The Canadian Electric Vehicle thread

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by theman23

If you’re buying a car in that price range, it makes more sense to go with a prestige brand (think Porsche Taycan) or just skip going BEV altogether since the price of gas is likely a trivial concern.

I think you're missing the point.

People want the latest and greatest tech, whether it's OLED 4K TVs, iPhones, newest Intel processors and graphic cards, or the standard for electric vehicles.

Tesla is the BEV standard right now. It's the benchmark which all other electrics are measured against.

Lucid is definitely a more luxurious car than Tesla with crazy range up to 830 km!

But despite accolades from Motor Trend and others, it has no name for itself because not enough people of status have bought them and they've only produced 23,000 or something so people might worry they won't be in business (they're currently backed by Saudi oil money so if that continues they should be okay as long as they ramp up production and sell more vehicles)

Lucid is definitely the sharpest looking electric sedan right now. It looks like how I thought future cars should look when I was a child.

credit: Marc Urbano - Car & Driver
https://www.caranddriver.com/lucid-motors/air

Popular tech YouTuber Marques Brownlee likes it
• Video Link

[Jaws]

Originally Posted by quityourwhining

Should finally have our Bolt EUV within the next month or so. It might suck, but at least its (relatively) cheap.

That's a great choice. I think it's the best bang-for-the-buck in the $30-40k range. Does it have Super Cruise?

[theman23]

Originally Posted by Wigs

I think you're missing the point.

People want the latest and greatest tech, whether it's OLED 4K TVs, iPhones, newest Intel processors and graphic cards, or the standard for electric vehicles.

Tesla is the BEV standard right now. It's the benchmark which all other electrics are measured against.

Lucid is definitely a more luxurious car than Tesla with crazy range up to 830 km!

But despite accolades from Motor Trend and others, it has no name for itself because not enough people of status have bought them and they've only produced 23,000 or something so people might worry they won't be in business (they're currently backed by Saudi oil money so if that continues they should be okay as long as they ramp up production and sell more vehicles)

Lucid is definitely the sharpest looking electric sedan right now. It looks like how I thought future cars should look when I was a child.

credit: Marc Urbano - Car & Driver
https://www.caranddriver.com/lucid-motors/air

Popular tech YouTuber Marques Brownlee likes it
• Video Link

You're right, I'm not sure what point you're making. Most of the trims for the Lucid have yet to be released.

I really don't think consumers in this price bracket care that much about a 400km vs 800km range. Most of these luxo barges are being utilized as daily drivers to cover short distances, and I think if you're spending $150K USD on one it makes more sense to get something cool like a Taycan than something that looks like a futuristic Buick.

Not many luxury car buyers are going to go with an unknown name plate. Genesis has had this problems for years, despite offering a luxury experience on par with the Germans at a lower price. The Model S also undercut the luxury brands when it was first released. I would expect sales to pick up a bit if/when Lucid starts delivering cheaper trims like the Pure, but honestly they probably need to develop an SUV of some sort if they ever want to be become a major player.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by theman23

You're right, I'm not sure what point you're making.

People buy Tesla because it's the latest technology. ICE Porsche Taycan are not, unless there's an EV version you were comparing it to.

and for EV tech, Tesla is still the standard. clearly, look at the sales figures another forumer posted.

[Wigs]

I like Lucid because they are pushing battery tech to 830km range, but they're niche and hella expensive. One of the reasons more people haven't bought EVs is not only price but still "range anxiety"
I give Acajack credit for being an early adopter with his Mach-E

[theman23]

Porsche Tacayns are not ICE cars and I never said anything about Tesla being the standard. I thought we were talking about Lucid?

[homebucket]

Speaking of Taycans.

I personally think the Taycan is the best looking EV sedan on the market currently. I also like that it comes in a shooting brake/wagon. If I were in the market for a $100K+ EV, it would be my pick.

Porsche Is Having a Hard Time Delivering on the Popular Taycan
March 5, 2023

When the Taycan arrived in full production form in 2019, the first electric vehicle from Porsche quickly became one of the best-selling luxury EVs on the market. In its early months, the German automaker delivered more than 20,000 units. By 2021, Porsche Taycan was available in an array of impressive motor configurations with both sedan and station wagon body styles offered.

In 2022, Porsche managed to increase worldwide deliveries by 2.6%, even with the global supply chain problems that hurt other automakers. Even so, sales of the all-electric Taycan dropped 23% in 2022 to 7,271 units. Why is Porsche struggling to deliver its popular EV?

...

“The many challenges caused by the war in Ukraine, interrupted supply chains, and the ongoing semiconductor crisis have shaped the past year and put us to the test,” he stated in the press release. He explained that he was proud of the entire team for succeeding in making the dream of owning a Porsche a reality for many in the face of a challenging environment.

The automaker views it as a strong showing despite logistical and supply challenges faced at the beginning of the year. Porsche stated that the demand for its EV remained strong even with supply chain issues slowing deliveries. The statement suggests a hope that 2023 will possibly be a better production year for Taycan.

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/porsche...opular-taycan/

[homebucket]

Although if I had that kind of money, I'd also keep an ICE car as backup.

Porsche Taycan Suspensions Can Collapse: Recall Issued
by Thom Taylor
December 25, 2022

The Porsche Taycan EV has been the subject of numerous recalls in just the last year. Now it can add the safety recall issued this week. It resulted from suspension strut issues. This follows on the heels of the midyear recall of 12,490 2020 to 2022 Porsche Taycan models over software issues. In that one, owners experienced blank screens for both the center screen and the touch control panel.

This recall, however, is arguably more serious. What is being called a “manufacturing deviation” of the top section of the air suspension strut caused the recall. The supplier missed certain specifications crucial to its design.

Those struts with incorrect machining can cause the retaining ring to back off. If this happens air inside the strut can escape according to the NHTSA. When this happens the ride height drops with the resultant loss of shock suppression. It can also lead to impaired handling and potentially increase the possibility of a crash.

...

Other Taycan safety recalls include a variety of electronic and software issues. They include wiring harnesses becoming damaged from seat adjustment, seat belt buckle assembly failure, front and rear suspension misalignment, malfunctioning hazard lights, brake boosters becoming loose, engines shutting down over incorrect software input, poorly forged front trailing arms, and loose suspension components improperly installed at the factory.

While recalls are somewhat expected, Taycan recalls are disappointing for Porschephiles expecting more out of Stuttgart. Though EVs are known for having fewer components which should translate into fewer problems, because many of the current crop of EVs are stalking horses of sorts, they’re seeing a fair share of issues.

https://www.motorbiscuit.com/porsche...recall-issued/

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by theman23

Porsche Tacayns are not ICE cars and I never said anything about Tesla being the standard. I thought we were talking about Lucid?

ok, I was confused. Thinking why would someone want a gas-engined Porsche vs new tech electric Tesla.
my bad. I said Tesla is the standard, the benchmark and that sales list proves it.

and I just think Lucids are cool at pushing the battery range to 830km and showing Tesla one can make a car with better fit/finish/luxury.

[SpongeG]

gas prices will be going up soon. The carbon tax paid at the pump will go up to 17c per litre this year, I think its currently 11c. And by 2030 the tax will hit 30c per litre. Thats enough incentive.

I know I was doing pricing when looking at an EV, just what I pay for gas, easily $400 per month would make a monthly payment on an EV much more doable, even taking in charging costs etc.

As for Lucid's I am a fan I lov ethem would love to see dozens of them out there on the daily. They are very beautiful.

The new Genesis that is apparently going to go into production has been called one of the most beautiful cars ever by some writers, not sure if its ICE or EV.


electrek.co

Genesis' New Convertible Will Rival The Bentley Continental

Genesis’ message is simple and clear. Just like what their present flagship, the G90, did to the Mercedes-Benz S-Class and the BMW 7-Series, their future "true halo flagship", the X Convertible, intends to set the bar higher and put Bentley in its crosshairs.

https://www.hotcars.com/genesis-x-co...ainst-bentley/

[Architype]

That's outstanding.

More EV lists.

Best Electric Cars For 2023

• 2022 Tesla Model 3
• 2023 Polestar 2
• 2023 Chevrolet Bolt EV
• 2022 Nissan LEAF
• 2023 MINI Cooper SE

https://www.forbes.com/wheels/best/electric-cars/

Best Luxury Electric Cars

• 1 2022 Lucid Air
• 2 2022 Tesla Model S
• 3 2022 BMW i4
• 4 2023 Polestar 2
• 5 2023 Mercedes-Benz EQE
• 6 2023 Genesis Electrified G80
• 7 2023 Mercedes-Benz EQS
• 8 2022 Audi e-tron GT
• 9 2023 Porsche Taycan GTS

https://www.forbes.com/wheels/best/l...electric-cars/

[homebucket]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

The new Genesis that is apparently going to go into production has been called one of the most beautiful cars ever by some writers, not sure if its ICE or EV.


electrek.co

https://www.hotcars.com/genesis-x-co...ainst-bentley/

The Genesis logo does look a lot like Bentley's and Aston Martin's.

[Architype]

Originally Posted by homebucket

The Genesis logo does look a lot like Bentley's and Aston Martin's.

Chrysler is also similar, and it's no surprise that automakers would want to imitate Bentley or Aston Martin.

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

The new Genesis that is apparently going to go into production has been called one of the most beautiful cars ever by some writers, not sure if its ICE or EV.

It's electric. Genesis are dropping development of ICE vehicles in 2025 and production in 2030.

[theman23]

At that price range and level of affordability, buying a car is a purely emotional choice. It would have to be drop dead gorgeous for someone to pick it over a Bentley GTC or Ferrari Roma or whatever the BEV version of those will be when the X is ever released.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by homebucket

The Genesis logo does look a lot like Bentley's and Aston Martin's.

I thought this was an Aston Martin since I saw the photo before the text

[Truenorth00]

The more I go over Investor Day presentation, the more I'm convinced we're going to see several legacy automakers go under this decade. Especially once we see the circular reinforcement between legislation like the Inflation Reduction Act and Tesla's technological and manufacturing lead. Tesla is basically going to kill the entry luxury brands (Lexus, Infinity, Acura, BMW, etc) in less than 5 years. That's the real profit maker of most automakers. These brands will be restricted to competing at the US$80k+ range where Tesla really doesn't try hard. But that market is small. And Tesla's repositioning with the future entry level car (supposed US$25K) will pressure the mid end substantially. Why buy a US$25k slightly optioned Civic when you can buy a US$30k EV? The gas savings alone would pay for the difference. And that's not even including all the tax credits coming. Any brand that isn't going all out to electrify right now is toast. I'm thinking of smaller brands like Mazda, Suzuki and Mitsubishi.

[Dick Lipschitz]

Originally Posted by Wigs

I like Lucid because they are pushing battery tech to 830km range, but they're niche and hella expensive. One of the reasons more people haven't bought EVs is not only price but still "range anxiety"
I give Acajack credit for being an early adopter with his Mach-E

Spoiler alert: The range drops automatically to "15 minutes" at midnight January 1, 2030

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

The more I go over Investor Day presentation, the more I'm convinced we're going to see several legacy automakers go under this decade. Especially once we see the circular reinforcement between legislation like the Inflation Reduction Act and Tesla's technological and manufacturing lead. Tesla is basically going to kill the entry luxury brands (Lexus, Infinity, Acura, BMW, etc) in less than 5 years. That's the real profit maker of most automakers. These brands will be restricted to competing at the US$80k+ range where Tesla really doesn't try hard. But that market is small. And Tesla's repositioning with the future entry level car (supposed US$25K) will pressure the mid end substantially. Why buy a US$25k slightly optioned Civic when you can buy a US$30k EV? The gas savings alone would pay for the difference. And that's not even including all the tax credits coming. Any brand that isn't going all out to electrify right now is toast. I'm thinking of smaller brands like Mazda, Suzuki and Mitsubishi.

Interesting to hear you change your tone a bit on Tesla. A year or two ago you thought they would get surpassed.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by WarrenC12

Interesting to hear you change your tone a bit on Tesla. A year or two ago you thought they would get surpassed.

A year ago, I didn't know they were putting in this much effort into improving manufacturing and that the other automakers would be so incompetent as to squander a whole year and then decide to be 80% gas and hybrid in 2030. It's not just what Tesla is doing. It's how much some of these other OEMs are falling behind and even outright refusing to accept reality.

I do think Musk exaggerates a ton. And the reality in somewhere in the middle. But watching the presentation, I'm now convinced Tesla is moving past Musk and developing an engineering and innovation culture and operating cycle that is more like Apple. Just like Apple continues to dominate several markets without Jobs, Tesla is heading that way without Musk.

As a shareholder, I'm okay with this. As a consumer, Tesla's dominance sucks. Doesn't make for good consumer choice. For example, I'd like a car with more buttons and higher reliability, because it's a hard sell to have no buttons and quality issue in a household with one car and a techphobic spouse. But my options beyond Tesla, are still poor value.