Canadian Retail Thread

[Changing City]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Hudson’s Bay anticipates closing about half its 80 stores in restructuring plan

Paywalled, but I think the article suggests that HBC might be able to keep about half the stores open, if landlords of the malls they're located in are willing to give them a break on the rent. That doesn't sound like an attractive option for the landlords, but given the current retail environment and no other obvious businesses waiting in the wings to take large format retail space, they might be able to limp on for a while. Provided they can still pay wages and suppliers.

They might be better off abandoning the whole department store model and have a number of modest stores selling HBC branded goods like the blankets, and other Canadian goods for the gift and tourism market.

[SpongeG]

the usual mall I visit in Surrey has a Bay store and its always closed at 7 pm, and I never visit till later than that, the mall itself is open till 9 pm 6 days a week so that's gotta be a candidate to close down. When it has been opened it has very low stock and they are filling areas in the clothing section for instance with furniture and large artwork where clothes should be.

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

the usual mall I visit in Surrey has a Bay store and its always closed at 7 pm, and I never visit till later than that, the mall itself is open till 9 pm 6 days a week so that's gotta be a candidate to close down. When it has been opened it has very low stock and they are filling areas in the clothing section for instance with furniture and large artwork where clothes should be.

Not sure if you’re referring to Guildford Town Centre but I remember they cut their hours drastically during the pandemic and even two years after the pandemic started their hours were reduced. And they used the pandemic as the explanation for a long time. Haven’t been back in there in over a year now.

[MolsonExport]

I shop at the local Bay (Masonville Place, London, Ontario) quite a bit (the only place in town to have Polo, and a (formerly) relatively decent selection of menswear, as malls seem to cater to women). The last couple times I went through the store, it was a disarray. The Polo section was extremely sparse.

The Bay has become "Searsed". Like Sears, they did not upgrade/freshen up the interiors of many of their stores. Stepping into the Bay feels a bit like stepping into a time machine to transport you back to the late eighties/early nineties.

It would be a real shame if it went under, nevertheless. I appreciate department stores for what they offer (straddling the middle ground between boutiques with their obnoxiously loud music and often, high prices, and the banality of discount retailers like Walmart, where I have never bought a single clothing item in my entire life).

[Taeolas]

Last summer, when I was in Edmonton at West Ed, we went through the Bay store there once, and found nothing appealing there at all. Selection felt quite sparse, the look was very dated and prices felt outrageous for what little was there.

Basically it wasn't a nice shopping experience for what should be one of the flagship stores of the chain.

[Vin]

Originally Posted by Loco101

I'm wondering if a Canadian company will attempt to buy Hudson's Bay Company (HBC). I'm not exactly sure who owns it now but it still appears to be American owned and corporately-managed.

Potential buyers:

Loblaws (the Weston family): I believe they attempted to buy HBC in the past. I could see Galen trying. The largest Canadian retailer obtaining the oldest one kind of seems like a good fit. (I'm NOT a huge fan of Galen Weston btw)

Canadian Tire Corporation: the company would be able to fit the brand in well with the different types of stores they operate (Canadian Tire, Mark's and the various sporting goods chain stores) and probably could have some HBC standalone stores that carry classic HBC items.

Government of Canada: during this time of Trump threatening us, the federal government decides to rescue and nationalize HBC for historical and patriotic reasons with a plan to sell it to Canadian ownership in a few years.

Other that are only a remote possibility:

-Home Hardware

-Jim Pattison Group

-Empire Company (Sobeys)

-Metro Inc.

American! Sigh it has been well documented that many retailers fail after taken over by American entities. One of my favourite brands back in the days was the Dutch brand Mexx. After being taken over by an American company, it belly-flopped.

[theman23]

Shut down the suburban locations in places like Guildford and Masonville, focus on high end locations like Yorkdale, Eaton Centre, Sherway Gardens and add a food hall with a grocery store. A Loblaws partnership/acquisition might work.

[Innsertnamehere]

Halving their footprint sounds about right. Could probably halve the size of the remaining stores in most cases as well.

Refocus the footprint, and try to scrounge some cash together to invest in the reduced footprint. The brand itself has a lot of value behind it, they just need to use it right.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by theman23

Shut down the suburban locations in places like Guildford and Masonville, focus on high end locations like Yorkdale, Eaton Centre, Sherway Gardens and add a food hall with a grocery store. A Loblaws partnership/acquisition might work.

I was guessing they might do the opposite. Sell the lucrative leases to places like Yorkdale and concentrate on suburban locations where the competition isn't as fierce.

[trebor204]

Originally Posted by SpongeG

the usual mall I visit in Surrey has a Bay store and its always closed at 7 pm, and I never visit till later than that, the mall itself is open till 9 pm 6 days a week so that's gotta be a candidate to close down. When it has been opened it has very low stock and they are filling areas in the clothing section for instance with furniture and large artwork where clothes should be.

I think it's the case at almost all of the Bay Stores. Most open stores start opening at 11 am and close at 7 pm. Looks like some of the stores in Calgary use regular mall hours.

[Taeolas]

I wonder if they were serious about surviving, if they should go all in in resurrecting the Zellers brand, at least for their suburban and less high profile locations.

It would be a big pivot, and their supply chains likely wouldn't handle it. And it would put them in direct competition with Walmart, Canadian Tire and Giant Tiger among others.

But the nostalgia factor is a thing, and with the economic shitstorm we're in, a more bargain based chain might have a better chance to survive than a high class department store chain.

[MolsonExport]

Zellers offers nostalgia but little else. It was asymmetrically dominated by Walmart, in terms of selection and price.

The Bay has fewer direct competitors, but it (a) is in a retail sector that has been declining in North America since the 1960s, and (b) just like Eaton's, Sears, and others that went before it, they did not reinvest in their retail stores' atmospherics, and stuck to the old "High-Low" pricing model (high regular prices with steep discounts at certain times of the year)...people would just wait for the sales, and shop elsewhere when things were not on sale.

Recall Sears in their last dying days. Most of the clientele had grey hair.

[GreatTallNorth2]

My wife and I went to The Bay at White Oaks Mall in London about a month ago. The store is on two floors and their escalator has been broken for months. They have a large selection of homewares and furniture on the 2nd level. The only way we could get to the 2nd level was for a staff member to take us to their warehouse and go up the stairs there. They said they have been unable to get someone to fix the escalator. If they are to shut one of the two Bay stores in London, I would say White Oaks is the one to shut. Although it is far bigger, Masonville is in a better area.

[Acajack]

Originally Posted by MolsonExport

Zellers offers nostalgia but little else. It was asymmetrically dominated by Walmart, in terms of selection and price.

The Bay has fewer direct competitors, but it (a) is in a retail sector that has been declining in North America since the 1960s, and (b) just like Eaton's, Sears, and others that went before it, they did not reinvest in their retail stores' atmospherics, and stuck to the old "High-Low" pricing model (high regular prices with steep discounts at certain times of the year)...people would just wait for the sales, and shop elsewhere when things were not on sale.

Recall Sears in their last dying days. Most of the clientele had grey hair.

Walmart arguably dominates even moreso in Canada than it does in the US, where you have strong competitors like Target and others. Target flopped in Canada. Though in Canada you do have Canadian Tire and a few others but I'd still argue it's less competitive for Walmart up here than down south.

[Innsertnamehere]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Walmart arguably dominates even moreso in Canada than it does in the US, where you have strong competitors like Target and others. Target flopped in Canada. Though in Canada you do have Canadian Tire and a few others but I'd still argue it's less competitive for Walmart up here than down south.

I mean retail in the US is far more competitive in general - going from everything from the number of retailers to the total amount of retail square footage. There is something like 2x as much retail square footage per capita in the US as there is in Canada. US disposable incomes are larger which means a far larger market for competitors to work in.

[MolsonExport]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Walmart arguably dominates even moreso in Canada than it does in the US, where you have strong competitors like Target and others. Target flopped in Canada. Though in Canada you do have Canadian Tire and a few others but I'd still argue it's less competitive for Walmart up here than down south.

Costco also dominates much more so in Canada than in the United States.

[Innsertnamehere]

Walmart has 403 stores in Canada - about 1 per 103,000 people.

The USA has 4,605 Walmart stores - about one per 74,000 people.

So walmarts are more common in the US than Canada.

Costco is more common in Canada though for sure - about 1 per 382,000 in Canada vs. 1 per 553,000 in the USA.

[manny_santos]

Originally Posted by GreatTallNorth2

My wife and I went to The Bay at White Oaks Mall in London about a month ago. The store is on two floors and their escalator has been broken for months. They have a large selection of homewares and furniture on the 2nd level. The only way we could get to the 2nd level was for a staff member to take us to their warehouse and go up the stairs there. They said they have been unable to get someone to fix the escalator. If they are to shut one of the two Bay stores in London, I would say White Oaks is the one to shut. Although it is far bigger, Masonville is in a better area.

I agree, I think Masonville is more likely to stay. London has next to no downtown retail so London’s well off clientele are going to go to Masonville anyways. And the north end tends to be more well off too. I don’t see them pulling out of London entirely, given how much the city is growing.

Guildford seems to be one of their busier locations from my observations. I would be surprised if it closed.

Nonetheless I think they will close locations in smaller cities, for example Abbotsford, Red Deer, or Kingston. And I suspect they’ll reduce the number of locations in larger cities, for example Calgary currently has 5 locations.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere

Walmart has 403 stores in Canada - about 1 per 103,000 people.

The USA has 4,605 Walmart stores - about one per 74,000 people.

So walmarts are more common in the US than Canada.

Costco is more common in Canada though for sure - about 1 per 382,000 in Canada vs. 1 per 553,000 in the USA.

Canadians are cheap, hence the Costco figure. That's why I predict the "Buy Canadian" wave will fizzle.

[Wigs]

Originally Posted by Acajack

Walmart arguably dominates even moreso in Canada than it does in the US, where you have strong competitors like Target and others. Target flopped in Canada. Though in Canada you do have Canadian Tire and a few others but I'd still argue it's less competitive for Walmart up here than down south.

The newer Canadian Tire stores are probably stealing more of Walmart's market share (as are the newer, larger Dollarama stores on the low end).

I showed my American friend one of the newer CTs “Remarkable Retail” ones and he was like: "What DOESN'T this store carry?" (besides groceries). He briefly chatted with a staff member and commented on how she was in a good mood and joking with us and that interaction left him with a more positive impression of the store.
He was super impressed by how large the kitchen and housewares section was and how there seemed to be a lot more display models of most products than a US store would have.

Example: Canadian Tire Carlingwood (Image: Canadian Tire)

He was also impressed by how many electric lawnmowers, lawn equipment there was for purchase.
https://retail-insider.com/retail-in...ars-interview/