The Manitoba Provincial Politics Discussion

[Jammon]

Originally Posted by optimusREIM

I'm also not exactly sure what 'past attitudes' actually means. Very vague.

Watch some of Friesen's past public appearances when he was health minister. It should be telling that the physicians had their contract ratified within 3 months and nurses, for example, are waiting nearly 4 years later for bargaining and a new contract. As are the allied health professionals.

[The Unknown Poster]

Good lord, Palister is so bad at this, he's going to get Wab elected. And regardless of anyones feelings on the NDP, Wab should be unelectable.

[bomberjet]

Who's going to replace Pallister? One of his bible belt cronies like Friesen or Goertzen?

Wab shouldn't even be the leader of the NDP ffs..

Like I've said before, said state of affairs. The Liberals being non-existent for some reason doesn't help. They're not really that different than the NDP.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by wags_in_the_peg

eliminate Pallister and polling numbers will get better (my prediction). no idea how anyone gives our provincial liberals the time of day, truly embarassing

The funny thing is that the average Manitoban, once you strip away the extremes like the typical Morden or Wolseley resident, is probably closest to the Liberal party in philosophy. Openness to progressive policies but without the servitude to organized labour, openness to business-friendly policy without embracing the painful forced austerity + tax cuts that the PCs love so much.

Might actually make more sense to go in that more moderate direction than the binge-purge, hard left-hard right cycle we've been doing for the last 50+ years.

[GreyGarden]

I've always viewed the Provincial NDP to be fairly similar to the Federal Liberal party. In fact, I have a hard time pinning down the provincial Liberal party and understanding their identity. In my perfect world they would close or be absorbed by the provincial NDP. I really don't want to see a strong provincial Liberal party because it'll just lead to endless PC minority governments which is not the goal.

If anything, the provincial NDP should really rebrand as Liberals. I feel like many in Mb have a problem with the NDP "brand" as being "left wing" and "far left" which have become kind of dirty words for many. Especially in the modern political climate I think presenting as moderate is key for the NDP.

Ultimately, I do fear that Kinew will not be able to deliver for the provincial NDP. I think many in the suburbs will hold their nose and vote PC because of their personal dislike for Kinew.

[bomberjet]

Being left is a dirty word to all the Facebook meme warrior Conservatives.

Call me radical left wing all you want haha. Oh no I want, checks notes, fairness and equality for all. Oh how radical of me.

When those same meme warriors want their guns to protect them from nazi Trudeau. But in the next breath tell you just to obey the police and you won't have any issues.

The polarization is mostly to blame from the Conservative propaganda groups such as Canada Proud, rebel, millenial, etc. As most people really don't pay attention to the comings and goings of politics over the long term. They just pay attention to the buzz created by those memes on social media.

[Ando]

The party names don’t really matter when it comes to liberal or ndp in many cases. Most successful parties try to govern from the centre. The federal liberals generally steal half of the NDPs agenda and then go on to win the election. That said, historically in Manitoba the liberal party was more centre right and eventually got squeezed out by the “progressive” conservatives.
The fact is that Pallister has been terrible and he is the Conservative party in Manitoba. When you have Tom Brodbeck writing an article a day in the FP criticizing the conservative government you know things are really bad given his politics. Regarding Kinew, he is the NDP leader and the polls are showing he has strong support in Winnipeg.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by GreyGarden

I've always viewed the Provincial NDP to be fairly similar to the Federal Liberal party. In fact, I have a hard time pinning down the provincial Liberal party and understanding their identity. In my perfect world they would close or be absorbed by the provincial NDP. I really don't want to see a strong provincial Liberal party because it'll just lead to endless PC minority governments which is not the goal.

If anything, the provincial NDP should really rebrand as Liberals. I feel like many in Mb have a problem with the NDP "brand" as being "left wing" and "far left" which have become kind of dirty words for many. Especially in the modern political climate I think presenting as moderate is key for the NDP.

Ultimately, I do fear that Kinew will not be able to deliver for the provincial NDP. I think many in the suburbs will hold their nose and vote PC because of their personal dislike for Kinew.

The NDP is distinct from the Liberals because of their formal ties to unions and the labour movement.

The Liberals arguably have more in common with the PCs... they are a more moderate, centrist party, but they are still the adversary of unions who have cast their lot with the NDP.

[bomberjet]

Regarding Broadbeck. I follow him on Twitter. And holy crap am I also surprised of his ripping on Pallister.

There as an article I think by Dan Lett, about Hydro revenues being higher than expected. But couldn't be bothered to do the FreeP paywall thing. It was another rip on hidden things with Hydro and Pallister. Same thing the NDP did, take Hydro revenues for the general coffers.

[esquire]

Originally Posted by bomberjet

Regarding Broadbeck. I follow him on Twitter. And holy crap am I also surprised of his ripping on Pallister.

Brodbeck doesn't work for the Sun anymore, cheerleading for the PCs is no longer in his job description.

[Bdog]

Originally Posted by esquire

Brodbeck doesn't work for the Sun anymore, cheerleading for the PCs is no longer in his job description.

Brodbeck's style really hasn't changed that much since he's been at the Free Press. He's always held the government and those in power to account, whether it's the provincial NDP or PCs, the federal Liberals or CPC, or Murray or Katz. Those who just dismissed the Sun outright really missed out on some good reporting by him over the years. He points out government hypocrisy and waste, no matter who is at the helm.

[Danny D Oh]

Originally Posted by esquire

The funny thing is that the average Manitoban, once you strip away the extremes like the typical Morden or Wolseley resident, is probably closest to the Liberal party in philosophy. Openness to progressive policies but without the servitude to organized labour, openness to business-friendly policy without embracing the painful forced austerity + tax cuts that the PCs love so much.

Might actually make more sense to go in that more moderate direction than the binge-purge, hard left-hard right cycle we've been doing for the last 50+ years.

The Manitoba Liberals under Lamont are not centrists though. If you go line by line through their platform and the NDP platform in 2019 they are much further left-of-centre. They also are not a legitimate option to form government. If they could run a solid campaign with a legitimate candidate in 20 ridings that would be a high water market for almost 30 years.

Our best governments have been centrist and it doesn't seem to matter which party, it seems to matter who is leading them.

[P&M40BELOW]

The PC’s have to realize that the hard core union people will never vote for them; no matter how well they clean things up from the mess that was left. They need to embrace their pro business supporters and open up liquor now! Get rid of the pay roll tax. Get rid of rent control. Get this economy moving and make Manitoba a place that attracts investment and new immigration on a large scale.

[rrskylar]

Originally Posted by The Unknown Poster

Good lord, Palister is so bad at this, he's going to get Wab elected. And regardless of anyones feelings on the NDP, Wab should be unelectable.

The Truth.

PC's need to dump Pallister who obviously isn't cut out for the job of premier.

speNDP back in power would be in the nail in the coffin for Manitoba

Liberal leader Lamont is basically mentally unfit for about anything

[Curmudgeon]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

The Truth.

PC's need to dump Pallister who obviously isn't cut out for the job of premier.

speNDP back in power would be in the nail in the coffin for Manitoba

Liberal leader Lamont is basically mentally unfit for about anything

Early into the term and there's really no heir apparent at this time. They don't have a deep bench and it's the suburban seats in Winnipeg they need to hold so it would not be politically smart to draw a less moderate leader from their rural base. The rural seats are already safe, even once bellwether ridings like Interlake or Selkirk.

[biguc]

Originally Posted by rrskylar

The Truth.


speNDP back in power would be in the nail in the coffin for Manitoba

"The" nail? Pallister has been nailing that 8 foot long coffin shut from the inside for years. Someone needs to pry it open and put a stake through his heart.

[esquire]

I don't understand how someone can spend decades in politics and still be so utterly tone deaf when it comes to communicating and even just expressing basic human empathy.

If a tired, worn out Greg Selinger hadn't run the NDP into the ground, Pallister never would have become premier.

[Jammon]

Originally Posted by esquire

I don't understand how someone can spend decades in politics and still be so utterly tone deaf when it comes to communicating and even just expressing basic human empathy.

If a tired, worn out Greg Selinger hadn't run the NDP into the ground, Pallister never would have become premier.

His ministers are no better. Friesen was a nightmare as Health Minister. Condescending, dismissive, unapologetic. The whole PC government works in a shroud of secrecy. Secret committees with bizarre code names so people don't know who is meeting about what, gag orders- it's a really difficult time to be in politics if you're not an elected official with the PC party.

[Ando]

Originally Posted by esquire

The NDP is distinct from the Liberals because of their formal ties to unions and the labour movement.

The Liberals arguably have more in common with the PCs... they are a more moderate, centrist party, but they are still the adversary of unions who have cast their lot with the NDP.

The Liberals are “still the adversary of unions”? I don’t think that is how they would describe themselves.

[Ando]

Originally Posted by Bdog

Brodbeck's style really hasn't changed that much since he's been at the Free Press. He's always held the government and those in power to account, whether it's the provincial NDP or PCs, the federal Liberals or CPC, or Murray or Katz. Those who just dismissed the Sun outright really missed out on some good reporting by him over the years. He points out government hypocrisy and waste, no matter who is at the helm.

Maybe people don’t read the Sun because it’s a partisan, ideological rag. When Broadbeck started writing in the FP, he was the Conservative counterpart to Lett’s columns, he wrote puff pieces about the Conservatives and criticized the NDP. It’s only in the past year he has undergone a transformation, which underlines how truly terrible the Pallister government is.