HomeDiagramsDatabaseMapsForum About
     

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Discussion Forums > City Discussions


Reply

 
Thread Tools Display Modes
     
     
  #261  
Old Posted May 18, 2022, 5:38 PM
Chisouthside Chisouthside is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: Silicon Valley/Chicago
Posts: 330
Quote:
Originally Posted by Investing In Chicago View Post
Yep. for 7 years, until Covid hit and they decided to stop talking to each other. I was closest to Adem, but he went downtown and that was too inconvenient for me, plus I had shoulder surgery last year, so it's been a while since i've gone there.
Aw yes, and that school is a walk from the Brown Line so i can see the need to drive there. Trained there once for an open mat and Adem is the man,
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #262  
Old Posted May 18, 2022, 7:03 PM
Steely Dan's Avatar
Steely Dan Steely Dan is online now
devout Pizzatarian
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: Lincoln Square, Chicago
Posts: 26,285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Investing In Chicago View Post
I'd wager a large percentage of North Siders in Chicago fall into that category. When I lived in Lakeview, I certainly walked most of the time for daily stuff ( I only put 7K miles a year on my car), but there were things on a daily basis that would just way too inconvenient without a car, such as:

1. Daily pickup/drop for daycare ~1.5 miles away
2. Jiu Jitsu practice in Lincoln Square (3x week) ~3 miles away
3. Gym (midtown athletic club) in Bucktown (4x week) ~4 miles away
4. visiting investment buildings in Bridgeport, Mckinley Park (~2x month) ~12 miles away

I'm not even sure how i would reasonably accomplish these tasks without a car.
And your story isn't all that uncommon on the Northside of Chicago.

I too own a car and do use it from time to time as well

The difference is that I'm EXTREMELY intentional about structuring my life to eliminate those daily driving chores to the extent that I can.

1. My kids walk to school
2. I don't have a "thing" like jiu jitsu, but if I did I would absolutely settle for whichever place I could easily walk to.
3. We walk to our gym (LSAC)
4. Our only investment property is a downtown condo and when I have to head down there for whatever reason it's always on the brownline.


A giant percentage of our car's mileage is literally buzzing up and down I-94 every month to visit my in-laws up in suburban Milwaukee.
__________________
"every time a strip mall dies, an angel gets its wings"
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #263  
Old Posted Yesterday, 7:01 PM
Yuri's Avatar
Yuri Yuri is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,481
Today I came across with this article from the ArchDaily:

Did a Highway Kill the City of Hartford?

Despite the (very) passionate defense of freeways we've seen in the thread, American urbanist unsurprisingly detest them. The article brings some pics and damages are indeed horrible.
__________________
São Paulo - Rio de Janeiro - Londrina - Frankfurt
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #264  
Old Posted Yesterday, 11:19 PM
Doady's Avatar
Doady Doady is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 4,134
To attribute everything to one or two freeways, the idea it is the root of the death of a city, that is part of the problem I think. Cities need to get away from freeways, but to act like transit and bikes and walking is so distant, that is part of the problem. Everything black vs. white is part of what resulted in such freeways in the first place. There is so much grey area, and recognizing transit as merely the first step away from the car is important. A critical first step, but only a first step nonetheless. Even with cars vs. transit, there is park-and-ride. One step at a time, many more steps to take, that is important to see, not only to achieve more, but to even have the hope and motivation to get started.

Near me, I see 50+ storey high-rise mixed-use retail/condominium towers built around a mall beside a freeway, an LRT under construction across that freeway to the mall and those condos because the ridership of the buses got out of control. The freeway did not prevent all this from happening. So the idea one or two freeways prevents Hartford from revitalization and pedestrianization, removing those freeways will set Hartford free, so simple and easy solution, I don't buy that. Maybe freeway removal itself needs to be a product other efforts, like improving transit ridership, get the cars off the road first. Death of cities, death of transit, death of walkability because of freeways just too black and white. Hartford transit ridership not even that bad by US standards, certainly something to build upon.

Casual glance at the map, main thing I see isolating Hartford's downtown is not I-84, it's the river. Many crossings for buses, bikes, pedestrians across I-84. Not many crossings across that river for non-drivers. High permeability - parallel corridors for transit, cycling, pedestrians closer together - that is critical for urbanity, and #1 obstacle is that river. And upon crossing that river, you can see the real problem in terms of freeways being an obstacle is actually that humongous freeway interchange, plus numerous smaller interchanges, contributing further to the isolation of Hartford's downtown. You want it to become a truly connected place again, because that's what defines a downtown, then you need to build that place right across the river too. That place cannot remain so desolate if the downtown across the river is to become so vibrant.

This reminds me talking in another thread about an escarpment isolating the downtown and inner city of Hamilton, dividing the entire city in half, being a major physical barrier to transit, cycling and walking, increasing the walking distances to transit, while others attribute one-way roads to being the root of the problem, and so conversion into two-way roads will supposedly solve it. Permeability is the key to walkability, and it is hard to achieve when people can only think about removing freeways and one-way roads. The problem with these replacement or conversion of major local corridors into freeways and one-way roads is how these impacted the permeability of the urban environment, how they became barriers and increased the distances for non-drivers. But freeways and one-way roads don't always do that, so simple blanket anti-freeway and anti-one-way stance will not get cities far. I am happy if cities can remove freeways from their cores, but if they can't recognize exactly why it is a good thing, where it is best, then they will also not be able to take the next step, and the one after that. And yes, many more steps to take.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #265  
Old Posted Today, 12:34 AM
Yuri's Avatar
Yuri Yuri is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,481
A very well-produced video by B1M posted a couple months ago:

Why America Is Tearing Down Its Highways

Video Link
__________________
São Paulo - Rio de Janeiro - Londrina - Frankfurt
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #266  
Old Posted Today, 4:48 AM
goat314's Avatar
goat314 goat314 is offline
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: St. Louis - Tampa
Posts: 635
The freeways are more of a symptom of other things that were going on in American society during the mid-20th century. I wouldn't single handedly blame the destruction of many urban cities on freeways and freeways alone. There were many different factors including, but not limited to aging infrastructure, aging housing, major population increases, a booming middle class, deindustrialization, major race and class issues, etc.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #267  
Old Posted Today, 3:00 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 6,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by goat314 View Post
The freeways are more of a symptom of other things that were going on in American society during the mid-20th century. I wouldn't single handedly blame the destruction of many urban cities on freeways and freeways alone. There were many different factors including, but not limited to aging infrastructure, aging housing, major population increases, a booming middle class, deindustrialization, major race and class issues, etc.
Freeways through urban areas destroyed housing. It would have been bizarre to conclude that they were a good solution to population increase, even in the 1950s.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #268  
Old Posted Today, 3:02 PM
Crawford Crawford is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Brooklyn, NYC/Polanco, DF
Posts: 25,895
Quote:
Originally Posted by iheartthed View Post
Freeways through urban areas destroyed housing. It would have been bizarre to conclude that they were a good solution to population increase, even in the 1950s.
But I think it's inaccurate to claim that freeways, by themselves, destroyed urban America. They were harmful, to be sure. But if urban freeways were never built, urban America would have still declined.

The East Side of Detroit has one freeway, the West Side has many. But the West Side is generally much more intact. Freeways were bad, but there are many other factors.
Reply With Quote
     
     
  #269  
Old Posted Today, 3:11 PM
iheartthed iheartthed is online now
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: New York
Posts: 6,746
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
But I think it's inaccurate to claim that freeways, by themselves, destroyed urban America. They were harmful, to be sure. But if urban freeways were never built, urban America would have still declined.
Freeways were a huge factor the enabled other issues to metastasize. By sheer inertia, I don't think certain cities (like Detroit) could have declined as much as they did without them.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Crawford View Post
The East Side of Detroit has one freeway, the West Side has many. But the West Side is generally much more intact. Freeways were bad, but there are many other factors.
There are actually two freeways on the east side. The absolute most damaging freeway in Detroit's history is on the east side.
Reply With Quote
     
     
End
 
 
Reply

Go Back   SkyscraperPage Forum > Discussion Forums > City Discussions
Forum Jump


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 3:25 PM.

     

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.