Canadian Foreign Policy & Affairs II

[shreddog]

Originally Posted by lio45

As Acajack and acottawa pointed out, it's not a big change from "somebody shows up with a passport, they get evacuated" to "somebody shows up with a passport + a bit of ID showing a Canadian address such as a valid present-day drivers' license, they get evacuated, passport only, they don't".

Unfortunately that ship has sailed ... remember back in 2015 when PMJT said:

An exchange on the issue between then-prime minister Stephen Harper and current Prime Minister Justin Trudeau was one of the more heated moments in the federal leaders debate on foreign policy..

"A Canadian is a Canadian is a Canadian," Trudeau responded.

"And you devalue the citizenship of every Canadian in this place and in this country when you break down and make it conditional for anybody."

LINK

PMJT has clearly stated that once you have that passport, you MUST be treated the same as any other Canadian (DL or not) and therefore the LPC will likely provide safe transport home gratis.

[shreddog]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

There's absolutely nothing stopping the government from imposing a policy that says once we order you to evacuate, if you show up after that, we will enact full cost recovery on your arrival in Canada. I don't even think most of those being evacuated would find this to be unreasonable.

Unfortunately as has been stated, there is something preventing them from doing this - social media and lack of fortitude.

At the end of day, if Canada has to do an evac, the total dollar amount isn't that great, however it really is a principle thing ... plus it will require putting CAF members in harms way just because someone was "greedy and selfish".

[casper]

[QUOTE=shreddog;10257023]Unfortunately that ship has sailed ... remember back in 2015 when PMJT said:LINK

I think we mixing up a few different things here.

'A Canadian is a Canadian' is a sound position. If Canada is going to undertake an airlift of some sort, we should be doing it equally for any Canadians that need it. Starting to go in and say some Canadian are more Canadian than others is a bad strategy.

That article focuses on terrorists having their Canadian citizenship taken away from them. Unless they lied on their application, there is no grounds to revoke their citizenship. As a country those terrorists are our problem to deal with. We have laws in place to do just that.

As for charging for evacuation flights. The current liberals have done just that. It is the conservatives that in the past did it for free. You get Canadian out of harms way, then deal with the invoice after the fact.

When the rest of NATO start to airlift their people out, I just don't see Canada deciding not be involved.

[shreddog]

Originally Posted by casper

'A Canadian is a Canadian' is a sound position. If Canada is going to undertake an airlift of some sort, we should be doing it equally for any Canadians that need it. Starting to go in and say some Canadian are more Canadian than others is a bad strategy.

Umm, that was my point; Passports are all that count, we will not add another layer on concerning DLs (or anything else to show residency).

Originally Posted by casper

As for charging for evacuation flights. The current liberals have done just that.

When has this been done??

Originally Posted by casper

When the rest of NATO start to airlift their people out, I just don't see Canada deciding not be involved.

WTF does NATO have to do with this?

Anyway, if evacs are done, I'm sure Harj will ensure that "all" are taken care of

[kwoldtimer]

Here's the official guidance:

Government-assisted departures or evacuations
Government of Canada-assisted departures or evacuations of Canadians from another country are never guaranteed. They are an option of last resort, when all means of personal and commercial transportation have been exhausted and the safety and security of Canadians is compromised.

You should not rely on the Government of Canada for assisted departure or evacuation. The best time to leave a country is before a situation escalates into an emergency, while commercial options remain available.

Our ability to help you may be affected by:

the severity of the situation
our duty of care obligations to our staff
limits on our resources
local laws and regulations
If you ignore our advice to avoid all or non-essential travel to a country or region, you’re putting yourself and your family at risk.

Information on assisted departures or evacuation
Assisted departures and evacuations are limited to Canadian citizens
Assisted departures and evacuations are limited to Canadian citizens. In exceptional circumstances the Government of Canada may consider extending the eligibility to include permanent residents of Canada and eligible family members, as defined in the Immigration and Refugee Protection Regulations.

The expanded eligibility is not guaranteed. Family members may not be eligible for assistance.

Your pets will have to stay behind.

Transportation may not take you directly to Canada
Transportation we provide during an assisted departure or evacuation may not take you directly to Canada. In most cases it will only be to a safe location near the affected area.

The cost to you could be very high
You may have to pay for your assisted-departure travel to safe location near the affected area. You are also responsible for all additional costs, including temporary accommodations, food and basic necessities at the safe location, as well as your onward travel beyond it.

All travelers will require valid travel documents
During an assisted departure or evacuation, you and everyone travelling in your group must have valid travel documents. Be sure that your travel documents and those of your family members, accessible and secure.

Strict baggage limits will be enforced.
In most cases of assisted departure or evacuation, you’ll be allowed to bring with you only 1 piece of carry-on luggage.

[whatnext]

Originally Posted by shreddog

Unfortunately that ship has sailed ... remember back in 2015 when PMJT said:LINK

PMJT has clearly stated that once you have that passport, you MUST be treated the same as any other Canadian (DL or not) and therefore the LPC will likely provide safe transport home gratis.

Luckily Junior's ass is going to get kicked to the curb next election as he is too stupid and arrogant to quit beforehand. People have tired of that brand of virtue-signalling drivel.

[casper]

Originally Posted by shreddog

Umm, that was my point; Passports are all that count, we will not add another layer on concerning DLs (or anything else to show residency).
When has this been done??

Agreed.

Originally Posted by shreddog

WTF does NATO have to do with this?

Anyway, if evacs are done, I'm sure Harj will ensure that "all" are taken care of

While likely not a NATO operation. Canada in situations like this tends to collaborate with it is NATO partners. Past evacuations by the Canadian military if their space on a Canadian flight those seats have been made available to citizens from friendly countries and vice versa.

I can't see the US, Germany, Span, Italy etc. evacuate their citizens out of war zone and Canada says, no we are not providing the same response for our citizens because of the cost or risk. That is just not going to happen.

[Justanothermember]

Originally Posted by whatnext

Luckily Junior's ass is going to get kicked to the curb next election as he is too stupid and arrogant to quit beforehand. People have tired of that brand of virtue-signalling drivel.

Unfortunately, the alternative is equally grotesque.

My biggest fear under the PP regime? Kissing our natural environment goodbye.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by Justanothermember

Unfortunately, the alternative is equally grotesque.

My biggest fear under the PP regime? Kissing our natural environment goodbye.

Wrong thread unless you mean him withdrawing from the Paris Accord and you think that our withdrawal is the make or break for climate change?

Or you imagine he is going to pave over national parks or try and find oil there?

[acottawa]

Major prisoner swap apparently underway in Ankara, including a Canadian citizen.

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2024/...nderway-a85904

[casper]

Originally Posted by Justanothermember

Unfortunately, the alternative is equally grotesque.

My biggest fear under the PP regime? Kissing our natural environment goodbye.

I think it is a given we will go backwards on environmental protection.

To PP credit, he does not look to be in Climate Change denial. I think the conservatives generally agree Climate Change is real, they just don't want to do anything about it. They expect technology to solve the problem and for the private sector to do that on its own.

The looks to have the momentum to electing another democratic government. That will put them in the camp of environmentally responsible countries. That would just leave places like Australia that are addicted to coal exports. Perhaps to be joined by a conservative Canadian government.

[Dartguard]

Originally Posted by Justanothermember

Unfortunately, the alternative is equally grotesque.

My biggest fear under the PP regime? Kissing our natural environment goodbye.

I think the environmental concerns will be coming from a different direction. PP looks open to nurturing Indigenous business opportunities. What happens to the climate terrorists when a Native band wants to open a mine, pipeline or other economic opportunity that supposedly assaults the Environment?

There is a new generation of younger sophisticated Native leaders coming up that are not adverse to the idea of business and making life better for themselves and their bands. Its time they get their chance.

Its time the elders on some reserves stop running them like Thirteenth Century feudal Kingdoms.Bring back the transparency act and let Women on Reserves actually own things.

[YOWetal]

Originally Posted by acottawa

Major prisoner swap apparently underway in Ankara, including a Canadian citizen.

https://www.themoscowtimes.com/2024/...nderway-a85904

It's easy to be cyncial and dismiss Canada's importance on here but in this case I doubt we were much if at all involved. Once you put on a US Marine uniform you are going to be their responsibily though of course great news for his family in Canada.

If you don't get the memo to avoid travel to places that take captives in order to trade them for assasins and spies you kind of deserve your fate at this point.

[casper]

US is at it again.
I think the minister of Trade Export sums it up nicely as

“Canada is extremely disappointed that the U.S. Department of Commerce has significantly increased its unfair and unwarranted duties on softwood lumber from Canada, from 8.05% to 14.54%.

https://www.canada.ca/en/global-affa...od-lumber.html

Very old story that keeps coming up. The US is now doubling down on it.

[Dengler Avenue]

Time for some breaking news: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/09/03/u...l-staff-arrest
That said, I don’t know if it’s relevant to Canada.

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by Dengler Avenue

Time for some breaking news: https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2024/09/03/u...l-staff-arrest
That said, I don’t know if it’s relevant to Canada.

Far more interesting is the take down of the Russian assets errr media influencers and their connection to Canada. Apparently organized by a Canadian couple.

Statement from GAC:

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-safe...perations.html

I'm curious to see how much of the Convoy and affiliated movements will be revealed to have been covertly funded by Russia.

And it's fun watching Elon panic tweet like a maniac....

[WarrenC12]

Originally Posted by Truenorth00

I'm curious to see how much of the Convoy and affiliated movements will be revealed to have been covertly funded by Russia.

And it's fun watching Elon panic tweet like a maniac....

My guess: Lots.

And yeah Elon is really going off for somebody who hasn't been named in anything related yet.

[1overcosc]

^ Could be a stunt on his part. Remember, that type thrives on a persecution complex.

[casper]

While the article is about trucks. It does have some interesting quotes......

One of the military's simplest procurement projects is being tied down by red tape

Despite facing heavy pressure to ramp up military spending, the Department of National Defence (DND) has slow-rolled one of the least complex of its vehicle replacement programs.

"We'd rather have no corruption and slow purchases rather than [moving] fast and [accepting] more risk of making mistakes," he said.

There are four qualified bidders for the light utility vehicle contract — Roshel, Armatec, Oshkosh Defence and GM Defence — each with proven track records.

The program remains mired in what DND calls the "options analysis" phase — a step the department, in a media statement, defended as necessary to ensure "that these new vehicles will meet the needs of the CAF, while providing the best value to Canadians and maximizing industry competition."

Defence Minister Bill Blair said a certain amount of due diligence must go into any government purchase, but there's a limit when it comes to less complex purchases.

"I can't think of any circumstances where it should take years to go out and buy a commercial truck, because most companies and most Canadians can do it in a matter of days," Blair said.

Bureaucrats "do the options analysis because they also don't trust their military to give them the right requirements," he said. "The military games the requirements because, guess what? The military has gamed the requirements in the past."

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/lig...ment-1.7315675

[Truenorth00]

Originally Posted by casper

While the article is about trucks. It does have some interesting quotes......

https://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/lig...ment-1.7315675

Apparently the Paterson Chair at Carleton doesn't understand how procurement works at DND. There's no separation between "the bureaucrats" and the military. The military are the bureaucrats. It's military personnel like me that write requirements. And it's personnel like me that turn the requirements into contactable deliverables.

Each of the services and domains have requirements staff. "Director of Air/Land/Maritime/Space/etc Requirements". They are staffed with mostly senior officers and senior enlisted. They turn identified needs (usually stated in a problem statement called Statement of Capability Deficiency) into requirements (called Statement of Requirements). After this a project office is stood up. They'll wrap up Options Analysis and turn the SOR into a Statement of Work (SOW) that is contactable.

If the project is held up in OA, it is very probably because they are considering what is available on the market (possible emerging options) or changing requirements (because of the evolving threat environment). Saying it's because they are scared is ridiculous.