Ontario culture shock

[Sarah89]

If you leave Toronto for a small mid sized city like Kitchener or one of the smaller towns it tends to be an enormous shock. It's also startling how white most of these smaller cities are despite years upon years of encouragement of diversity. Two hugely different worlds.

[kwoldtimer]

The issue being?

[Sarah89]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

The issue being?

These worlds are going to reach into each other eventually with people looking for cheaper places to live. How is this going to work out? big clash?

You have city people and a diverse group of immigrants versus simple minded Caucasian hosers.

[Dengler Avenue]

If Kitchener’s too much for you, come to Waterloo.
Just saying though, I hate the light pollution in the university district.

Tbh, I’m not too concerned about mid-sized cities in Southern Ontario, i.e. Windsor, London. Anything smaller sees a lot less diversity (even in “cities” like Sarnia and Woodstock). In Northern Ontario, lol it’s a different kind of diversity.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by Sarah89

You have city people and a diverse group of immigrants versus simple minded Caucasian hosers.

As a 'simple minded' Canadian hoser you speak of living in one of those cities, your sneering attitude towards anything that doesn't align with your worldview (your opinion that all Americans are rednecks - do you even know any of them personally?, your self-hatred about the Canadian accent, etc.) says more about you than it does about others.

Once upon a time, Toronto was a city of mostly white people. It managed to become multicultural city without many problems.

The people of London, Kingston and Sudbury have visited real cities too. It's not like we're stuck in some North Korean village, isolated from contact with the world. Amazingly, I've had non-white friends (*gasp*) in some of these cities too and if you treat them like people, there tends not to be much issue. Sure, some of our less enlightened population will be jerks, but it's not as if our largest cities are free of racist idiots either.

It's the snotty attitude of superiority from liberal-uppity types that's much more galling. People who've never wandered past the municipal boundaries of our largest cities in Canada but claim to be in touch with ordinary Canadians. People who've never left the sheltered existence of upper-class suburbia and think they know it all because they live in a big city and they vaguely interact with someone with a different skin-tone (Oh, my cleaning lady is from Bangladesh and that means I'm just sooo multiculturally on the cutting edge) they're just superior to the rest of us.

Their attitude pisses me off.

[Sarah89]

Originally Posted by wave46

As a 'simple minded' Canadian hoser you speak of living in one of those cities, your sneering attitude towards anything that doesn't align with your worldview (your opinion that all Americans are rednecks - do you even know any of them personally?, your self-hatred about the Canadian accent, etc.) says more about you than it does about others.

Once upon a time, Toronto was a city of mostly white people. It managed to become multicultural city without many problems.

The people of London, Kingston and Sudbury have visited real cities too. It's not like we're stuck in some North Korean village, isolated from contact with the world. Amazingly, I've had non-white friends (*gasp*) in some of these cities too and if you treat them like people, there tends not to be much issue. Sure, some of our less enlightened population will be jerks, but it's not as if our largest cities are free of racist idiots either.

It's the snotty attitude of superiority from liberal-uppity types that's much more galling. People who've never wandered past the municipal boundaries of our largest cities in Canada but claim to be in touch with ordinary Canadians. People who've never left the sheltered existence of upper-class suburbia and think they know it all because they live in a big city and they vaguely interact with someone with a different skin-tone (Oh, my cleaning lady is from Bangladesh and that means I'm just sooo multiculturally on the cutting edge) they're just superior to the rest of us.

Their attitude pisses me off.

I am far from uppity. And I was using ''hoser'' in a joking way.

There is a big contrast between big city and small town Canada though. Oh, and I don't have ''self hatred'' about the accent - I have tried to accept it.

[vid]

Christ, I hope you never find yourself in Thunder Bay. Do you know how hard it is to find a good shish taouk in this town?????

Honestly though you remind me of those people that respond to my sexual orientation with "but you don't look gay!?"

[lio45]

Originally Posted by vid

Christ, I hope you never find yourself in Thunder Bay. Do you know how hard it is to find a good shish taouk in this town?????

The only food I ever had in Thunder Bay was from the McDonald's on Red River Road. It was average (for McDonald's).

[vid]

Originally Posted by lio45

The only food I ever had in Thunder Bay was from the McDonald's on Red River Road. It was average (for McDonald's).

I'm sure McDonalds find that very reassuring!


Seriously though I ran out of fenugreek just as the pandemic hit. FML.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by Sarah89

I am far from uppity. And I was using ''hoser'' in a joking way.

There is a big contrast between big city and small town Canada though. Oh, and I don't have ''self hatred'' about the accent - I have tried to accept it.

Were you using 'simple minded' in a joking way too? It sure didn't come off that way. It sounds more pejorative than anything; try calling a coworker 'simple minded' and see the reaction you get.

Yes, there is some difference between big city Canada and small town Canada. However, that gulf isn't what it was 30-50 years ago on both sides.

The average Canadian is more worldly - even if they haven't left this country - as they've probably experienced different cultures in our largest cities. The children of immigrants are fairly Canadianized too as they straddle between the culture of the old country and the new one. I'm not arguing that it's going to be a perfect transition, but the culture clash isn't what it would have been circa 1950-1970.

While it is often imagined that immigrants are more 'progressive', there might be a reverse culture clash - many immigrants have much more socially conservative views than the average 'hoser' about many topics such as homosexuality, living together unmarried, etc. etc.

Immigration has been lumped in with 'progressive' causes for several decades, so I could see why people conflate the idea.

[Loco101]

Originally Posted by Sarah89

I am far from uppity. And I was using ''hoser'' in a joking way.

There is a big contrast between big city and small town Canada though. Oh, and I don't have ''self hatred'' about the accent - I have tried to accept it.

I'm getting the feeling that you've only visited select small towns in Southern Ontario.

How about Moosonee. It's a town and over 85% of its population is not Caucasian.

[kwoldtimer]

Other than establishing that Toronto is a provincial demographic outlier, I'm still not sure what the point of this thread is supposed to be.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Other than establishing that Toronto is a provincial demographic outlier, I'm still not sure what the point of this thread is supposed to be.

In spite of conventional wisdom that leans to the contrary, at least Ottawa isn't really that much of a shock compared to Toronto. Going in either direction IMO.

The most noticeable demographic difference between the two cities is probably the amount of French heard of the streets.

[wave46]

Originally Posted by kwoldtimer

Other than establishing that Toronto is a provincial demographic outlier, I'm still not sure what the point of this thread is supposed to be.

I speculate it was to show how 'progressive' our big cities are and how 'backwards' our smaller towns are, by implying that sophisticated immigrants would not easily blend in with the 'simple minded Caucasian hosers' of those places.

You know, because small-town Canadians have never seen someone with a different skin-tone, culture, or whatever.

It mostly came off as a big-city attempt to piss on smaller places - but again, that's speculation.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Sarah89

These worlds are going to reach into each other eventually with people looking for cheaper places to live. How is this going to work out? big clash?

You have city people and a diverse group of immigrants versus simple minded Caucasian hosers.

Works out just fine. Exactly as it did when the GTA suburbs got more non-white residents moving in.

[swimmer_spe]

I lived in North Bay most of my childhood life. Moving to London, ON in high school was a culture shock. I don't doubt someone moving from a bigger city to a smaller city or even a town can find it a culture shock.

[Marshsparrow]

Stay in TO... the rest of Ontario will thank u...

[xzmattzx]

Isn't most of Canada white? There aren't things like the Black Belt and large Hispanic areas like the US has. Vancouver is your version of California, with Chinese and Asians in general.


On another note, I've noticed more and more Portuguese and Brazilians coming to the beach in Port Colborne in recent years. I don't know if they are considered minority or not. They are not WASPs, at least. That seems to reflect a change in the times in a couple ways. First, it shows the types of people from the Toronto area. Second, it shows how the Canadian beaches near Buffalo are now playplaces for Canadians, instead of for Americans like they were 20-30 years ago.

[swimmer_spe]

Originally Posted by xzmattzx

Isn't most of Canada white? There aren't things like the Black Belt and large Hispanic areas like the US has. Vancouver is your version of California, with Chinese and Asians in general.


On another note, I've noticed more and more Portuguese and Brazilians coming to the beach in Port Colborne in recent years. I don't know if they are considered minority or not. They are not WASPs, at least. That seems to reflect a change in the times in a couple ways. First, it shows the types of people from the Toronto area. Second, it shows how the Canadian beaches near Buffalo are now playplaces for Canadians, instead of for Americans like they were 20-30 years ago.

That is a naive statement. Most of the GTA ad Vancouver are definitely not "white". In fact, some parts, 'white' is the minority. Even in many of the smaller cities, there is a good mix of "not white" races.

[Proof Sheet]

Originally Posted by Acajack

In spite of conventional wisdom that leans to the contrary, at least Ottawa isn't really that much of a shock compared to Toronto. Going in either direction IMO.

The most noticeable demographic difference between the two cities is probably the amount of French heard of the streets.

And lack of good shawarma in Toronto. I agree it is rare to hear french in Toronto....