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  #16401  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2022, 7:07 PM
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Originally Posted by ue View Post
I agree. An LRT down Whyte (perhaps connecting with the Valley Line across 87th Ave to the west) is absolutely crucial for a complete transit system for Edmonton. Probably not unlike a subway down Broadway to UBC in Vancouver and the DRL in Toronto is a no-brainer. Unfortunately the city wants to chase suburban riders who won't give up their car except for a commute to school or work.

Tunneling under Whyte would make the most sense, and yeah, it would be expensive, but Edmonton did just build a ring road, is currently in the process of finalizing the biggest LRT expansion in the city's history, and was progressive in the past by previously building a tunnel through Downtown Edmonton. Obviously costs have gone up since the '70s and '80s when that happened, but I don't think it's entirely implausible for a subway down Whyte.

If we want to build comprehensive transit systems that don't make taking the bus or train a second rate option vis-a-vis cars, then we're going to have to spend money to make it happen.
I'd love if the City built a subway under Whyte, but given the costs involved with tunneling I feel it wouldn't be considered for a while yet to allow more density to be built in the area first.
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  #16402  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2022, 7:27 PM
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There's more people living in Strathcona and Garneau now than Downtown in the '80s (although probably not as many workers). If it was done then, it can be done now. But I agree the political will isn't there right now.
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  #16403  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2022, 7:59 PM
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Don't bother with a subway. Have a more regular connector from the UofA LRT station that goes down 109st-Whyte-Bonny Doon Mall and return.
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  #16404  
Old Posted Jan 20, 2022, 8:40 PM
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Subways are also regular. Whyte is a major destination and should get better connectivity with other parts of the city. There should be a line going from at least Bonnie Doon to WEM. The city already has plans for a a bus bridge through Buena Vista Park, why not just make it another rapid transit line. Also stop the gimmicky gondola and build something between Downtown and Strathcona that connects into ETS for non-tourists to make use of. Edmonton's rapid transit system is far too sparse.
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  #16405  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 6:43 PM
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The RailFans Canada map is expanding quickly. It now features all TTC rapid transit, existing and planned (by Metrolinx).

https://map.railfans.ca/#10.7/43.7152/-79.4238

The Kitchener-Waterloo Ion has also been added.

https://map.railfans.ca/#11.32/43.4539/-80.4307

And of course the O-Train, present and future, along with the planned Gatineau tram.

https://map.railfans.ca/#10.15/45.3874/-75.5657

Platforms, switches, rail yards, all there.
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  #16406  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 6:53 PM
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Missing the Yonge extension in Toronto as well as Eglinton East Great start though!
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  #16407  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 7:02 PM
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Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
Missing the Yonge extension in Toronto as well as Eglinton East Great start though!
Oh yeah. I'm sure Derek (the map designer for Ottawa and Toronto) probably knows and likely working on it. It's me who assumed it was all there. So much going on in Toronto, it's hard to keep track.
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  #16408  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 8:33 PM
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Originally Posted by Innsertnamehere View Post
Missing the Yonge extension in Toronto as well as Eglinton East Great start though!
And Hamilton, and Hurontario, and Ontario Line...

Great looking map.
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  #16409  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 9:02 PM
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And Hamilton, and Hurontario, and Ontario Line...

Great looking map.
Ontario Line is on there.
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  #16410  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 9:08 PM
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Ontario Line is on there.
Oh! They have to be activated in the layers tab. I didn't see that.
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  #16411  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 10:23 PM
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Oh! They have to be activated in the layers tab. I didn't see that.
yes. I thought my links had all layers open, but I guess it was just the coordinates.
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  #16412  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 11:07 PM
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Ontario Line is on there.
Soon enough they are going to have all Canadian RT systems on there!
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  #16413  
Old Posted Jan 21, 2022, 11:36 PM
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Mildly interesting chart showing the number of interchanges between different Toronto lines:
Code:
┌────────╥───────────────────────╥───────────────────────────┐
│ Agency ║          TTC          ║        GO TRANSIT         │
│ Line   ║ 1 │ 2 │ 3 │ 4 │ 5 │ 6 ║LSW│MIL│KIT│BAR│RCH│STF│LSE│
╞════════╬═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╬═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╪═══╡
│      1 ║ → │ 2 │ 2 │ 1 │ 2 │ 1 ║ 1 │ 1 │ 1 │ 2 │ 2 │ 1 │ 1 │
│     ───╢   └───┼───┼───┼───┼───╫───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┤
│      2 ║     → │ 1 │ 0 │ 1 │ 0 ║ 0 │ 1 │ 1 │ 0 │ 0 │ 1 │ 1 │
│     ───╢       └───┼───┼───┼───╫───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┤
│      3 ║         → │ 0 │ 1 │ 0 ║ 2 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 1 │
│ TTC ───╢           └───┼───┼───╫───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┤
│      4 ║             → │ 0 │ 0 ║ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 1 │ 0 │ 0 │
│     ───╢               └───┼───╫───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┤
│      5 ║                 → │ 0 ║ 0 │ 0 │ 1 │ 1 │ 0 │ 1 │ 0 │
│     ───╢                   └───╫───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┼───┤
│      6 ║                     → ║ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │ 0 │
└────────╨───────────────────────╨───┴───┴───┴───┴───┴───┴───┘
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  #16414  
Old Posted Jan 25, 2022, 8:36 PM
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  #16415  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2022, 2:48 AM
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Originally Posted by ue View Post
Subways are also regular. Whyte is a major destination and should get better connectivity with other parts of the city. There should be a line going from at least Bonnie Doon to WEM. The city already has plans for a a bus bridge through Buena Vista Park, why not just make it another rapid transit line. Also stop the gimmicky gondola and build something between Downtown and Strathcona that connects into ETS for non-tourists to make use of. Edmonton's rapid transit system is far too sparse.
I always thought the City of Edmonton should have built the WLRT to the end of 87 Ave across the N Saskatchewan River, and run the route along Belgravia, and link it up to the Capital line along the U of A South Campus.

I've viewed plans of the WLRT going through Stony Plain Road from 124 St to 142 St. Looks like a shit show. I can't imagine the residents are going to be too pleased with the construction of a rapid transit line on such a congested and narrow road. Why not just just build it north, up to 107 Ave, then route it down Mayfield/170 St to the WEM?

Either route seems preferable to the Stony Plain Road plan.
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  #16416  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2022, 3:32 AM
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Originally Posted by BlackDog204 View Post
I always thought the City of Edmonton should have built the WLRT to the end of 87 Ave across the N Saskatchewan River, and run the route along Belgravia, and link it up to the Capital line along the U of A South Campus.

I've viewed plans of the WLRT going through Stony Plain Road from 124 St to 142 St. Looks like a shit show. I can't imagine the residents are going to be too pleased with the construction of a rapid transit line on such a congested and narrow road. Why not just just build it north, up to 107 Ave, then route it down Mayfield/170 St to the WEM?

Either route seems preferable to the Stony Plain Road plan.
I don't think it needs to be an either/or. IMO the west end should get two LRT lines. I'm fine with the current Valley Line West as I get what it's trying to do. My only complaint is the Oliver section going down 104th instead of Jasper, but it is what it is. Doing this connects high-density Oliver and other urban or easily densifiable areas like Jasper Place and Grosvenor. It's still pretty direct to downtown (essentially if you were driving from WEM to Downtown, you'd take a similar route). I don't care about it reducing lanes on already narrow roads like SPR - driving should be more inconvenient - it's one of the only sure-fire ways to push people to change their habits. And really, if there's an LRT line literally going on the exact route you'd have been driving on, I can't understand why you'd want to drive instead.

But additionally, there should be something that basically does the 87 Ave alignment to the University that was originally proposed. But it shouldn't stop there - it should then continue eastward and go (tunneled) down Whyte to at least Bonnie Doon, if not further (though not directly east, probably up to Capilano). Rapid transit should do more than just get office workers to their downtown cubicles and by creating a more multi-nodal network of rapid transit, where not everything ends up downtown, is a key to making that so. The UofA and Whyte are major destinations that draw people from across the metro area not unlike downtown does.

You might wonder what about Downtown-Strathcona rapid transit? Something along the heritage streetcar's ROW and over to Gov't Centre or a more direct link that would basically go in place of the private gondola and run parallel to the Walterdale (a la Dudley Menzies) and up 105th Street to downtown from Whyte/Gateway.

The 107 Ave makes less sense as it's much more meandering. If the only perk to it is it's less disruptive to drivers because it'll still give them ample room then we're doing rapid transit wrong. However, a BRT or streetcar down 107th Ave does make sense IMO.
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  #16417  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2022, 5:28 AM
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Old Strathcona is a gem that certainly deserves some transit love. Would be supportive of underground LRT from the university to Bonnie Doon. Reward the already dense/liveable neighborhood with a amenity like a transit tunnel to improve movement and liveability of the area.
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  #16418  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2022, 4:33 PM
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Alas. Our perception of density ... don't always line up with reality.




Also the traffic volumes on Whyte while pushing it for a two lane road, do not in any way shape or form require the 4+ 2 parking, and at some intersections 7 lane width.






Edmonton has plenty of roads which need to go on a diet.

(didn't mean to show the map so many times obviously)

Last edited by MalcolmTucker; Jan 26, 2022 at 5:19 PM.
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  #16419  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2022, 4:54 PM
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^ Is the map supposed to disprove the idea that Whyte is a busy, dense corridor?

The stretch from the U of A to 99 (basically the strip that people think of when you say "Whyte Avenue") clearly looks dense in terms of the number of residents, and beyond that, it is a busy hub of shops, services and restaurants that draws people and is not reflected in the map.
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  #16420  
Old Posted Jan 26, 2022, 5:01 PM
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Where is that density map from? I'd like to explore other parts of Edmonton as well as other cities to compare neighbourhoods.
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