General Phoenix Metro Discussion Thread

[Obadno]

So unfortunate some of those old Victorian buildings were not preserved.

[muertecaza]

Originally Posted by combusean

So cool. I always had the sense there isn't much to see that hasn't been posted before, but new additions to the Memory Project definitely aren't that. Keep any you see coming.

Here are some others from the same collection that this forum might like:

Downtown



Residential



Osborn School (formerly at Osborn/Central, replaced by the Punchard Building in the 1960s)



Residential



Historic Phoenix Union High



This house looks like some of the historic homes that remain on Roosevelt, but I can't place it. The street sign appears to say 600 (?) block of N. 1st Ave., which would put it around 1st Ave./Filmore. Historic aerials show it might have been where the ASU dorm is now? Not sure though.



Crazy that we had better grounds at the Capitol 100 years ago than we do now (only half kidding):



Crazy to think the Salt used to flood down to where the Capitol grounds



Haven't tried to pinpoint this one but the label says Thomas/7th



Former Water Users' Association building, used to be near Van Buren/2nd Ave where the YMCA is now (https://www.henrytrost.org/buildings...sers-building/)

[azcats]

Did you know that in the 70s - there was serious consideration to leveling Willo? This was the time when there was debate on how the Papago Freeway was to enter into Phoenix. You might be able to find drawings - where the freeway was going to be elevated coming through central Phoenix. Now, Palmcroft and Willo are some of the most desired neighborhoods in Phoenix.

[combusean]

Originally Posted by muertecaza

Here are some others from the same collection that this forum might like:

...

This house looks like some of the historic homes that remain on Roosevelt, but I can't place it. The street sign appears to say 600 (?) block of N. 1st Ave., which would put it around 1st Ave./Filmore. Historic aerials show it might have been where the ASU dorm is now? Not sure though.

By the massing and driveway, this looks like the NEC of 1st Ave and Fillmore where the Westward Ho expansion sits on now, photographed before the Ho itself. I wonder what this was, looks awfully big to be a house.

Casa de Rosas is at the SWC of 7th Ave and Thomas and still there as part of the church complex. Interesting how stately this building looks but disappears into the modern urban jungle.

[combusean]

Seems like the satellite photos for Downtown Phoenix were recently updated on Google Maps. Strange that after waiting for years there's two updates within months of each other.

[PHX-DUDE-MAN]

One thing is clear in the historic Phoenix pictures is that they planted more trees and grass! Grass was a common thing in public common areas, but not so today because of all of the climate change liberal nazis who hate people and want us to eat bugs and have no carbon footprint and who think we should just put rocks everywhere and not disturb the environment nor take dominion. We are ruled by people who hate you and me.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by PHX-DUDE-MAN

One thing is clear in the historic Phoenix pictures is that they planted more trees and grass! Grass was a common thing in public common areas, but not so today because of all of the climate change liberal nazis who hate people and want us to eat bugs and have no carbon footprint and who think we should just put rocks everywhere and not disturb the environment nor take dominion. We are ruled by people who hate you and me.

Its not so much that as misplaced priorities "we want to preserve water"

The best way to do this would be too go after big agg and make them use water more efficiently since they make up 70% of the water use.

Taking a shady green space and turning it into rocks and desert preserves virtually no water and makes the area hotter but it signals to others you are preserving water.

If it was up to me I would subsidize lawns (real lawns) and leafy trees for everyone in the city and instead focus water saving efforts on Big Agg. But thats sensible so it wont happen.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by combusean

Seems like the satellite photos for Downtown Phoenix were recently updated on Google Maps. Strange that after waiting for years there's two updates within months of each other.

Am I missing something it looks the same to me!

[PHX-DUDE-MAN]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Its not so much that as misplaced priorities "we want to preserve water"

The best way to do this would be too go after big agg and make them use water more efficiently since they make up 70% of the water use.

Taking a shady green space and turning it into rocks and desert preserves virtually no water and makes the area hotter but it signals to others you are preserving water.

If it was up to me I would subsidize lawns (real lawns) and leafy trees for everyone in the city and instead focus water saving efforts on Big Agg. But thats sensible so it wont happen.

Thank you for a real answer to my off the cuff rant. I think you are right and I would vote for your solution/idea here. If they can get a Covid vaccine to every man woman and child in the world, then surely they can bring more water to Phoenix if they wanted. It is all just politics and power control, and not about scarcity.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by PHX-DUDE-MAN

One thing is clear in the historic Phoenix pictures is that they planted more trees and grass! Grass was a common thing in public common areas, but not so today because of all of the climate change liberal nazis who hate people and want us to eat bugs and have no carbon footprint and who think we should just put rocks everywhere and not disturb the environment nor take dominion. We are ruled by people who hate you and me.

Maybe we can spread blankets out on the grass while enjoying a picnic of bugs. There is room for compromise and bipartisanship even in times of polarization.

[YourBuddy]

Originally Posted by Obadno

Its not so much that as misplaced priorities "we want to preserve water"

The best way to do this would be too go after big agg and make them use water more efficiently since they make up 70% of the water use.

Taking a shady green space and turning it into rocks and desert preserves virtually no water and makes the area hotter but it signals to others you are preserving water.

If it was up to me I would subsidize lawns (real lawns) and leafy trees for everyone in the city and instead focus water saving efforts on Big Agg. But thats sensible so it wont happen.

Yep, neither side seems to actually want to go after big ag companies. It’s either we get no trees or we have to pay for desal.

[YourBuddy]

Originally Posted by PHX-DUDE-MAN

Thank you for a real answer to my off the cuff rant. I think you are right and I would vote for your solution/idea here. If they can get a Covid vaccine to every man woman and child in the world, then surely they can bring more water to Phoenix if they wanted. It is all just politics and power control, and not about scarcity.

It is absolutely about scarcity. People really don’t understand how complicated the politics around water, water rights, and water infrastructure is. Look how difficult it was for the current state AG to stop just some of the water being used by Saudi AG companies. Remember all the conspiracies about the current administration paying farmers not to grow crops? They made it seem like they wanted to make food prices go up, meanwhile they were just trying to keep the Colorado river from entering more severe shortage declarations. There will never be a politician that can do what needs to be done on regulations on AG companies in this country, the propaganda pretty much writes itself.

It was also the AG community in this state that was pushing so hard from Pinal County to get the Israeli Desal plant built. It would have been the cities having municipal user pay for increased water prices, while their primarily ag dependent county would have been spared the same price increases.

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by YourBuddy

It is absolutely about scarcity.

Its only complex because nobody is willing to cut the Gordian Knot.

Dont worry I plan to become Sulla in 20 years and Ill take care of it

[halicem]

CityNerd (an urbanist YouTuber) is coming to town and giving a talk on Thursday: https://events.humanitix.com/an-evening-with-citynerd

[combusean]

List of Safeways and Frys being sold just dropped.

This is *extremely* concerning for Central Phoenix, and that's just one area I looked.

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=htt...60wz7kbd1.jpeg

[Obadno]

Originally Posted by combusean

List of Safeways and Frys being sold just dropped.

This is *extremely* concerning for Central Phoenix, and that's just one area I looked.

https://www.reddit.com/media?url=htt...60wz7kbd1.jpeg

...... What's this now? Who are the sold too? why is this concerning?

[combusean]

They have to sell these stores as part of the merger deal.

Safeway is about the only consistent full-service grocery option in Central Phoenix and people cannot risk these closing with a potentially flaky new untested owner. Albertsons is probably not lining up to buy these when they're closing stores already. Pray that Winco picks them up.

[CrestedSaguaro]

Just to clarify, no Fry's locations are being sold off. Just Safeway and Albertson's. Also, the merger is still under an FTC lawsuit. So this isn't a sealed deal yet.

If the merger does go through (which is likely), C&S Wholesale Grocers is currently the grocer to pick up the sold-off locations. C&S is the owner of Piggly Wiggly in the Midwest and is a decent supermarket chain. The divested locations will be in good hands with them.

[combusean]

A few things:

- Piggly Wiggly is a massive step down from Safeway.
- The ability for a big retailer to execute a successful entry in grocery, especially hyper-competitive Phoenix, is not at all guaranteed. Tesco invested obscene amounts of money and failed, same with Target in Canada.
- I don't really think it's a coincidence that all these are legacy locations. 7th St/McDowell is the smallest Safeway in the state (my friend actually worked in Safeway real estate for a time). Gentrification, WFH, older locations, shoplifting, etc could mean these stores aren't on the right side of profitability and a new owner might not have the same patience as Safeway has had.
- Grocery inflation could push people to Walmart as much as concentrations of wealth push people to higher market to higher end options. Combined with the above, this is just a bad time to upset a potentially fragile dynamic.

[exit2lef]

Originally Posted by combusean

They have to sell these stores as part of the merger deal.

Safeway is about the only consistent full-service grocery option in Central Phoenix and people cannot risk these closing with a potentially flaky new untested owner. Albertsons is probably not lining up to buy these when they're closing stores already. Pray that Winco picks them up.

I don’t know what exact definition of “Central Phoenix,” you’re using, but I can think of several non Safeways in what I would consider the central part of the city:

Fry’s Downtown
Fry’s at 7th Ave & Camelback
Sprouts at 7th Ave & Osborn
AJ’s at Central & Camelback