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  #3681  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 5:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Vorkuta View Post
Wear "Roots" gear and avoid all jersey's (even les habs)?

Personally, I don't "sports", but I'd not be caught dead in team-apparel in Europe. Even futbol stuff. Which you'd THINK would be better, but in actuality is WORSE...
People can wear whatever the hell they want. I don't really care.

I just find the complaints about "mistaken identity" from Canadians whose usual get-up (at home and abroad, I assume) mimics classic ostentatious Americana very ironic.

But I am also the type who shakes his head when people wearing a jean jacket and sneakers when it's -20 complain about the cold.
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  #3682  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 5:26 PM
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If you think about the rest of the world, it's not normal for foreigners to be able to tell people from different countries apart by how they look or talk. There are a few distinctive countries like Japan or Britain (islands with thousands of years of distinct culture) but most are not like that.

I would not expect most people from a different continent to be able to guess which Latin American or Eastern European or African or Southeast Asian country somebody is from. Or for somebody from Laos to get upset if they are mistaken for Cambodian, but who knows?
True, but few if any of these nationalities have an ingrained doubt about whether or not they truly are different from the neighbours, as part of the national psyche.

When I am abroad with my family based on the language we are speaking we occasionally get asked if we're from France, and we find it more amusing than anything.
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  #3683  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 6:15 PM
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Originally Posted by hipster duck View Post
Accents in Canada are very class-oriented, much more so than in the US. If you take 2 mangiacake Canadians, I think that most people with some English fluency would be able to tell the difference between a working class person from a middle class person pretty easily. More so, even, than being able to distinguish a Canadian middle class person from an American middle class person.

I've mentioned before that I think one of Canada's British hangovers is a sharper distinction between social classes. Americans have less of that. That's not to say that the American working class has better opportunities for advancement, or are materially better off, or any of that - let alone dragging in the issue of race in America, which Canadians who want to refute my point invariably will.
I think you're mostly right. It's sad.. because sometimes I feel my vowels are not all that classy. I may even have a stronger ''raise'' than most people. Though this could just be my imagination.
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  #3684  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 6:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Though I am sure you're aware that many Canadians are indeed bothered by that.

Occasionally some might even flip out about it. (Ironically, in total contradiction to the reputation Canadians have for being reserved.)

On a related but a bit bizarre note, a Franco-Ontarien relative of my wife's got all miffed in Paris when people mistook her for Québécois.

She went on about how they were Franco-Ontariens which were not at all like Québécois blablabla...

I am sure the Parisians rolled their eyes and thought, Franco-Onta....quoi????

Yes, I’m aware but I don’t really understand it. Just as easy to think of it as a compliment, istm.
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  #3685  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 6:23 PM
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Yes, I’m aware but I don’t really understand it. Just as easy to think of it as a compliment, istm.
Though I never ever made a stink, it used to irk me quite a bit when I was a young ROCer/MOCer and highly patriotic Canadian.

I eventually moved on from all that and today I don't see it as a compliment or an insult. Just neutral. Often in tourism circles it's just small talk intended to separate you from even more of your money.
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  #3686  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 6:26 PM
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Originally Posted by kool maudit View Post
A lot of Europeans will exaggeratedly bow and scrape if, after asking you what part of the states you're from, you reply with "actually I'm Canadian".

They're just being nice and showing that they are aware of our thing, but I don't really think it reflects very well on us. I think that if a country is going to make such a big deal of differentiating itself, maybe it should actually differentiate itself.

If we wind up conversing about it, I usually say something like "hey, no worries -- it's just the usual 'little neighbour' stuff. I do it to Austrians and Belgians myself!"
That’s exactly why I like my usual answers to the question - it can leave them bowing and scraping for no reason, which amuses me. Especially if the person is English - that just makes it even more enjoyable.
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  #3687  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 6:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
On a related but a bit bizarre note, a Franco-Ontarien relative of my wife's got all miffed in Paris when people mistook her for Québécois.
I missed this before. Oh boy. How dare you people 6,000 km away fail to get my provincial Canadian minority status right?

How many Canadians can tell the difference between Normand and Auvergnat culture or language?

I will admit I don't even think of Franco-Ontarien as a separate "thing" from Quebec. I just thought of it as people who spilled over into Ontario from Quebec, while I think of Acadians as separate. I have Francophone relatives and I was born in Nova Scotia but they are from Quebec and I don't self-identify as Acadian (Acadian doesn't mean "French-speaking person from the Maritimes", it's a specific culture).
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  #3688  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 6:37 PM
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Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
I missed this before. Oh boy. How dare you people 6,000 km away fail to get my provincial Canadian minority status right?

I will admit I don't even think of Franco-Ontarien as a separate "thing" from Quebec. I just thought of it as people who spilled over into Quebec from Ontario, while I think of Acadians as separate. I have Francophone relatives and I was born in Nova Scotia but they are from Quebec and I don't self-identify as Acadian at all for example (Acadian doesn't mean "French-speaking person from the Maritimes", it's a specific culture).
"Acadien" would no doubt register a bit more in France, as there have been a number of Acadien celebrities and things that have attained visibility under that umbrella over the years across the pond.
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  #3689  
Old Posted May 19, 2020, 8:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
Many are often visibly uncomfortable about having made that type of faux-pas.
I have been effusively apologized to by foreigners who have taken me for an American while I've been abroad. I have to admit the first time it happened, I was taken aback... it's like they expected my nose to be out of joint about it.
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  #3690  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2020, 10:15 PM
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Has anyone ever met or heard a Canadian speak that sounds normal? like no vowel raising, low voices or shifting? there's got to be a few out there who managed to defy the odds. And I don't mean a Canadian actor in the U.S (they've been trained).
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  #3691  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2020, 10:35 PM
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Has anyone ever met or heard a Canadian speak that sounds normal? like no vowel raising, low voices or shifting? there's got to be a few out there who managed to defy the odds. And I don't mean a Canadian actor in the U.S (they've been trained).
Show us an example of 'normal' - post a Youtube video.
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  #3692  
Old Posted Jun 8, 2020, 10:46 PM
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Has anyone ever met or heard a Canadian speak that sounds normal? like no vowel raising, low voices or shifting? there's got to be a few out there who managed to defy the odds. And I don't mean a Canadian actor in the U.S (they've been trained).
I take it that you suffer from these apparent afflictions? Or is it that you are not Canadian?
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  #3693  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 12:20 AM
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Originally Posted by kwoldtimer View Post
I take it that you suffer from these apparent afflictions? Or is it that you are not Canadian?
Unfortunately I am afflicted with ''the raise''. Yes I am Canadian, I'm just aware of how we sound. And it's maddening.
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  #3694  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 2:04 AM
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So weird.
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  #3695  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 3:10 AM
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I don't understand this vowel raising lingo. People say I sound like an English Southerner.

Whenever the Americans came over to visit the corp I always felt more at home with them than Canadians from upper management. Maybe we're more direct and confident in our speech?

It reminds me of why I find the CBC so aggravating: I can't stand the Canadian accent! (I grew up listening to American talk radio.)
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  #3696  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 3:26 AM
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Originally Posted by someone123 View Post
I missed this before. Oh boy. How dare you people 6,000 km away fail to get my provincial Canadian minority status right?

How many Canadians can tell the difference between Normand and Auvergnat culture or language?

I will admit I don't even think of Franco-Ontarien as a separate "thing" from Quebec. I just thought of it as people who spilled over into Ontario from Quebec, while I think of Acadians as separate. I have Francophone relatives and I was born in Nova Scotia but they are from Quebec and I don't self-identify as Acadian (Acadian doesn't mean "French-speaking person from the Maritimes", it's a specific culture).
Huh okay. I've thought that Francophones in Atlantic Canada are generally Acadians (the area closer to Quebec excepted).
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  #3697  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 3:40 AM
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Huh okay. I've thought that Francophones in Atlantic Canada are generally Acadians (the area closer to Quebec excepted).
As an example I knew a household of people who moved to Halifax from Montreal. They are Francophones who spoke French at home and lived in NS. That didn't make them Acadians.

There are also anglicized Acadians who are no longer Francophone or are some mix of Anglophone and Francophone yet still identify as Acadian. And there is another historical group in NS, Montbeliard Swiss, who arrived at French-speaking Protestants (in the 1700's it mattered much more to Britain that you were Protestant than what language you spoke if you wanted to move to Nova Scotia) and switched over to English at some point long ago. A lot of people in NS have French or French-derived surnames to this day.
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  #3698  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 12:04 PM
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Huh okay. I've thought that Francophones in Atlantic Canada are generally Acadians (the area closer to Quebec excepted).
Well, those with long-standing roots in the region would basically all be Acadiens. With the exception of NW NB around Edmundston where they are a mix of Acadien and Québécois and refer to themselves as "Brayons". Though in my experience those people generally fit in quite well as either. Not all Brayons bristle at being lumped in with Acadiens, and many in fact have that as part of their identity too. Many public buildings in Edmundston fly the Acadien flag.

(Brayons probably make up about 15% of NB's francophone population, so that's a significant chunk. Surprising when you think of how "NB francophones = Acadiens" is what you hear 99% of the time.)

As someone123 alluded to, the question of whether or not someone francophone who moves to the Maritimes is automatically considered Acadien is a good one. There is a push for a kind of "Grande Acadie" whereby, say, a Congolese professor at the Université de Moncton (or at least his NB-raised kids) would be considered Acadien. I actually already know a few "exotic" people like this who identify as Acadien. I won't name their hometown or the parents' origins as the numbers are so small I would be "outing" them.

If you go to the Village Historique Acadien in Caraquet in the cafeteria the walls are covered in a mural featuring Acadien surnames. Among them are the classics (Thériault, Cormier) but there are also some of other origins that integrated with Acadiens long ago: McGraw, Foulem, etc. Names that are more typically Québécois like Gagnon are also there.

If they remain francophone, it is quite possible that someone123's Québécois-descended Nova Scotia family may come to identify as Acadiens over the generations.
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  #3699  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 2:40 PM
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Originally Posted by Acajack View Post
So weird.
I don't get it either.

People sound the way they do. It just is and I don't get the hangup of it.

If one is so damned ashamed that they can't handle the way they sound when they talk, I guess one could try faking an accent until that becomes the new you. The transition is going to be kind of jarring for those around you, but it's doable.
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  #3700  
Old Posted Jun 9, 2020, 2:43 PM
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Originally Posted by urbandreamer View Post
I don't understand this vowel raising lingo. People say I sound like an English Southerner.

Whenever the Americans came over to visit the corp I always felt more at home with them than Canadians from upper management. Maybe we're more direct and confident in our speech?

It reminds me of why I find the CBC so aggravating: I can't stand the Canadian accent! (I grew up listening to American talk radio.)
English Southerner? As in, the south of England? Or Southern US (you mentioned American talk radio)

What American accent do you like so much? Texas, Boston, Midwest, Minnesotan, etc. etc?
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