Sen̓áḵw (Squamish Nation) | 11 Towers | 171m | 58fl | 4M sqft | U/C

[Vin]

I don't think it's only the Viewcones at play here. CoV has the knack of banning towers over a few floors on the south side of False Creek. Glad the First Nations planners can get rid of this crippling yoke that plaques so many other potential developments this side of town.

If they get this built, I hope they can dedicate one lane each direction of Burrard Bridge as bus-only lanes, and increase bus frequencies between downtown and the south side. Some double deckers plying this route would be oh-so-fine!

[GenWhy?]

Originally Posted by rofina

I think this is great - and it opens up even more interesting opportunities for being bold on the Jericho lands.

Vancouver and its view cones can go take a hike. We have been in a city destroying RE crunch for years, time to relax on a few arbitrary road blocks and deliver some housing.

The only real arbitrary roadblock affecting the housing issue is zoning. Not the viewcone.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by Prometheus

But the project still gets built, and the city is forced to grow up a little and reflect on the many inadequate, irresponsible plans, by comparison, currently in place across the inner city, especially around much more vitally strategic mass transit nodes and corridors. This project could be the external force needed to break Vancouver's current pyschological logjam, both at city hall and in the minds of its citizens, when they see the sky doesn't fall.

Ot it becomes a clusterfuck of inadequate parking, gridlocked roads and overcrowded schools that poisons the well for anything else.

Count me skeptical of anything Gillespie does catering to a market looking for car-free affordability.

[giallo]

6000 more units of housing next to downtown in a little over 5 years? Yes, please!

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by Changing City

One scenario could be that City Council sit back and say 'well, we've got this experiment with the highest density development in the Region (Canada?) with only 10% parking, so we'll see how that works out before we decide to change anything beyond our new City-wide Plan'.

I wasn't referring to the city's current parking provision policy, but rather its inadequate and irresponsible policies regarding density and scale of development, especially around vital transportation assets, where a much more dramatic increase in living/working space should be contemplated than current policy allows--policy that is born more out of political expediency and cowardice than responsible long-term planning.

The real experiment is psychological, and the only relevant result will be the discovery that breaking the city's current psychological barriers won't cause the sky to fall. Indeed, many people who felt a knee-jerk resistance to the scale of this project will discover that the end results are not just innocuous but rather aesthetically pleasing and will be glad, in the end, they didn't get their way.

The people who resist these projects throughout the city are mostly driven by puerile emotion. And like children, who are forced by their parents to leave the comfort of the environment they know for a better school/neighbourhood or to eat an unfamiliar but more nutritious food, the fuss is made prior to the change, not after, when they discover the changes were for the better.

When this project is finally built and is eventually not just accepted but embraced as a positive addition to Vancouver's landscape, many will wonder what the fuss (and their own resistance) was about.

Moreover, the sheer scale of this project, which is not adjacent to any major mass transit nodes, will serve to underscore the extreme inadequacy of current city policy regarding density and scale of redevelopment around the city's most vital transportation assets and commercial corridors. I think this project (especially when its completion is met with no more than an impotent wimper) will encourage, if not force, city council to rethink the wisdom of those policies.

[Migrant_Coconut]

Originally Posted by cairnstone

Sure they could or they could be like the 2 North Vancouver's, 2 Langley's. Or white Rock and Surrey. They have some shared and some separate resources. The more the city gives the more control they will impose on this project.

It will be interesting to see what this turns into and what the price point will be per square foot when its rented.

I wonder if the new proposal was done on the assumption that City Hall would get involved. Pitch a 3,000-unit plan, watch people get upset, pitch a 6,000-unit plan, watch people get more upset... then when Council wants shorter buildings in return for utility access, roll back to the 3,000-unit plan that people are now happy with. Well played, Squamish.

[Galaxy]

At least with the number of people moving into the area, they will bike a lot more so the bike lanes over the Burrard Bridge will get a lot more use. I like the idea of bring back the streetcar and or building out the line on Arbutus as there is a lot of growth coming and a line along Arbutus may help to distribute commuting patterns a little.

[Metro-One]

Maybe my subway idea between the Arbutus exchange, Waterfront, and possibly the North Shore is looking even better now.

I do hope that the signature 56 floor tower goes through.

Would add a lot of presence to have such a tower near downtown but off the peninsula.

[logan5]

It will be interesting to see how much influence this development has on the Molson Lands, and the rest of the area. There will almost certainly be a major retail component to the Molson Lands, and maybe more residential than originally anticipated, given the precedent setting nature of the Burrard development. Could also see a pedestrian bridge across False Creek, as envisioned a few years back.

[scryer]

But the project still gets built, and the city is forced to grow up a little and reflect on the many inadequate, irresponsible plans, by comparison, currently in place across the inner city, especially around much more vitally strategic mass transit nodes and corridors. This project could be the external force needed to break Vancouver's current pyschological logjam, both at city hall and in the minds of its citizens, when they see the sky doesn't fall.

The people who resist these projects throughout the city are mostly driven by puerile emotion. And like children, who are forced by their parents to leave the comfort of the environment they know for a better school/neighbourhood or to eat an unfamiliar but more nutritious food, the fuss is made prior to the change, not after, when they discover the changes were for the better.

When this project is finally built and is eventually not just accepted but embraced as a positive addition to Vancouver's landscape, many will wonder what the fuss (and their own resistance) was about.

Moreover, the sheer scale of this project, which is not adjacent to any major mass transit nodes, will serve to underscore the extreme inadequacy of current city policy regarding density and scale of redevelopment around the city's most vital transportation assets and commercial corridors. I think this project (especially when its completion is met with no more than an impotent wimper) will encourage, if not force, city council to rethink the wisdom of those policies.

FINALLY! A proposal in COV that is uber exciting!

This is the project that will drag downtown off of the peninsula.

[Vin]

I'm excited to finally see tall towers built in the south shore of downtown. Hopefully this sets a precedent for tall towers to be built along West Broadway and the surroundings. Better late than never.

[mcminsen]

If that's the only view cone that might be affected, then would a view cone piercing tall tower (56 floors?) create an opportunity for other new (and even taller) towers in it's view cone shadow in the West End?

Originally Posted by Feathered Friend

The only viewcone that it might effect is a sliver of #20.1, which is based from the intersection of Granville and Broadway





https://vancouver.ca/home-property-development/granville-street-protected-view.aspx

[Migrant_Coconut]

IIRC that part of the West End has its own cones. EDIT: Yup, here they are.

[fredinno]

Originally Posted by mcminsen

If that's the only view cone that might be affected, then would a view cone piercing tall tower (56 floors?) create an opportunity for other new (and even taller) towers in it's view cone shadow in the West End?

It's called precedent. If it's actually 56 stories (unlikely, but still), that would incentivise more high-rises that at least make the 56 story not seem out-of-place.

[mcminsen]

Originally Posted by Migrant_Coconut

IIRC that part of the West End has its own cones. EDIT: Yup, here they are.

Thanks!

[Prometheus]

Originally Posted by fredinno

It's called precedent. If it's actually 56 stories (unlikely, but still), that would incentivise more high-rises that at least make the 56 story not seem out-of-place.

mcminsen was asking specifically whether any of the taller buildings in the Squamish plan would create something called a viewcone shadow.

A viewcone shadow is created when a tall building intrudes into a viewcone because it either was built before the viewcone was enacted by the city or, as in this case, because the city has no jurisdiction to stop it. Such buildings have ramifications for future proposals that lie further in the distance. Any future proposal further in the distance that exceeds the viewcone limit but cannot actually be seen by someone standing at the viewcone's point of origin because the original viewcone-intruding building blocks the viewer's line of sight is said to fall within the original building's viewcone shadow. Since a new proposal of this kind would not actually obstruct any more of the protected view that has not already been obstructed by the original viewcone-intruding building, city policy generally allows the new proposal to be considered notwithstanding that it technically exceeds the viewcone limit.

[s211]

I've not been able to find out and so I'll ask here: does anyone know if this project will be leasehold or freehold?

[cairnstone]

Depending on who gets involved to finance this project you may see upwards of 20000 individuals living in this small area. The lack of parking makes me think they are going to market some of the buildings to the groups that specialize in ESL boarding. So on paper each studio will have min 2 people 1 bedrooms 3 to 4.

I also dont believe that the time line that was laid out has any bearing on current labour conditions. There are several large projects that are starting in the same time including the start of the Hospital.

And what is currently on this ground?

[rofina]

Originally Posted by cairnstone

Depending on who gets involved to finance this project you may see upwards of 20000 individuals living in this small area. The lack of parking makes me think they are going to market some of the buildings to the groups that specialize in ESL boarding. So on paper each studio will have min 2 people 1 bedrooms 3 to 4.

I also dont believe that the time line that was laid out has any bearing on current labour conditions. There are several large projects that are starting in the same time including the start of the Hospital.

And what is currently on this ground?

Depends how they phase this. However I don't see how it wouldn't be constrained by labour market conditions.

A ton of big money infrastructure projects are starting in 2020 and will run for 3-5 years. On top of that you have St.Pauls, plus regular market demand from other large projects in the works;
- Oakride
- Lougheed
- Park Royal
- Westin Bayshore Site
- Gilmore by Onni

[jollyburger]

Originally Posted by s211

I've not been able to find out and so I'll ask here: does anyone know if this project will be leasehold or freehold?

Article:

Squamish Nation members are also being asked to approve the idea of having as many as 30 per cent of the units potentially sold on a leasehold basis, with a maximum 120-year lease. This is a new idea for the Squamish, who have typically done traditional rentals, such as their arrangements with a mall in West Vancouver.