YVR Airport & Sea Island Developments Discussion

[Johnny Aussie]

Tweet from YVR earlier...

@yvrairport: Our friends from Down Under are back! @Qantas returns to YVR for seasonal service w/ special livery: http://twitter.com/yvrairport/status/612367369717968896/photo/1

They are here until mid July then back again in December for a longer period than last winter.

[teriyaki]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

I read that AA is going to take over the SEA - HND route.
Correct me if I'm wrong, but between YVR and SEA, YVR seems to have a much more solid Asia footprint (as has been mentioned),
and that seems to include Japan.

AA will assume the rights to the Haneda slots to operate out of their LAX hub. The slot time is still horrible for connections in HND, we will see how they do with this.

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Yes, I think you're right. However, I think this little glitch in Seattle might give YVR the upper hand regarding Asia, and the possibility of
developing into a transfer hub with less threat from SEA-TAC.

I wouldn't discredit this route failing so much to SEA as it is to the timing of it. The US Airlines really didn't get much when they were allocated the HND Slots. I assume why the ANA flight out of YVR works well (and I say that optimistically because they have been heavily discounting this route lately) is because the Japanese airlines got much better selection in their time slot.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Tweet from YVR earlier...

@yvrairport: Our friends from Down Under are back! @Qantas returns to YVR for seasonal service w/ special livery: http://twitter.com/yvrairport/status/612367369717968896/photo/1

They are here until mid July then back again in December for a longer period than last winter.

Nice. That said, what a conservative airline. Hopefully overtime they move towards these two seasonal services keep growing. I guess part of the problem is Qantas does not have the optimal aircraft for the route in the fleet yet.

Is WestJet and Qantas code sharing or interlining yet?

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by casper

Nice. That said, what a conservative airline. Hopefully overtime they move towards these two seasonal services keep growing. I guess part of the problem is Qantas does not have the optimal aircraft for the route in the fleet yet.

Is WestJet and Qantas code sharing or interlining yet?

I'd love to see QANTAS back full time. Love how the name "rings," love the logo. Years and years ago, my grandmother set sail for
a return trip to NZ on it. Maybe QF and AC can divvy up the YVR - MEL and SYD routes of the future when they get the right aircraft.

[Canadian74]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Why is Westjet always advertised as "low-cost carrier"? There is nothing low-cost in them IMO. Maybe once they were cheaper, but today they seem like your regular airline to me.

It's low cost for the carrier, not the passenger, otherwise it would be "low fare airline".

[Klazu]

Originally Posted by Canadian74

It's low cost for the carrier, not the passenger, otherwise it would be "low fare airline".

Ain't that the truth! It is just misleading, as many people will associate "low-cost carrier" meaning that they offer cheap flights thanks to their "optimized" cost structure, but that isn't the case with Westjet. Less service for the same price.

[Johnny Aussie]

Originally Posted by casper

Nice. That said, what a conservative airline. Hopefully overtime they move towards these two seasonal services keep growing. I guess part of the problem is Qantas does not have the optimal aircraft for the route in the fleet yet.

Is WestJet and Qantas code sharing or interlining yet?

Yes, code sharing in Canada between WS and QF started last October (I believe it was around October).

And definitely, QF's problem with YVR-SYD is having a suitable aircraft to service that route year-round.

The consensus Downunder is that SYD-YVR will be one of the first routes, if not the launch route, when an eventual 787-900 order is finalised. That would be the perfect aircraft for this route.

AC's days of a monopoly on YVR-SYD are numbered.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Ain't that the truth! It is just misleading, as many people will associate "low-cost carrier" meaning that they offer cheap flights thanks to their "optimized" cost structure, but that isn't the case with Westjet. Less service for the same price.

I think the "Low-cost carrier" designation for WestJet is on the way out.

Most of the things that keep costs low have been abandoned. Specifically:

• They interline with other airlines - Low cost airlines usually avoid that complexity.
• They have lounges (or at least have arrangement with multi-use lounges.
• They hub for connection. Most low cost airlines are point to point.
• They have multi-fleets to better serve local and international market. Most low cost airlines avoid that complexity.

I think they are closer to Alaska airlines than a low cost airline.

[casper]

Originally Posted by Johnny Aussie

Yes, code sharing in Canada between WS and QF started last October (I believe it was around October).

And definitely, QF's problem with YVR-SYD is having a suitable aircraft to service that route year-round.

The consensus Downunder is that SYD-YVR will be one of the first routes, if not the launch route, when an eventual 787-900 order is finalised. That would be the perfect aircraft for this route.

AC's days of a monopoly on YVR-SYD are numbered.

Good move for consumers. Also having QF operating into Vancouver makes it easier for AC to argue to the governments in both country that its cap on the number of seats should be increased to permit daily service to two cities in Australia.

Competition is good.

[trofirhen]

Originally Posted by casper

Good move for consumers. Also having QF operating into Vancouver makes it easier for AC to argue to the governments in both country that its cap on the number of seats should be increased to permit daily service to two cities in Australia.

Competition is good.

Is there a cap on the # of seats? For real? Unreal!
I'd love to lift that, and get MEL, SYD, and BNE.
Give BNE to AC, and let QF have the two major city runs! Ha!

[Klazu]

Can we PLEASE not repeat same topics and arguments over and over again without there being any new development? Thank you.

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by Klazu

Ain't that the truth! It is just misleading, as many people will associate "low-cost carrier" meaning that they offer cheap flights thanks to their "optimized" cost structure, but that isn't the case with Westjet. Less service for the same price.

It's good for WestJet to be seen of as Low cost, while not actually being low cost. Canadians are more forgiving of low cost things not actually being low cost.

WestJet was modelled after SouthWest. I'm not sure how much they have in common these days, though.

Allegiant is what I would call a true low-cost airline and we don't really have any of these "bus in the air" airlines in Canada that I know of. I think we could support one, given that Canada is even more urban than the US... it's just that Airline startups haven't had a good run in decades past... partly due to lobbying from the incumbents, partly due to incompetence.

Canada 3000, Harmony Air, Greyhound Air... am I missing any?

Any name ideas for a true low-cost Canadian carrier?

Air Canuck?
Maple leaf Air?
Air Canada Goose? ( Air Canada would love that one )
Air Canadiana?

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

It's good for WestJet to be seen of as Low cost, while not actually being low cost. Canadians are more forgiving of low cost things not actually being low cost.

WestJet was modelled after SouthWest. I'm not sure how much they have in common these days, though.

Allegiant is what I would call a true low-cost airline and we don't really have any of these "bus in the air" airlines in Canada that I know of. I think we could support one, given that Canada is even more urban than the US... it's just that Airline startups haven't had a good run in decades past... partly due to lobbying from the incumbents, partly due to incompetence.

Canada 3000, Harmony Air, Greyhound Air... am I missing any?

Any name ideas for a true low-cost Canadian carrier?

Air Canuck?
Maple leaf Air?
Air Canada Goose? ( Air Canada would love that one )
Air Canadiana?

Allegiant used to be a low-cost carrier in terms of the customer paying a "low cost". They've long been anything close to that. They sometimes result in a good fare on select point-to-point service runs, but the days of cheap Allegiant fares are long gone. Add to that the ridiculous fees for EVERYTHING and the check-in, boarding, etc. hassles and there's very seldom a reason to fly them.

When I flew Round-Trip to LGB from BLI for approx. $26pp on that route's launch it was completely worth it. When it's the same price as Alaska Air there's zero point in boarding that cattle pen in the sky!

[twoNeurons]

Originally Posted by sacrifice333

Allegiant used to be a low-cost carrier in terms of the customer paying a "low cost". They've long been anything close to that. They sometimes result in a good fare on select point-to-point service runs, but the days of cheap Allegiant fares are long gone. Add to that the ridiculous fees for EVERYTHING and the check-in, boarding, etc. hassles and there's very seldom a reason to fly them.

When I flew Round-Trip to LGB from BLI for approx. $26pp on that route's launch it was completely worth it. When it's the same price as Alaska Air there's zero point in boarding that cattle pen in the sky!

Wow... I just compared flights in February from BLI to PHX. Allegient: $222, Alaska $250 return. I'm kind of surprised.

Why is Europe able to host EasyJet and RyanAir?

[Johnny Aussie]

IATA Slot Conference kicked off at the Vancouver Convention Centre today.

https://www.iata.org/events/sc136/pages/index.aspx

Maybe we will see some interesting news come out of it.

Good exposure for YVR in any case.

[sacrifice333]

Originally Posted by twoNeurons

Wow... I just compared flights in February from BLI to PHX. Allegient: $222, Alaska $250 return. I'm kind of surprised.

Why is Europe able to host EasyJet and RyanAir?

Exactly. And that's before all the fees AND hoops you get to jump through!

[trofirhen]

Even in Europe, where low cost airlines seem so reasonable, there are nonetheless hidden fees.
Reading this might cause one to be less cynical about WestJet:

http://the-travel-guru.com/2013/01/beware-of-easyjet-hidden-fees.html

http://www.landingstanding.com/beware-ryanair-the-hidden-physical-mental-financial-costs/

http://www.frugaltravelguy.com/2014/05/do-low-cost-carriers-really-provide-the-lowest-fares.html

[Gordon]

WestJes't original business modes was patterned after Southwest Airlines but today they are more akin to Alaska Airlines

[CareerShow]

Allegiant air is not worth driving down to bellingham when you can fly out of YVR. Sure the fare may be a bit cheaper but when you include the drive down (border, traffic, etc.) and flight flexibility (eg. Cancellations, etc.) flying out of YVR is far more efficient and cheaper if you include time as money.

[casper]

Originally Posted by trofirhen

Is there a cap on the # of seats? For real? Unreal!
I'd love to lift that, and get MEL, SYD, and BNE.
Give BNE to AC, and let QF have the two major city runs! Ha!

Yes Canadian airlines (AC) are limited to 3,000 seats per week and Australia (QF + V Australia) are limited to 3,000 seats per week.

https://www.otc-cta.gc.ca/eng/australia