree there's an elitist attitude. I think just about everyone genuinely wants the best for downtown, though some have different ideas about it than others. Sometimes there is sarcasm, but I think that is warranted given the history of downtown and the failed redevelopment schemes and unfulfilled proposals.

There are certain types of businesses that would be much more attractive for prime downtown sites like this one - businesses that create pedestrian traffic and demand for other neighbouring business. As others have noted, an anchor retailer is one idea, a college or university mini-campus might be another (all-day use, not primarily evening classes), or convert it to employment space for some other productive enterprise. Whether it could be done with this structure I don't know, but adding a couple of floors of quality lofts while keeping the base for commercial purposes would be great too. There are plenty of ways this building could be better used than it was.

Last edited by ScreamingViking; Jan 21, 2014 at 9:11 AM.
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  #74  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2014, 8:58 PM
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finally, it was about time.
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  #75  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2014, 8:14 AM
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Any intel on what's going on here? It still says the building is for lease.
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  #76  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2014, 3:46 PM
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A couple of weekends ago, I was visiting family who live on the mountain. On the way home, I decided I would stay on the bus past my usual transfer point and get off at King on the north side of Gore Park and walk east along King to check out the shops. Imagine my surprise when the bus turned into the south lane of King off from John and zipped merrily past Gore Park. It didn't stop until I was at the terminal at MacNab and Main.

Apparantly the mountain bus routes no longer stop along King between John and James. I don't see why they can't stop in the bus only lane at Hughson and cross to MacNab terminal, like the King bus does. I guess now, if you live on the mountain and want to go downtown, you have to get off either at John and Jackson or Main and MacNab then hoof it from there to Gore Park. I guess I am an old stalwart who still considers Gore Park the proper downtown. The shops along King between John and James must love this change in traffic flow. This could very well be part of the reason why the old Kresge's/Delta Bingo remains vacant. If the mountain bus traffic is bypassing Gore Park and dropping all their riders in front of a climate-controlled mall, why even walk this stretch anymore?
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  #77  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2014, 5:05 PM
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Originally Posted by markbarbera View Post
A couple of weekends ago, I was visiting family who live on the mountain. On the way home, I decided I would stay on the bus past my usual transfer point and get off at King on the north side of Gore Park and walk east along King to check out the shops. Imagine my surprise when the bus turned into the south lane of King off from John and zipped merrily past Gore Park. It didn't stop until I was at the terminal at MacNab and Main.

Apparantly the mountain bus routes no longer stop along King between John and James. I don't see why they can't stop in the bus only lane at Hughson and cross to MacNab terminal, like the King bus does. I guess now, if you live on the mountain and want to go downtown, you have to get off either at John and Jackson or Main and MacNab then hoof it from there to Gore Park. I guess I am an old stalwart who still considers Gore Park the proper downtown. The shops along King between John and James must love this change in traffic flow. This could very well be part of the reason why the old Kresge's/Delta Bingo remains vacant. If the mountain bus traffic is bypassing Gore Park and dropping all their riders in front of a climate-controlled mall, why even walk this stretch anymore?
From my recollection these stores wanted the buses out of Gore park. They got what they asked for. As for hoofing it from the MacNab terminal it's only a block away.
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  #78  
Old Posted Sep 17, 2014, 7:56 PM
movingtohamilton movingtohamilton is offline
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Originally Posted by davidcappi View Post
Any intel on what's going on here? It still says the building is for lease.
I'd love to know what's happening with this property. It could be a great location for stores attracting customers from the condos being built in the area.

I'll speculate that the lack of a tenant has much to do with the proposed rent, leasehold improvement costs, and the current state of the surrounding neighbourhood. But that's just my best guess.
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  #79  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 6:14 PM
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Conceptual Redevelopment Rendering:

Source
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  #80  
Old Posted Sep 22, 2014, 6:54 PM
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I prefer the original look. Would love to see it restored.



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