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Vicelord John Aug 27, 2010 4:57 PM

I think the key to a happy society is to shield it from anything potentially hamful to it's well being. Our mothers didn't shelter us enough so no we need the govt to do it.

In reality, there are but a handful of hotels doing parties. They are great money makers for struggling properties. I think the most strugfling one in town is the Comfort Suites Scottsdale/James Hotel/Mondrian Hotel/Hotel Theodore. It's been all those over the past 4 years and has had three different restaurant concepts. In other wprds, it needs the extra business. Other places, like valley ho, montelucia, wyndham phoenix, and the clarendon are all in need of business but not to that extent. Really they are just trying to keep people working.

I think the biggest factor in the county coming down on this was simply the abuse factor. You get a bunch of people dogether drinking heavily all day, snorting coke, and then driving home. Many od'd at these parties, and emt had trouble getting to them due to the crowd. There was also a risk factor with the electronics by the water and all that. Fire marshalls are notorious for really getting upset when thier max occupancies are ignired. There is also the highly increased DUI factor.

The bottom line though, is people will still party at the pool, they will just stay the night. The 100 or so who pay the nightly room rate and drink at the pool may make up for the other 200 who don't come. The valley ho is 159 for a room with two doubles. Split that four ways and it becomes cheap. Girls staycation. It sucks they can't have live music, but I don't think this will truly affect snyone but those who can't think outside tbe box.

Vicelord John Aug 29, 2010 7:52 PM

this guy is a (in Zach Galifanakis' voice from hangover) ruhtard.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/article.../urban_legends

scottkag Aug 29, 2010 9:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 4963909)
this guy is a (in Zach Galifanakis' voice from hangover) ruhtard.

http://www.foreignpolicy.com/article.../urban_legends

Oh yeah, tard city. Joel Kotkin is Richard Florida's arch nemesis.

Vicelord John Aug 29, 2010 9:33 PM

who is Richard Florida?

scottkag Aug 30, 2010 3:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 4964000)
who is Richard Florida?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Florida

He's the guy who is always talking about the "Creative Class". Mayor Gordon is a fan.

HooverDam Sep 4, 2010 8:18 AM

I thought this was neat....

Quote:

Mesa couple turns an empty pool into a greenhouse.
by Allie Seligman - Sept. 3, 2010 06:16 AM
The Arizona Republic
The grass in Dennis and Danielle McClung's front yard won't grow, and the peach tree they planted withered away.

But in the backyard, hidden beneath a tent-like structure is a thriving garden that produces enough food to feed the McClungs and their two children, Caden, 4, and Vedah, 2.


The Mesa family bought their house in October. The foreclosed property had been abandoned for years, and it showed. The carpet was gone, the plumbing was torn out and the cavernous 9-foot deep pool in the back was empty.

The location and bones of the house were enough to win them over, though, Dennis McClung said.

After McClung's aunt and real-estate agent Hilda Soto, told him that to satisfy his home loan he needed to fill or repair the pool - a project that would cost thousands of dollars - he came up with another idea.

"I couldn't picture it when he said (he wanted to build) a greenhouse" in the pool, Soto said.

The family got to work and after much research on the Internet, a few experiments and about $1,500 worth of steel cable, tubing, an evaporative cooler and other supplies, McClung made his dream a reality.

The pool now produces fruit, vegetables and herbs and is home to eight egg-laying chickens and more than 1,000 tilapia fish.

"It was all an experiment, and we've been improving it as we've come along," McClung said.

There was a lot of trial and error. They started with tomato plants in 5-gallon buckets, but it took too much water to keep plants alive in the harsh Arizona climate. So McClung researched hydroponics and outfitted the garden with tubes and pipes that carried water to the plants.

In hydroponics, plants are grown without soil, absorbing nutrients that are put into their water supply.

But that method was also costly - the nutrient solution is expensive, and making it at home requires more than a basic understanding of chemicals, McClung said - so he researched another method, aquaponics.

Now the system functions like a giant terrarium. The fish create nutrient-rich waste, which feeds the vegetable plants, which in turn purify the water, which is then returned to the fish pond. Duckweed, a floating aquatic plant, is also used to feed the fish and the chickens, starting the cycle anew.

McClung's method uses 80 percent less water than conventional gardening.

There are about 10,000 unused pools in the Valley, Dennis McClung said.

"If we can feed a family of four with one pool, then with those 10,000 pools we could feed Apache Junction," he said.

Danielle McClung said she was on board with her husband's plan from the beginning.

"He had a brilliant idea and I believed in it a 100 percent," she said. "It was completely genius."

Perhaps the biggest benefit of the garden is the decreased reliance the family has on traditional food sources.

"It's definitely made our trips to the grocery store much, much lower than if we were going to the store like everyone else," Danielle McClung said.

What they can't grow, they purchase or trade with others, using their produce and eggs to barter.

Growing their food also ensures quality. "We don't have to worry about where our food is coming from," she said. "It's definitely a wonderful thing."

Danielle McClung grew up on a farm in Ohio, where her mom canned fresh produce for the family to eat all year long.

"To be able to feed my children like the way I grew up, I think, gives them quite an advantaged life," she said. "We want to live long lives and we want to eat healthy and be healthy."

The McClungs eat differently now than they used to, with a diet heavier in produce and fish. They are more creative with their meals and pick herbs from the garden to make their own tea.

Dennis McClung said he can grow just about anything in the pool; his crop includes tomatoes, broccoli, peppers, berries, herbs and a mandarin orange tree. The fish pond, at the deep end of the pool, is about 3-feet deep. The chicken coop is positioned above it, and plants fill the rest of the pool.

Though the greenhouse takes time and energy to maintain, it has become the family's favorite spot to hang out.

"It takes work, (but) it's worth it to me to show my kids we don't have to live like everyone else," McClung said. "We spend probably more time in our pool than we would swimming."

He said the garden has changed the way the family lives. Danielle McClung works four days a week and Dennis McClung went from working seven days a week as a project manager at Home Depot to staying home with the kids and running 2012supplies.com, a website that sells survival supplies.

And his new new-found green thumb even inspired Soto to start her own small garden of melons and jalapenos.

Though she wasn't sure what to expect with the pool, said she is impressed by what the family has done.

"I just could not believe what he did with his swimming pool," she said. "He just transformed (it) into something that I think is really cool."

They also have their own site about it here:
http://gardenpool.org/

Crazy to think there are 10,000 empty pools in the Valley, seems like if even 100 or so were converted to uses like this it would be a very good thing.

combusean Sep 12, 2010 9:23 PM

So I think I have one of the shortest commutes in Phoenix now.

I've been working with ASU for the last 4 years or so and the funding for my position runs out in theory on 09/30. I was emailed a position a couple months ago for a company that was unnamed but I already knew who they were--"a socially responsible advertising firm" that I had walked by many times.

I emailed my resume last week and was hired. It's 650' from my front door to theirs.

www.riester.com I will be doing the same thing I've been doing for 10 years--backend web development--but it's the best run shop in Phoenix on multiple levels and I stand to grow substantially. Plus it's a 30% raise. =D

HooverDam Sep 13, 2010 4:15 AM

^Congrats. Though Ill bet some artist with an in house studio who just rolls out of bed has you beat commute wise :P

Here's something I've been noticing recently and wondering about. Most of the young, educated folks I know are sadly already out of Phoenix or are planning to leave. They go to Austin, LA, Portland, Denver or wherever. When they leave and go to these new cities, upon my arrival I find them living in inexpensive areas that Urban Pioneers would be expected to move to. They obviously want an urban experience and disliked growing up in a stucco covered sprawl neighborhood in Phx. However, they never would've considered moving to FQ Story, Coronado, Garfield, etc.

Why is this? Is it because they grew up hear and got so engrained to the notion that those areas were 'ghetto', yet upon arriving in a new city didn't have such notions? I know about a dozen close friends or family members who either have moved in the past 3 years or are planning to, and its all these sorts of situations.

I guess what I'm asking is, how do we prevent this? How do convince these young folks to stay in Central Phoenix and help make it better?

combusean Sep 13, 2010 5:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HooverDam
^Congrats. Though Ill bet some artist with an in house studio who just rolls out of bed has you beat commute wise

Technically I did work at home before, and still do for 2 of my 3 jobs. Riester is the only one that has a commute, however short. For the purposes of putting myself in the shortest commute category, I excluded those who work from home. I actually have to leave my house. =)

Quote:

Originally Posted by HooverDam
Here's something I've been noticing recently and wondering about. Most of the young, educated folks I know are sadly already out of Phoenix or are planning to leave. They go to Austin, LA, Portland, Denver or wherever. When they leave and go to these new cities, upon my arrival I find them living in inexpensive areas that Urban Pioneers would be expected to move to. They obviously want an urban experience and disliked growing up in a stucco covered sprawl neighborhood in Phx. However, they never would've considered moving to FQ Story, Coronado, Garfield, etc.

Why is this? Is it because they grew up hear and got so engrained to the notion that those areas were 'ghetto', yet upon arriving in a new city didn't have such notions? I know about a dozen close friends or family members who either have moved in the past 3 years or are planning to, and its all these sorts of situations.

I guess what I'm asking is, how do we prevent this? How do convince these young folks to stay in Central Phoenix and help make it better?

The cities you mention Hoover have an allure, culture, and employment market all their own. Portland is Portland--its the zenith of humanity for the 20-something. It's manageable and walkable without being a clusterfuck. Austin is a king of music on its own even moreso than LA and parts of Orange County. Denver exists as a special case. I haven't seen the draw to that city as far as I have LA and San Diego for my friends, but you can easily see its appeal--it's the largest city of its size in an area the size of Europe in a dramatic natural setting. It's the center of the entire Mountain West and has been for a hundred fifty years.

I think for Phoenix to join the ranks of those magnet cities it first has to manage its racial and immigration issues as a red herring to social progress.

The tacit admission from those that claim illegal immigrants are stealing jobs is that the belly-achers are competing with a workforce that's uneducated, largely illiterate, and desperately poor. It's the biggest admission of ineptitude and laziness imaginable.

Education, higher wages, and an effective moderately-taxed government will do wonders to bring about a satisfied, self-sustaining middle class. But first Arizona will have to deal with its profoundly stupid and paranoid xenophobic side that constantly votes against its own interests.

To do that, it requires Statehouse reform:
-- legislator pay increases to an executive wage: $24,000 to $85,000 so that people can actually become legislators without having become independently wealthy first, vastly increasing the pool of qualified candidates.

A better legislature would understand that at present, Arizona has the allure of Alabama in 1959. It'll take the slow federal action to undo stupidity at the statehouse and eventually indict people like Arpaio and fix a few things Congressionally here and there-- just like it did 50 years ago.

Phoenix's transition from Selma to Portland can only be hastened by a deep introspective look at our place in the country as one overcoming its challenges productively, not endlessly waging war on social change and civil rights.

--Tax code reform. Arizona could be flush with cash if its corporate tax code wasn't written by thieves. It needs to start over, with personal income taxes going up to more than the laughing stock of my paycheck.

If it can do the above and manage to reverse its economic decline with a plethora of green jobs and non-construction industries, Phoenix could be the next Portland in 15 years if we're lucky. Everyone--including the 20-somethings--that moved here in 2006 never knew about Evan Mecham.

Vicelord John Sep 13, 2010 6:02 AM

The way to stop it is to turn az into a blue state. Aint gon happen.

Leo the Dog Sep 13, 2010 4:08 PM

People chose to live in Phoenix because of the easy life-style, cheap rent, cheap housing, free parking. One can park directly in front of their dwelling for free. One can run errands on the fly compared to other cities where a plan may have to be made to coincide with transit times and available parking. This is why, I think families like to settle in Phoenix while the young, single, hip, highly mobile crowd moves on.

Central Phoenix's historic neighborhoods are almost more suburban in nature than the suburbs themselves. While they don't have the miles of stucco/tile, they do have larger lots, less pop. density with a heavy reliance on the auto. So, if I'm a young 20 something, looking for a cool city-like atmosphere, Central Phoenix wouldn't be near the top of the list even in Phx metro, I think parts of Scottsdale and Tempe are the bright urban spots in the metro and it this is where the young crowd settles when they move to the area.

Vicelord John Sep 14, 2010 5:30 PM

Ok nevermind i got too hot.

HooverDam Sep 16, 2010 9:37 AM

Hey so tomorrow (technically today but I haven't gone to sleep yet, so its Thurs. 9/16) there's a meeting with the City at 6pm to 7 about creating Phoenix's first Bicycle Boulevard. More info about the concept at the excellent Blooming Rock blog, here.

Here's the info:

Time 6:00pm - 7:00pm
Location City Hall
200 W. Washington St. 1st Floor, Assembly Room A
Phoenix, AZ

Im going to be there, some come out, support good urban planning in Phoenix and try to have a say! :D

EDIT: Heres a video that explains Berkleys nation leading Bike Boulevard system which makes the concept a bit more clear:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vX8wkI7CwpU

Don B. Sep 16, 2010 8:02 PM

^ Where are they planning to put this? Where is the funding coming from, given Phoenix's horrendous budget deficit right now? Great idea otherwise...

I always thought a street like Missouri could benefit from such a thing, but not on a major thoroughfare like Glendale or Camelback.

--don

HooverDam Sep 16, 2010 9:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don B. (Post 4983578)
^ Where are they planning to put this? Where is the funding coming from, given Phoenix's horrendous budget deficit right now? Great idea otherwise...

I always thought a street like Missouri could benefit from such a thing, but not on a major thoroughfare like Glendale or Camelback.

--don

Yah it wouldn't be major streets, it would be a series of neighborhood streets. As for where, if you read the Blooming Rock article it says they want to connect the Downtown Public Market, Christown Mall and Gateway CC. So it'll near the LRT line, but not exactly following the line.

The initial funding is coming from a federal grant they've secured.

SunDevil Sep 18, 2010 1:33 AM

It's Friday, happy hour time, so I talk some people at work into going to Hanny's I've never been there and wanted to check it out. We get there early since we get out of work early, however we're there until 6:00 and the place is virtually dead the whole time.

I don't get it, this is a place made for happy hour and they 1. don't have a happy hour 2. have hardly anyone stopping in after work? I just don't get it. $10 and you get 2 of the "little" martinis, that is plenty of booze for happy hour and I think that is a great price, so I get why they don't have a happy hour, but couldn't they just say something like "Happy Hour: $5 martinis $5 appetizers (they already have some around that price) $1 off all beers" would that be so hard? sorry that this is incoherent, I'm just befuddled.

Vicelord John Sep 18, 2010 4:00 AM

Ill forward your concerns to my friend alex who is the gm there.

Don B. Sep 21, 2010 2:51 PM

Personal update:

I lost my job seven weeks ago and have been surviving as best as I can. Unfortunately, I think the time has come that I depart Arizona for more positive climes elsewhere. I'm researching several possible locations, and there's no rush as I have unemployment that will last for some time. It would appear I'm overqualified for most legal jobs that are out there.

I probably can't handle cold at all, so truly chilly cities like Kansas City, Chicago and Boston or Philly are out. My short lists include:

Los Angeles
San Diego
San Francisco
Portland
Denver
Austin
Charlotte
Miami

:)

--don

Vicelord John Sep 21, 2010 3:03 PM

I've been looking at a portland or denver move lately as well.

Leo the Dog Sep 21, 2010 4:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don B. (Post 4988247)
I probably can't handle cold at all, so truly chilly cities like Kansas City, Chicago and Boston or Philly are out. My short lists include:

Los Angeles
San Diego
San Francisco
Portland
Denver
Austin
Charlotte
Miami

:)

--don

Don,
All cities posted are fantastic choices. If you're worried about chilly weather, then I'd think twice about Denver, Portland, and possibly even San Francisco.


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