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  #3101  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 8:09 AM
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But that's just it, we don't really know what we're getting yet. Heck, we don't even know who the developer is or what the building/s will look like. Geez, at least wait for the renderings before going of about how this is going to be shit. For all we know this could be a very nice apartment development.

How about 644 City Station Apartments? That new apartment development is right across the street and from what I've seen looks nicer then citifront apartments. http://www.utahprojects.info/Project/Update/16/644-City-Station-Construction
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  #3102  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 8:25 AM
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Couldn't you say the same thing to those who are fine with demolishing 'em on a blind whim that this complex will be nicer than the houses that already occupy the land? C'mon. Let's get real here - we're talking a rather low-income development in an area that is low-income to begin with.

So, even if it's nice - how nice will it remain? When Citifront was built, and opened, it looked 'nice' (and still does), but that doesn't change the landscape in the last. Just because its exterior might be attractive doesn't mean the interior is as well.

And it isn't even about the apartments really. It's about demolishing good housing when there is so much vacant land in that area - or really blighted properties that they could use instead. That is what you guys aren't realizing. We're taking out good homes when, just a bit south is an open field next to the train tracks across from Bridges. Why not there? Why not anywhere else along North Temple? Why does it have to be on good housing? Don't we want housing in that area? Don't we want people to own property since, as you've said, those who own are more likely to take care of their property as opposed to those who rent? Do we really want to turn that entire area into rental units?
     
     
  #3103  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 9:01 AM
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As rental units?, no, I would like to see a mix of renters and owners in the area with new apartments and even more so Condo buildings up and down North Temple. Even more so I would like to start seeing some of these developments more of a mix use that would have retail space on the ground level.
But that's part of the risk living in a single house so close to downtown and near a Trax line. All that land up and down North Temple rather it's used land or not is prime real estate right now. Hell I wish I owned a home or land there now because the land value has gone up since the Trax Line has gone in and if it was me I will be asking top dollar. I only hope that these home owners are getting their money's worth here when the developer is buying up their land.
Look, if this turns out to be another crappy cheap a** Cowboy partners development then I can agree with you that we are better off without it. But if this turns out to be a great looking apartment development that will be taken care of, then I'm for it.
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2. "LDS Church Office Building" 28-stories 420 FT 1973
3. "111 South Main" 24-stories 387 FT 2016
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5. "Key Bank Tower" 27-stories 351 FT 1976
     
     
  #3104  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 10:20 AM
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And that's why I ultimately oppose this development. I'm not willing to risk demolishing these homes on the chance these apartments will not only be attractive, but well maintained. I've already seen two apartments on that street fall into disrepair the last ten years, I don't see the need to risk it happening again - especially when this company is so little known (I've Googled 'em and nothing of substance has come up).

Of course, this all could be moot. It's entirely possible they've already demolished those homes and the land is vacant. If that's the case, build, since the damage is done ... but boy would that suck.
     
     
  #3105  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 1:01 PM
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What do ya want to bet that this fleet of 100 bicycles is going to prove waaay too small very quickly?

Salt Lake City's bike sharing initiative ready to launch

By Ben Lockhart, Deseret News

SALT LAKE CITY — Utah's capital will become the 20th city in the United States to adopt a small-distance
bike sharing program when it launches GREENbike Monday and introduces a fleet of 100 bicycles and 10 kiosks
throughout downtown...


http://www.deseretnews.com/article/86557...-sharing-initiative-ready-to-launch.html






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Originally Posted by ajiuO View Post

I hope the people of the city are nice to these so that we can continue to have them.

Pic By AjiuO
     
     
  #3106  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 2:36 PM
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What do ya want to bet that this fleet of 100 bicycles is going to prove waaay too small very quickly?

I hope that the 100 bikes for the Bikeshare program proves to small and that people really use it a lot. If that's the case I would hope the city would install more stations and bikes as quickly as possible, whether there is enough sponsorship or not. I would love to see SLC become a very bike friendly city as quickly as possible.
     
     
  #3107  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 2:58 PM
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Even the visibility of having those 100 green bikes out and about on the streets will raise the visibility of biking in SLC. This will be good.
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  #3108  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 3:18 PM
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I agree with Comrade, for the most part, I am not in favor of tearing down some very quaint, very well maintained homes for a possibly nice possibly shit hole apartment building, particularly not knowing who the developer is and their track record with maintenance.

The part I don't agree with is lumping Bridges at CitiFront in with CitiFront. The buildings that make up Bridges are secure, clean and well kept, unlike the Citfront buildings. I recently helped a friend move out of their, and I was very impressed with the quality of the units, and the up keep of the building in general.

Along with bitching on here, make sure to send Mr Dansie an e-mail expressing your opinion on the homes along 600 W. Expressing the desire to have them remain, creating diversity in demographic, architecture and housing type in that neighborhood.
     
     
  #3109  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 4:28 PM
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Future Mayor is exactly right. This is one of the few developments in the city where the plans are required to be reviewed by the Planning Commission. Send an email or even better attend the public hearing and have your voice heard. I constantly hear complaints from city residents, some valid and some less valid, but more often than not those who complain rarely even attempt to be a part of the public process.

With regard to this development along 600 West, I have seen the plans and I think it's an attractive development. This area is located adjacent to a mass transit line which screams for more density. The Guadalupe neighborhood has dozens of preserved homes along 600 West north of North Temple. It is a very stable and popular neighborhood and will be preserved because of the newly implemented TSA zoning.

Those houses located south of North Temple are all owned by 2 development companies. One based out of Ogden and one based out of Nevada. These homes have long been rentals and though some are well maintained many are not. I will not miss those homes. I will be happy to see a pleasant new building adding hundreds of new residents to a mostly depressed section of the city.

On a different note, I am exicted for the Bike Share, I've already purchased an annual pass though I don't think I will be using it today!
     
     
  #3110  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 6:15 PM
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There were people riding the bikes around yesterday.. So I'm not sure what this Monday launch business is.

The houses on 600 west south of north temple are toast... It's just a matter of when.


Bridges at cityfront are indeed nice apartments. They were intended to be condominiums. The levels are pored concrete and not wood. So you don't have to deal with people stomping around on top of you. They also were not finished with the cheapest crap available. No one wanted to buy them as condos.. Probably because of the close proximity to I15 and the south temple railway corridor... So they are now apartments.... The only bad thing is that they share the same parking structure with cityfront... And there have been reports of car break ins..
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  #3111  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 6:43 PM
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Most of those homes around North Temple and 600 West are rentals to begin with. So we already have renters in the area, not home owners.
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2. "LDS Church Office Building" 28-stories 420 FT 1973
3. "111 South Main" 24-stories 387 FT 2016
4. "99 West" 30-stories 375 FT 2011
5. "Key Bank Tower" 27-stories 351 FT 1976
     
     
  #3112  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 8:00 PM
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I just read this great article in NPR "The Big Squeeze: Can Cities Save The Earth?" and thought you all might like it. Those apartment tower density photos scare me, but really makes you think.

click here - http://n.pr/10I0GZf
     
     
  #3113  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 8:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Future Mayor View Post
I agree with Comrade, for the most part, I am not in favor of tearing down some very quaint, very well maintained homes for a possibly nice possibly shit hole apartment building, particularly not knowing who the developer is and their track record with maintenance.

The part I don't agree with is lumping Bridges at CitiFront in with CitiFront. The buildings that make up Bridges are secure, clean and well kept, unlike the Citfront buildings. I recently helped a friend move out of their, and I was very impressed with the quality of the units, and the up keep of the building in general.

Along with bitching on here, make sure to send Mr Dansie an e-mail expressing your opinion on the homes along 600 W. Expressing the desire to have them remain, creating diversity in demographic, architecture and housing type in that neighborhood.
Go read the reviews of Bridges - they're not much different than Citifront. It's also newer, so, I would expect the interior to look nicer.

Here's one review:

Quote:
The good tenants seem to be vacating and vandalism and eviction notices are increasing since April, 2012. Today, there were eviction notices on 4 out of 10 doors in our hallway. The gate has been damaged or completely torn off just about every week. We have been hearing a lot more loud parties, fights, etc.
And another...

Quote:
The hallways are pretty gross. The vents and floor boards in the hallways have been peed-on by dogs and brown-yellow build-up has gotten so that you can not really tell that the vent was originally white.

My kitchen sink has fallen into the cupboard below twice in six months. Maintenance does not seem to want to fix it right. There has always been a one-inch gap between the sink and the counter where water gets into the cupboard below. It does not seem stable and I continue to wonder when it will fall again.
So, maybe it's not as bad as Citifront - but I suspect it's heading down that path, sadly, and that's the risk of building these projects in low-income neighborhoods.

Look, I come at this from a personal view. I grew up in an area with cheap apartments, duplexes and fourplexes. My neighborhood was not terribly bad (I grew up in the western area of SugarHouse, not far from Fairmont Park) - but this street was really pretty bad. We had gangs, drugs, crime and it was exactly because they were cheap rentals.

I don't oppose these developments, but I wish we'd do a better job integrating classes here in the city. My street was bad not just because of those rentals - but because it was all rentals and zero homes.

Citifronts should do that - but it's so poorly run and cheap that it doesn't happen. And it's something that happens a lot with these apartments - it's not about maintenance and upkeep, and solely about making a buck.

It sucks. My fear is that not only will these apartments not age well (even if Bridges is nicer than Citifront, the building itself isn't very attractive), but that we're creating 21st Century ghettos by lumping these apartments in the same area - especially with no counter to help mix the incomes, or at least help with desirability.
     
     
  #3114  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 8:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLC Projects View Post
Most of those homes around North Temple and 600 West are rentals to begin with. So we already have renters in the area, not home owners.
Even if that's true, you have two eyes and you can tell those homes have been kept up far better than a great deal of the cheap apartment complexes in the city. So, even if these people are just renting - the fact the houses haven't fallen into total disrepair tells me everything I need to know.

For what it's worth, everything I've found on these homes makes me want to keep 'em more. Take that small cottage in the photo I posted - it was built in 1896.

Most those homes were built in the very early 1900s.

The fact they're as in good of shape as they are is impressive - especially when you factor in the neighborhood.
     
     
  #3115  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 9:42 PM
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I agree Comrade, those homes along 600 West are very well kept, especially for rentals. I often walk by those homes. The only one with problems is the abandoned building right next to the viaduct where the facade has fallen off.
     
     
  #3116  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 9:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UTPlanner View Post

With regard to this development along 600 West, I have seen the plans and I think it's an attractive development. This area is located adjacent to a mass transit line which screams for more density.
Do you have drawings or renderings you can show us?
     
     
  #3117  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 10:01 PM
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I think problem is actualy going to come from grouping so many apartments with income restrictions and and low income housing together. We should only alow a certian number per clomplex... Otherwise it will create a breeding ground for gang activity.

I also would support laws that disqulify people from low income housing if they cant pass drug test and if they or thrir children are arested on any gang related charges.. Drugies and gang bangers dont deserve the tax payers help.
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  #3118  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by stayinginformed View Post
I agree Comrade, those homes along 600 West are very well kept, especially for rentals. I often walk by those homes. The only one with problems is the abandoned building right next to the viaduct where the facade has fallen off.
Nice or not, it's still a waste of space having those single story homes along there with only a small handful of people living in them so close to a Trax line, station and a grand blvd. That land would better serve housing a new building that will add hundreds of new residents to the downtown area.
Again, it's prime real estate at it's peak. And I'm sure the residents in those homes have seen this coming since the day we all first learned that a Trax line would go down North Temple.
Better all get used to this, because I can see alot more mid-rise housing development to take place up and down North Temple in the very near future.
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1. "Wells Fargo Building" 24-stories 422 FT 1998
2. "LDS Church Office Building" 28-stories 420 FT 1973
3. "111 South Main" 24-stories 387 FT 2016
4. "99 West" 30-stories 375 FT 2011
5. "Key Bank Tower" 27-stories 351 FT 1976
     
     
  #3119  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 10:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by UTPlanner View Post
Future Mayor is exactly right. This is one of the few developments in the city where the plans are required to be reviewed by the Planning Commission. Send an email or even better attend the public hearing and have your voice heard. I constantly hear complaints from city residents, some valid and some less valid, but more often than not those who complain rarely even attempt to be a part of the public process.

With regard to this development along 600 West, I have seen the plans and I think it's an attractive development. This area is located adjacent to a mass transit line which screams for more density. The Guadalupe neighborhood has dozens of preserved homes along 600 West north of North Temple. It is a very stable and popular neighborhood and will be preserved because of the newly implemented TSA zoning.

Those houses located south of North Temple are all owned by 2 development companies. One based out of Ogden and one based out of Nevada. These homes have long been rentals and though some are well maintained many are not. I will not miss those homes. I will be happy to see a pleasant new building adding hundreds of new residents to a mostly depressed section of the city.
I hate to tell you, man, but that area is depressed solely because of your thinking. It sounds harsh, but your mindset, the one shared by many in this community, is a big reason 600 West in that area is complete trash. It's not those homes that's bringing down the neighborhood - as more than just 'a few' are in good shape (pretty much all are, which is amazing considering they were built in the late 1800s and early 1900s). The neighborhood remains trashy because of Citifront, and yes, Bridges - two developments that have, over the years, deteriorated because they're cheap and not well managed.

It ain't these homes that's turned that stretch of 600 West into something undesirable and demolishing 'em for lower income and special needs apartments isn't going to suddenly make the neighborhood good again. If anything, it'll continue the trend of pushing that area down the wrong path - because we're not talking mixed-use condos here ... we are talking apartments that will ultimately target those lower income brackets. While these houses all may be rentals, the evidence is pretty stark that the people who live there invest more in their property than the fine folk at Citifront - whose ratings online are absolutely awful.

It doesn't mean that this new development won't be attractive (hell, Citifront could technically be considered attractive) - but at the end of the day, is it going to improve the neighborhood? Anyone who believes it will is fooling themselves because this type of rental property creates the ghetto neighborhoods we all rail against.

Citifront has been around for roughly 10 years now. It has not made that area better. In fact, you could make a strong case it's actually worse because it brought in a far less desirable population than had existed before.

I hope you're right and it's a beautiful, well-built structure that brings in a mix of economies and the neighborhood takes off. But if it's anything like Citifront, which I suspect it probably will be, since it's going after a similar group of residents, we're not not getting a good deal here. You might be happy seeing a bunch of historical, 1800s and 1900s housing demolished for something that will probably be demolished in 20 years anyway - but I think that's way too big of a risk and a whim I'm not willing to take.

Go build it somewhere else. There is no need to bring that neighborhood down further with cheap apartments.
     
     
  #3120  
Old Posted Apr 8, 2013, 10:18 PM
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Originally Posted by SLC Projects View Post
Nice or not, it's still a waste of space having those single story homes along there with only a small handful of people living in them so close to a Trax line, station and a grand blvd. That land would better serve housing a new building that will add hundreds of new residents to the downtown area.
Again, it's prime real estate at it's peak. And I'm sure the residents in those homes have seen this coming since the day we all first learned that a Trax line would go down North Temple.
Better all get used to this, because I can see alot more mid-rise housing development to take place up and down North Temple in the very near future.
LOL! It's not prime real estate!

If it was, we'd be getting a better deal than cheap low-income apartments.
     
     
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