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Metro-One Feb 26, 2012 6:08 PM

:previous:Thanks for the update, good to see that they actually are building an interchange there now.

But they are not installing dividers? Honestly, the median shoulder width they are building is designed for centre barriers, why not just put them in now how hard is that?

Daguy Mar 31, 2012 5:25 PM

:previous:

All of the recently completed sections of highway 97 are undivided with 2.6 metre medians. My guess is the traffic count isn't considered high enough to divide them yet, and it saves $$$.

The problem I have is that I've watched a fully loaded slow moving semi turn east from the west bound RIRO at white creek frontage road between Tappen and Blind Bay. I was coming around the bend from Blind Bay heading to Salmon Arm in the fast lane and nearly had to swerve to avoid collision. Had a median barrier been in place that idiot couldn't have made a highly dangerous and illegal turn.

Daguy Apr 15, 2012 1:38 AM

http://www.flickr.com/photos/bcgovphotos/6928051614/

Premier Announces Phase Two of the Cariboo Connector Expansion

Premier Christy Clark today announced an additional investment to the Cariboo Connector expansion, to widen 30 km of Highway 97 to four lanes between Prince George and Cache Creek. The provincial government is investing $200 million over the next five years for Phase Two of Cariboo Connector. It is a key part of the new Transportation Sectoral Strategy that commits $700 million over the next five years to increase capacity on key provincial highways and railways to support trade and economic growth.

go_leafs_go02 Aug 13, 2012 10:45 PM

The MOT is widening about 3.5km of Highway 3 approximately 15-20 km south of Princeton towards Manning Park.

http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/BCHighways/c...23159-0002.htm

Quite surprised by this, as I thought the Ministry had no plans to ever upgrade Highway 3 minus some safety improvements in a few of the tight corners and stuff.

Daguy Aug 14, 2012 5:37 AM

:previous:

Wow I'm very surprised by this as well. I was one of the first to quickly shoot down any four laning on highway 3 for at least 20 years, so maybe the thought is the area needs passing lanes, so might as well four lane it. In any case more 4 lane highway is never a bad thing.

go_leafs_go02 Aug 14, 2012 4:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daguy (Post 5797803)
:previous:

Wow I'm very surprised by this as well. I was one of the first to quickly shoot down any four laning on highway 3 for at least 20 years, so maybe the thought is the area needs passing lanes, so might as well four lane it. In any case more 4 lane highway is never a bad thing.

Yep - I travel the Hope-Princeton several times a year for recreational purposes, and never seen any traffic problems through there (and I do most travelling on summer holiday weekends)

It involves some minor realignment of the highway, and increasing the design speed and speed limit up to 100 km/h.

Wonder if they'll ever tackle any major bridge crossings over some creeks and rivers to remove some tight corners...

Mazrim Aug 14, 2012 7:00 PM

Likely they're following their mantra for the Trans Canada. Any improvements they make will always be 4 laning, so that eventually they can 4-lane the whole thing. Makes economic sense to 4 lane instead of adding a passing lane as well.

go_leafs_go02 Aug 14, 2012 7:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mazrim (Post 5798348)
Likely they're following their mantra for the Trans Canada. Any improvements they make will always be 4 laning, so that eventually they can 4-lane the whole thing. Makes economic sense to 4 lane instead of adding a passing lane as well.

However, they redid some bridge structures further west in Manning Park, (these were whole bridge replacements) and they constructed those with only 2 lanes total.

I know one segment is through a provincial park, while this is just surrounded by empty Crown Land, it's a different mantra in both cases.

Daguy Aug 14, 2012 8:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02 (Post 5798147)
Yep - I travel the Hope-Princeton several times a year for recreational purposes, and never seen any traffic problems through there (and I do most travelling on summer holiday weekends)

It involves some minor realignment of the highway, and increasing the design speed and speed limit up to 100 km/h.

Wonder if they'll ever tackle any major bridge crossings over some creeks and rivers to remove some tight corners...

Yeah there are some spots that could definitely use realignment, but as for traffic I think the same. I drove through Manning Park during the summer a couple years ago and it was very quiet. The four lane sections seemed overkill, though they would have been built before the connector when it was the main route to Kelowna.

Stingray2004 Aug 15, 2012 6:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by go_leafs_go02 (Post 5797389)
The MOT is widening about 3.5km of Highway 3 approximately 15-20 km south of Princeton towards Manning Park.

http://www.th.gov.bc.ca/BCHighways/c...23159-0002.htm

Quite surprised by this, as I thought the Ministry had no plans to ever upgrade Highway 3 minus some safety improvements in a few of the tight corners and stuff.

That section looks like it's just west of the Princeton copper mine and isn't that expensive to upgrade to a 100 km/hr design standard.

The winding Whipsaw Creek section, further west of there, has been identified for major upgrades since as early as 1988. Again, last year, mayors representing 23 communities along Hwy 3 identified their highest priority to be a Hwy 3 realignment from Sunday Summit to Whipsaw Creek.

That section is highly substandard late 1940's engineering. And I've been stuck crawling behind a slow-moving tractor trailer there too oft to mention. To bring that up to a 100 km/hr design speed would require big, big bucks and numerous bridges as well as massive earthworks.

With so many other expensive priorities, I can't see that happening for a long, long time.

Daguy Aug 15, 2012 7:27 AM

I'm surprized there havn't been any new HWY 1 tenders for four laning announced this summer. After the government announced $200 million for HWY 97, I thought they would pretty quickly. I know that there have been problems dealing with the Niskonlith between Monte Creek and Chase, but there are plenty of other areas which could use immediate widening as well.

On a great note though paving has started today on Phase 1 of the Monte Creek to Pritchard 4 laning project:

http://wcs.pbaeng.com/projects/R2-Hwy1-Monte

I drive through every week so I'm excited!

Yahoo Sep 12, 2012 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Daguy (Post 5799043)
I'm surprized there havn't been any new HWY 1 tenders for four laning announced this summer. After the government announced $200 million for HWY 97, I thought they would pretty quickly. I know that there have been problems dealing with the Niskonlith between Monte Creek and Chase, but there are plenty of other areas which could use immediate widening as well.

On a great note though paving has started today on Phase 1 of the Monte Creek to Pritchard 4 laning project:

http://wcs.pbaeng.com/projects/R2-Hwy1-Monte

I drive through every week so I'm excited!

I'm glad I'm not the only one who gets excited when new roads open.

It's pretty frustrating trying to find information about future projects or timelines for the #1 upgrade in BC. There seems to be no information.

With twinning something like 12km over 5 years it is hardly going to get that road twinned in our lifetimes. Or in the lifetime of a newborn! The road needs serious attention all the way from Kamloops to Alberta. The newest sections (and they're all way too short) just highlight how bad the current road is.

I always chuckle crossing the border and seeing the arrogant "Best place on earth" welcome to BC sign. The road in Banff is being doubled, yet the "best place" is a crumbling narrow 1 lane road. And unfortunately they're fixing the narrow bridges in Yoho park - which is a pretty good indication there are no plans to actually twin the road like the BC government says they will. I mean - you don't fix an old bridge if you're going to replace it or if you're about to expand it.

Metro-One Sep 12, 2012 10:43 PM

:previous:I believe the road through Yoho Park is a Federal responsibility. It actually annoys me that the entire stretch through Banff National Park has been upgraded to full freeway standards while our stretch through Yoho National has been given 0 attention. The Federal Government does have a long term plan to do so, we will see when that happens.

Yahoo Sep 17, 2012 7:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metro-One (Post 5829288)
:previous:I believe the road through Yoho Park is a Federal responsibility. It actually annoys me that the entire stretch through Banff National Park has been upgraded to full freeway standards while our stretch through Yoho National has been given 0 attention. The Federal Government does have a long term plan to do so, we will see when that happens.

It seems strange that the powers that be think it's okay to forget about the roads within Yoho. They're okay with no animal protection along the highway except in Banff, and no safe roads except in Banff. The road is double divided with animal fencing and overpasses to the east and west of Yoho, but they're fine with leaving the road unsafe within Yoho.

Yes, the roads through the national parks are federal. But I believe the provinces involved also help pay for it, much in the same way the feds help pay for provincial roads. If it wasn't for the Alberta government kicking in for the road through Banff it would still be as bad as in Yoho (and let's not forget about Glacier which is also single lane and in really need of an upgrade in BC). It's obvious no funding is planned since they're doing repairs on the pathetic bridges within the park - which you don't do if you're serious about ever upgrading the road.

The thing that really bothers me is that political parties in BC always state that if their party is elected they'll twin the road from Kamloops to Alberta. The latest winners even put up signs. But that's their whole plan. Put up signs and hope someone gives them some money someday. Until the people of BC actually demand some action on these promises nothing will happen. Timetables need to be set - even though we know they'll be decades late at least they'll have a plan.

It's strange - they increased gasoline taxes to pay for the roads. They admit that good roads are a huge boost to the economy - (efficiency, productivity, tourism, jobs), it also cuts pollution and saves a lot in terms of accidents, injuries, & deaths for people and animals. You'd think the number of road closures alone would prompt some action, but they seem fine with it.

One good thing about BC over Alberta though. In Alberta jobs tend to take a lot longer - crews seem to work in slow motion. Actually this last section in Banff is moving along nicely, but the first parts were built as slowly as possible. It's unfortunate though that the fancy new highway in Banff - the best in Alberta - is still set at 90 kph. It's 90 in unfenced narrow 1 lane highways, so the speed limit needs to be adjusted to 100 or 110 since that's what everyone drives anyway - including workers & police cars that aren't set up for traps.

It also bothers me when they fix a section outside the parks and don't divide the highway - like near Salmon Arm. Sure, they can add barriers later, but when a government says they'll do something later that tends to mean never - or perhaps in the next century when the death toll starts adding up.

Metro-One Sep 17, 2012 8:57 PM

:previous:Yeah, they keep chipping away at it so slowly, at least they are adding a decent section east of Kamloops now, with an interchange at Pritchard instead of the original planned intersection.

The new stretch through Yoho Canyon is pretty impressive and has its divider in place, and the final phase will be really amazing, so at least that will be another full 30km up to freeway standard.

Really, the Banff speed limit is only 90km?? Even the new highway 1 sections through BC are all 100km.

Daguy Sep 18, 2012 3:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Metro-One (Post 5834737)
:previous:Yeah, they keep chipping away at it so slowly, at least they are adding a decent section east of Kamloops now, with an interchange at Pritchard instead of the original planned intersection.

The new stretch through Yoho Canyon is pretty impressive and has its divider in place, and the final phase will be really amazing, so at least that will be another full 30km up to freeway standard.

Really, the Banff speed limit is only 90km?? Even the new highway 1 sections through BC are all 100km.

Yes that is because the speed limit in national parks is 90km/hr throughout Canada. I drive to Calgary a few times a year, and it is easily drivable at 110km/hr in most sections, and 100km/hr in the tighter areas. It doesn't seem to be heavily enforced, and most people from Alberta seems to do 100-110 anyway.

I wondered about this myself as the new sections have fencing and wildlife overpasses so why not 110? Apparently the noise from higher speeds disrupts mating patterns of some of the animals, according to my cousin from Alberta.

Even though I want and expected funding for Yoho, there are sections that are a bigger priority. I'd love to see it twinned too, but comparing it to more winding areas between Kamloops and Sorrento, such as Hoffman's Bluff and along Shuswap Lake, it's not bad. Plus there are twinned sections on either side of the park, so typically one doesn't get stuck that long except on really busy days. I'd rather see Kamloops to Revelstoke finished first (plus the nasty last few kms of Kicking Horse) and I know that's a little biased given I live in Salmon Arm, but I drive the other sections too on occasion, and honestly they're straighter and often in better condition.

craner Sep 22, 2012 6:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Yahoo (Post 5834611)
Yes, the roads through the national parks are federal. But I believe the provinces involved also help pay for it, much in the same way the feds help pay for provincial roads. If it wasn't for the Alberta government kicking in for the road through Banff it would still be as bad as in Yoho (and let's not forget about Glacier which is also single lane and in really need of an upgrade in BC). It's obvious no funding is planned since they're doing repairs on the pathetic bridges within the park - which you don't do if you're serious about ever upgrading the road.

I don't beleive this is true, at least in the case of Banff (i.e. I think the highway twinning was 100% funded by the Feds). In fact, I have heard it would have been done much sooner had the it been up to the province of AB but they didn't have any juristiction.

I too find it incredibly frustrating the lack of priority given to upgrading the TCH. I blame the Feds for the most part as I think the TCH should be part of a national highway system. As mentioned - there isn't even a real plan/timeframe for completing the twinning through BC. It's a total joke and incredibly infuriating.:hell:

Daguy Sep 23, 2012 6:14 PM

:previous:
Yeah on the one hand there are bigger priorities than Yoho, but on the other if the feds agreed to twin all segments in Mt. Revelstoke, Glacier, and Yoho National Parks, that would be around 100km of twining, and would considerably shorten the drive time.

Daguy Sep 23, 2012 6:15 PM

Double post deleted.

Yahoo Sep 24, 2012 8:49 PM

It's too bad - they just had a 50th anniversary ceremony for the Trans-Canada, http://news.gc.ca/web/article-eng.do?nid=696139 but no announcement of any Federal funding to fix it up in BC. That would have been the perfect time to announce new projects. So it's obvious we're going into the usual 5 year waiting period between batches of upgrades. And they're not done the last batch so it could be 6-7 years. (Man, I hope I'm wrong - there are still far too many dangerous areas being ignored).

Sadly, I think the announcements will be politically timed and will only occur when it makes them (prov & feds) look good when an election is coming. I think if we had elections every year we'd be done the road lol.

I recently emailed Infrastructure Canada about the schedule for twinning the highway in BC - at least in the National Parks and they told me the highway was a provincial responsibility and it was up to BC to request funding. When I pointed out that the National Parks are federal they corrected themselves. I think that speaks volumes. They're so busy waiting for provincial requests they aren't even looking at federal roads in the national parks. Hopefully complaints like mine will trigger some action.

I'm pretty sure Alberta started off the Banff upgrade plans by kicking in $50M - but perhaps I was thinking about something else. I know in Alberta they started removing the signs beside construction projects because the Feds complained. Lol, usually because it was "95% provincial, 3% local, and 2% federal" funding. So now it's often hard to tell who paid for what, but in the end it's Canadian citizens who paid 100%.

In any case, it makes no sense to upgrade the Alberta side and not the BC side - the traffic in that area between Banff & Yoho is the same at the border. Since the Feds should be focusing on federal roads they really need to have a plan for Yoho & Glacier - even if it's just a "design phase - awaiting funding" plan.

And yes, sadly it's 90 in Banff - even though it's easily the best highway in Alberta. The only justification I can see is that animals like bears can climb the fencing. But when you have such a sweet highway, and people are on 6-12 hr road trips it just doesn't make sense for people to slow down when the highway gets better. It's unsafe actually because there is such a mixture of speeds. People following the speed limit and people going 110 (including police when they aren't setting up traps right as you leave the park). Sure, the areas around the Banff townsite should likely slow to 90, but the road from Calgary to Banff is 110 - and it's not nearly as good at the 90 section within most of the park (some of the older parts are better suited to 90 - especially for all the tourist traffic in those older narrower areas - which by the way should also be upgraded)


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