Ontario vows to build traffic tunnel under Highway 401 across Toronto

[Innsertnamehere]

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...ford-1.7333341

Ford vows to build traffic tunnel under Highway 401 across GTA

With the possibility of an early election looming in Ontario, Premier Doug Ford said Wednesday his government will explore building a tunnel for drivers and transit beneath Highway 401 in the Greater Toronto Area.

"This tunnel and expressway will cut gridlock, support economic growth and help get people moving faster," Ford said at a morning news conference in Etobicoke, while vowing to build the project regardless of the results of an internal feasibility study.

"The reason we're having a feasibility study is it's going to determine the length. If they're telling me, 30 kilometres is x, 40 kilometres is y, and 70 kilometres or 60 kilometres is another cost, let's take a look at it," he said.

"But we're going to get the job done, mark my words."

The Ministry of Transportation will look at the potential for a tunnel running from Brampton or Mississauga in the west to Scarborough or Markham in the east that connects to major roads along the way, Ford said. That's a distance of roughly 55 kilometres. The tunnel would not be tolled and would include public transit, according to the province.

[mhays]

Under an existing freeway?

Does that mean going deep to avoid disruption, meaning longer ramps and bigger projects for each interchange?

Or does it mean a shallow project with disruption of the freeway for several years per segment?

I know nothing about the plan. But this sounds like crazy ol Ford proposing something crazy. Better do those feasibility studies.

[hkskyline]

I wonder why not build a bridge deck above it, which may be a bit easier to manage and create a few super express lanes. I'm thinking about the crazy Japanese highways stacked one on top of another.

[Crawford]

Yeah, why not double-deck the freeway? Way cheaper and easier. In Mexico City they've double-decked a bunch of freeways and the top level is a tollway, and basically costs nothing from taxpayers.

It's a dumb idea anyways. People avoid the 401 due to insane traffic and this would just induce more traffic.

[Blitz]

Just more wacky nonsense by our embarrassment of a premier.

[bilbao58]

Sounds like Doug has taken up his late brother's crack habit.

[ardecila]

Originally Posted by Crawford

Yeah, why not double-deck the freeway? Way cheaper and easier. In Mexico City they've double-decked a bunch of freeways and the top level is a tollway, and basically costs nothing from taxpayers.

It's a dumb idea anyways. People avoid the 401 due to insane traffic and this would just induce more traffic.

Yeah, Tampa did this too on SR618 about 20 years ago. Miami is doing a section right now on 395. Double-decking is unusual in North America since freeways usually have room to widen either side and environmental laws discourage it. Also in many cases, land values are low enough that it's cheaper to use eminent domain and widen the freeway than to build a long elevated structure.

In general, construction costs in both the US and Canada are growing faster than drivers' willingness to pay, so I'm not sure this kind of stuff will pencil anymore.

[mhays]

Widening gets much harder in a denser, expensive city. While 401 doesn't appear to be totally cramped based on a google view, there's not a ton of room around it.

I have no idea what land would cost including lawsuits, remediation, street realignments, demolition, etc. But it's easy to see land alone costing $100m+ per mile assuming $200/sf (Murica!) and 100' of acquisition. Maybe more relevant would be the political firestorm of taking thousands of private properties and destroying existing streets while spending many billions and disrupting commutes for several years at best.

Some areas appear to have easy answers for that width. Others would be much harder...they'd end up buying entire properties rather than just the first 50' of them.

[Innsertnamehere]

The way the press release reads is that the study is going to look at what's the best option for each portion of the corridor. The stretches which have a bit more space may just end up being widened the old fashioned way while the more constrained areas get a tunnel.

I suspect that they want tunneled instead of elevated for climatic reasons. A 50km elevated viaduct would be hell to maintain and operate vs. a tunnel given the salt and snow demands which occur in Toronto compared to places like Texas and Florida.