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  #3021  
Old Posted Mar 26, 2021, 6:31 PM
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Western access requires an underground people mover, but based on the phasing of new terminals I don't think they will add a people mover until the 2nd satellite terminal opens, which might not be until the mid 2030s.

T2 is landside and the 1st satellite will be directly connected to T1's remote concourse. You don't really need the people mover until the 2nd satellite comes online. At that point I imagine they would just continue digging the tunnel to the west and build a small, temporary check-in facility (pickup/dropoffs only, no checked bags). Basically just a few electronic kiosks for each airline and then a security screening.
Daily Herald has an update on the Elgin-Ohare-West Bypass project. Work on the interchange of IL-390 and I-490 should begin this year, at the corner of York and Thorndale Roads. This will include some ramp stubs for a future western terminal.

Once the Tollway builds access ramps over the UP rail line there, the city is prepared to build a parking lot and screening facility for employees only (probably with a bus connection to terminals, hangars and other facilities).

https://www.dailyherald.com/news/202...burban-driving
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  #3022  
Old Posted Mar 27, 2021, 2:04 PM
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^ Itsa massive crazy project. Simultaneously running an international airport that is one of the busiest in both categories of Pax AND Cargo, reconfiguring And adding new terminals AND runways, building new control towers, realigning multiple rail lines AND rail yards, rebuilding AND adding new tollways on ALL sides. Adding a new western access that includes new local roadways AND utilities.
Any questions on how and why Chicago economy is emerging from pandemic-L00K HERE!
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  #3023  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 2:43 PM
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Terminal 5 Expansion Completion Date (Theory)

I think I have a new theory for when the Terminal 5 expansion will be completed.

So you know how Delta currently operates out of Terminal 2, but usually only uses regional jets, A220s, and Boeing 717s because the gates they have are only for smaller aircraft? Well, once Delta moves to Terminal 5, they will have access to bigger gates that can support bigger narrow bodies and even a gate for a wide body. This image below shows Terminal 5 after renovations, and all of the orange planes represent Delta's new gates.



So I went on Google Flights and played around with dates, and noticed that Delta started switching the regional jets, B717s and A220s with A319s, A320s, B737s, and even a decent amount of A321s staring June 5th. Even the short routes like Minneapolis show that the regional jets have been switched to bigger aircraft. So I wonder if by then, the Terminal 5 expansion will be complete and Delta would've moved there so that they have gates to operate the bigger narrow bodies.

So could June 5th be the target completion date for the Terminal 5 expansion?

Last edited by jonesrmj; Mar 29, 2021 at 2:55 PM.
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  #3024  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 3:10 PM
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Originally Posted by jonesrmj View Post
I think I have a new theory for when the Terminal 5 expansion will be completed.

So you know how Delta currently operates out of Terminal 2, but usually only uses regional jets, A220s, and Boeing 717s because the gates they have are only for smaller aircraft? Well, once Delta moves to Terminal 5, they will have access to bigger gates that can support bigger narrow bodies and even a gate for a wide body. This image below shows Terminal 5 after renovations, and all of the orange planes represent Delta's new gates.



So I went on Google Flights and played around with dates, and noticed that Delta started switching the regional jets, B717s and A220s with A319s, A320s, B737s, and even a decent amount of A321s staring June 5th. Even the short routes like Minneapolis show that the regional jets have been switched to bigger aircraft. So I wonder if by then, the Terminal 5 expansion will be complete and Delta would've moved there so that they have gates to operate the bigger narrow bodies.

So could June 5th be the target completion date for the Terminal 5 expansion?
If you look at this post with construction photos from March 18th (that you also apparently commented on twitter) the Terminal 5 expansion is still very much under construction, and will probably extend well into 2022:

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...postcount=3004

It is pretty much impossible to complete construction on such a massive, complex project in a little over 2 months.
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  #3025  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 4:15 PM
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Yeah Delta is just upguaging for heightened summer demand once more and more people are vaccinated. T5 expansion isn't going to done in a few months.
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  #3026  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 4:50 PM
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Originally Posted by sentinel View Post
If you look at this post with construction photos from March 18th (that you also apparently commented on twitter) the Terminal 5 expansion is still very much under construction, and will probably extend well into 2022:

https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/sho...postcount=3004

It is pretty much impossible to complete construction on such a massive, complex project in a little over 2 months.
I wouldn't call this "massive". The Global Terminal project is massive, this is just a small expansion. I do agree that 2 months is fast, but I wouldn't say impossible.

Still though, you probably are right. I just wish there would be more public updates.

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Yeah Delta is just upguaging for heightened summer demand once more and more people are vaccinated. T5 expansion isn't going to done in a few months.
Good point, but these changes are permanent, not just for summer. They run through 2022.
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  #3027  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 5:10 PM
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Also, speaking of Terminal 5:



View Smart Windows To Be Installed at Chicago O’Hare International Airport’s Terminal 5 Expansion

Quote:
MILPITAS, Calif. & CHICAGO--(BUSINESS WIRE)--View, Inc. (Nasdaq: VIEW) (“View”), the market leader in smart glass, announced its smart windows will be installed in the new 350,000-square-foot expansion of Terminal 5 at Chicago’s O’Hare International Airport (ORD). The expansion is part of O’Hare 21, an $8.5 billion project to modernize the airport with the goal of providing an efficient and comfortable passenger experience, with Terminal 5 serving as the new home for Delta Air Lines in Chicago.

View Smart Windows use artificial intelligence to optimize the amount of natural light in the terminal while minimizing heat and glare, to provide a more comfortable and healthier environment for passengers. In addition, smart windows reduce energy consumption by reducing cooling requirements.

Designed by the architecture firms Muller2 and HOK, the terminal mimics the sleek form of an airplane wing and will include floor-to-ceiling windows that increase natural light and offer expansive views of the runway. The expansion will increase the terminal’s gate capacity by 25 percent, adding 10 new gates, new concessions, and a brand-new Delta Sky Club premium lounge facility featuring View Smart Windows.
https://www.businesswire.com/news/ho...al-5-Expansion
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  #3028  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 5:27 PM
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Originally Posted by ardecila View Post
Daily Herald has an update on the Elgin-Ohare-West Bypass project. Work on the interchange of IL-390 and I-490 should begin this year, at the corner of York and Thorndale Roads. This will include some ramp stubs for a future western terminal.

Once the Tollway builds access ramps over the UP rail line there, the city is prepared to build a parking lot and screening facility for employees only (probably with a bus connection to terminals, hangars and other facilities).

https://www.dailyherald.com/news/202...burban-driving
That is a positive development. I am fascinated to see when complete how much traffic ends up on 490 within the toll road itself as well as at the connections to Irving Park, York, and Touhy. I have not been to the Irving Park and York intersection in a number of years but I recall even after the rail line was moved above grade, there was still a consistent amount of congestion. With nearby 490 connections that could increase. Perhaps a more localized problem compared to the benefits 490 might bring to the completed system, which ideally will reduce unnecessary trips on the major expressways 90 and 294.

Does anyone know if any of the Tollway/CDOT/CDA has ever released info regarding the estimated number of average daily vehicle trips to O'Hare but broken down by origin points?
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  #3029  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 5:35 PM
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Is there any chance the Blue Line gets extended to Schaumburg as part of West-side access?
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  #3030  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 6:14 PM
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Is there any chance the Blue Line gets extended to Schaumburg as part of West-side access?
That would be amazing...one can dream..
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  #3031  
Old Posted Mar 29, 2021, 6:45 PM
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I see Blue Line access out to Schaumburg as practically useless. A ride from Woodfield to downtown Chicago would take well over an hour in such a scenario. At that point, any trains from the Schaumburg Metra beat it in terms of travel time. Granted that Schaumburg Metra isn't anywhere near Woodfield but oh well. Then there would still be a good many last-mile trips to Schauburgs auto-centric hell office buildings and retail. Thereby adding to the trip time. Meanwhile draining the CTA of valuable fuel and operations dollars to extend another 8 miles from O'Hare to Schaumburg. I see very little benefit for the city or even the metro as a whole.

With the possible southern extension of the Red Line being the exception the limits of the CTA should be regarded as established in my opinion. Focus on further inter-CTA connectivity and build-out.
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  #3032  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 12:38 AM
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Originally Posted by nomarandlee View Post
I see Blue Line access out to Schaumburg as practically useless. A ride from Woodfield to downtown Chicago would take well over an hour in such a scenario. At that point, any trains from the Schaumburg Metra beat it in terms of travel time. Granted that Schaumburg Metra isn't anywhere near Woodfield but oh well. Then there would still be a good many last-mile trips to Schauburgs auto-centric hell office buildings and retail. Thereby adding to the trip time. Meanwhile draining the CTA of valuable fuel and operations dollars to extend another 8 miles from O'Hare to Schaumburg. I see very little benefit for the city or even the metro as a whole.

With the possible southern extension of the Red Line being the exception the limits of the CTA should be regarded as established in my opinion. Focus on further inter-CTA connectivity and build-out.
Such a line would be used primarily by reverse commuters and retail workers, who are presumably currently piling onto the many existing bus routes from Rosemont to EGV/Woodfield/Schaumburg.
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  #3033  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 1:04 AM
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Yeah Delta is just upguaging for heightened summer demand once more and more people are vaccinated. T5 expansion isn't going to done in a few months.
Right! They won't be done for a while. Hopefully if they completed construction in early 2022 or so.

What about Southwest Airlines and Frontier Airlines???? Will they ever stay at T5? They don't have enough gate space available.
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  #3034  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 2:02 AM
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I believe the general concept is to put United, American, and their partners at T123 and exile everyone else to T5. That is dependent on completion of the T2 Global Terminal however.

Here's a rendering I found of the T5 parking garage: https://www.flychicago.com/SiteColle...reachEvent.pdf
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  #3035  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 5:28 AM
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Originally Posted by jonesrmj View Post
I think I have a new theory for when the Terminal 5 expansion will be completed.

So you know how Delta currently operates out of Terminal 2, but usually only uses regional jets, A220s, and Boeing 717s because the gates they have are only for smaller aircraft? Well, once Delta moves to Terminal 5, they will have access to bigger gates that can support bigger narrow bodies and even a gate for a wide body. This image below shows Terminal 5 after renovations, and all of the orange planes represent Delta's new gates.

I think Delta's move to T5 opens up a lot of exciting possibilities since it will continue to have a separate immigration processing facility. Years ago Delta had been rumored to be considering flights from Chicago to LHR. This move could eventually open up additional possibilities for Delta.

Is it also safe to assume that KLM, Air France, Aeroméxico and Korean Air will continue to operate out of T5 since they are members of the SkyTeam Alliance.
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  #3036  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 5:51 AM
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Originally Posted by SIGSEGV View Post
Such a line would be used primarily by reverse commuters and retail workers, who are presumably currently piling onto the many existing bus routes from Rosemont to EGV/Woodfield/Schaumburg.
I wouldn’t build a CTA line. It should be a separate line, separate operator like the STAR Line that was studied years ago. But even that I wouldn’t support, given the high cost and the weaksauce development that Schaumburg calls “walkable” at the old Motorola campus. If that’s the best they can do on density, then no rail for them.

The best thing is to keep investing in the I-90 bus system and add bus lanes/proper shelters like the Pulse routes where the buses diverge from the highway. While we’re at it, how about moving the Schaumburg bus terminal onto mall property instead of 1/2 mile away across a major arterial?
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  #3037  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Chicagoguy View Post
I think Delta's move to T5 opens up a lot of exciting possibilities since it will continue to have a separate immigration processing facility. Years ago Delta had been rumored to be considering flights from Chicago to LHR. This move could eventually open up additional possibilities for Delta.

Is it also safe to assume that KLM, Air France, Aeroméxico and Korean Air will continue to operate out of T5 since they are members of the SkyTeam Alliance.
Yes that is correct. United/American domestic will operate out of T1 and T3, United/American international and Star/Oneworld alliance airlines will operate out of the Global Terminal, and Delta and Skyteam alliance airlines will operate out of T5. I also think the low cost carriers that are currently operating out of T5 will stay there, and Spirit will continue to use some gates in the L concourse.

Delta will gain access to their own wide body capable gate when they move to T5, so that definitely leaves the possibility for them to offer international flights. Delta in fact used to have a seasonal international flight from Chicago to Paris. The only problem though is that ORD isn't one of their hubs or even focus cities, and they've instead chosen DTW and MSP for their midwest hubs. I hope that Delta at least makes ORD a focus city because in my opinion, they are missing out in one of the world's largest aviation markets.
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  #3038  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 3:19 PM
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Originally Posted by jonesrmj View Post
Yes that is correct. United/American domestic will operate out of T1 and T3, United/American international and Star/Oneworld alliance airlines will operate out of the Global Terminal, and Delta and Skyteam alliance airlines will operate out of T5. I also think the low cost carriers that are currently operating out of T5 will stay there, and Spirit will continue to use some gates in the L concourse.

Delta will gain access to their own wide body capable gate when they move to T5, so that definitely leaves the possibility for them to offer international flights. Delta in fact used to have a seasonal international flight from Chicago to Paris. The only problem though is that ORD isn't one of their hubs or even focus cities, and they've instead chosen DTW and MSP for their midwest hubs. I hope that Delta at least makes ORD a focus city because in my opinion, they are missing out in one of the world's largest aviation markets.
Delta does have a base of flight attendants here in Chicago, so we aren't completely overlooked.

With Alaska Airlines joining the Oneworld Alliance, does that mean Alaska with operate out of T3 as well?
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  #3039  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 4:04 PM
LouisVanDerWright LouisVanDerWright is online now
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Originally Posted by nomarandlee View Post
I see Blue Line access out to Schaumburg as practically useless. A ride from Woodfield to downtown Chicago would take well over an hour in such a scenario. At that point, any trains from the Schaumburg Metra beat it in terms of travel time. Granted that Schaumburg Metra isn't anywhere near Woodfield but oh well. Then there would still be a good many last-mile trips to Schauburgs auto-centric hell office buildings and retail. Thereby adding to the trip time. Meanwhile draining the CTA of valuable fuel and operations dollars to extend another 8 miles from O'Hare to Schaumburg. I see very little benefit for the city or even the metro as a whole.

With the possible southern extension of the Red Line being the exception the limits of the CTA should be regarded as established in my opinion. Focus on further inter-CTA connectivity and build-out.
Disagree, traffic isn't just to downtown, trips between Woodfield and the O'Hare area could also be significant.

As always the key will be what planning accompany's it. If you just run a heavy transit line through strip mall parking lots, you will never see ridership. If the adjoining suburbs take it upon themselves and an oppurtunity to increase residential density (and therefore tax base) in areas that are already very high denisty commercial uses, then it could work fantastically. There are a number of suburbs encouraging the "Texas Donut" style construction of dense, 4-5 floor, apartment blocks. If you put a few dozen of those along that 8 mile stretch, it could go a long ways in making areas West of O'Hare significantly more vibrant and pedestrian oriented.
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  #3040  
Old Posted Mar 30, 2021, 7:15 PM
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With Alaska Airlines joining the Oneworld Alliance, does that mean Alaska with operate out of T3 as well?
Good question. I would assume that they would either operate in the L concourse with Spirit, or in one of the new satellite concourses in the global terminal. Probably the one furthest left in the picture below (since that one looks like narrow body gates, while the other satellite concourse and global terminal have wide body gates).



BTW as mentioned in a previous post by normarandlee, the satellite concourses are being designed by SOM while the Global Terminal is designed by StudioORD. The above picture shows StudioORD's concourses, so the actual concourses will probably look different. There are no pictures of SOM's concourses yet, but I'm assuming they'll look something like this:

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