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-   -   Canadian Airport Thread (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=153826)

zahav Oct 16, 2018 1:57 AM

YWG is fairly isolated meaning both YYC and YYZ are kind of out of the way compared to a direct flight. I'd be curious to see the numbers, if demand is actually there. If even WS only gives it once a week service, that doesn't say much for demand.

FI would be a good fit with the 757 though. Are they within range for the MAX9?

plrh Oct 16, 2018 2:37 AM

I would love a YWG-AMS direct as my inlaws live in the Netherlands. Usually fly through MSP. I have been shopping lately through KLM and AMS via YYC and YYZ are all similarly priced except the last leg is 2 hours shorter through Toronto and it's on a 747 which strangely excites me (have never been). The 737-8 Max and higher can reach London and AMS, barely. That would be nice.

YWG is closer than MSP to London and Amsterdam via the Rhumb Line.

J81 Oct 16, 2018 1:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ghYHZ (Post 8345805)
So in that context....wouldn't Winnipeg draw from all of Manitoba and anyone from Saskatchewan heading east to Europe so they're not going west first to YYC or YEG?

Yes and the total population within a 2 hr drive or 1/2 hr flight still wouldnt equal the number of people within the same distance as YHZ

J81 Oct 16, 2018 1:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8346155)
You guys are missing the point.

YHZ has non stops to Europe for 3 reasons.

1. Connecting anywhere else in North America is a significant backtrack.
2. Most YHZ-Europe flights can be operated by a narrowbody. This is the main reason for the new non stops to Europe in the last 5 years.
3. Demand exists on the European side to visit the Maritimes.

YWG doesn't meet any of these criterias, hence the lack of non stops to Europe. It has nothing to do with population.

Name me a European that has Winnipeg on his bucket list. Go to the Maritimes in summer and you'll see plenty of Europeans.

All that being said, I can see FI start YWG at some point.


Also, every town and city with an airport in Atlantic Canada has a flight to YHZ. It is a hub for the east coast This allows for lots of connecting traffic to Europe.

thenoflyzone Oct 16, 2018 1:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by zahav (Post 8346939)
YWG is fairly isolated meaning both YYC and YYZ are kind of out of the way compared to a direct flight. I'd be curious to see the numbers, if demand is actually there. If even WS only gives it once a week service, that doesn't say much for demand.

FI would be a good fit with the 757 though. Are they within range for the MAX9?

YWG-KEF is 2429 nm. Well within range of the Max 8 or Max 9 (3550 nm). Once FI gets more Max 8s (they only have 3 at the moment), I fully expect them to give YWG a go.

esquire Oct 16, 2018 1:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8347197)
YWG-KEF is 2429 nm. Well within range of the Max 8 or Max 9 (3550 nm). Once FI gets more Max 8s (they only have 3 at the moment), I fully expect them to give YWG a go.

A route like that would be perfect for the 737 MAX. There is some interest in Iceland as a destination in its own right and I know there is a small but steady trickle of Icelanders who visit Manitoba. But the ability of leisure travellers to have a relatively low-priced option to get to Europe using the KEF gateway would really bolster the numbers.

By my math even Ireland is well within the 737 MAX's range from YWG, although I'm not sure how the economics work out when it comes to travelling such a long distance with such a small pax count.

wave46 Oct 16, 2018 3:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8347197)
YWG-KEF is 2429 nm. Well within range of the Max 8 or Max 9 (3550 nm). Once FI gets more Max 8s (they only have 3 at the moment), I fully expect them to give YWG a go.

I think the limiting factor to any flying to Winnipeg might be the congestion at Keflavik airport. I don't know what plans there are to expand there.

But yes, I expect that once there is enough space, Winnipeg will be on their minds for expansion.

SaskScraper Oct 16, 2018 5:10 PM

I fly from England back home to Saskatchewan a lot and I've found my best options are through Calgary or Edmonton.
British Airways, KLM & Icelandair which codeshare with Westjet, or Westjet direct to London. If Winnipeg expands its Gatwick service it won't likely add much savings in $ or flight time for me since Winnipeg (& Toronto for that matter) isn't much less flight time than Alberta is (its 9 hours London to Calgary, 8 hrs London to Toronto).

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1970/...5f51744b_o.png

Most of my flights from Europe to Saskatchewan have been either through Alberta or Minneapolis. I'd imagine most people flying Winnipeg - EU would be traveling through the same, plus Chicago and maybe down-east through Toronto if need be.

Keflavik is quite crowded when all its flights land and if operating on limited time to get through customs & get to the departure gate. The airport is expected to expand six-fold in the next 22 years to handle 25 million passengers though, at which point I'd imagine Iceland will be Winnipeg's next EU entrance point unless Schiphol or Frankfurt beats it to the line. It's the smaller western cities, that don't have/limited direct flights to Europe that IcelandAir will be targeting in the next decade or two.
In the future, Iceland Air as a hub would likely also be Saskatoon's return to non-stop flights to Europe.

https://farm2.staticflickr.com/1910/...ecd7a941_b.jpg
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CYzJ1mK73IQ

https://icelandmag.is/article/keflav...-six-fold-2040

jmt18325 Oct 16, 2018 5:30 PM

There is no more Ba code share with Westjet, just FYI.

SaskScraper Oct 16, 2018 5:42 PM

^ yes, I wrote that very confusing, not sure how to write in differently...:shrug:

oh wait! I'll write it with a bolded period instead of a comma this time :tup:
<Edit>
"British Airways. KLM & Icelandair which codeshare with Westjet, or Westjet direct to London..."

esquire Oct 16, 2018 5:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaskScraper (Post 8347491)
Most of my flights from Europe to Saskatchewan have been either through Alberta or Minneapolis. I'd imagine most people flying Winnipeg - EU would be traveling through the same, plus Chicago and maybe down-east through Toronto if need be.

I'd be pretty surprised if Toronto wasn't where the vast majority of YWG-originating travellers connected. I'm sure MSP is likely #1 among US airports (capacity to ORD is pretty minor with only 2 CR2s a day).

I suspect an increasing number of EU-bound travellers are going through YYC as the options there grow and there's also YUL, but YYZ is probably still dominating.

LeftCoaster Oct 16, 2018 6:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pinus (Post 8346667)
The demand is there for Winnipeg-London, but due to the hub-and-spoke model being forced upon us, any potential growth we would have is stifled, especially by YYC.

Keep in mind hub and spoke works both ways, so while the WS hub is YYC, there is a hub on the other end in British Airways as well. If the traffic AND yield truly was there BA could send a spoke from their hub to YWG. BA has been starting a lot of smaller NA markets in the last year or two, and that they have not gone to Winnipeg is probably a sign they don't see the yield there.

I do agree with the forumers here that Icelandair is probably the perfect partner for YWG, with its great connections to many European destinations, non-reliance on business class, and right sized aircraft.

SteelTown Oct 16, 2018 8:10 PM

North America’s Fastest Growing Airport Provides Significant Economic Value to Hamilton

http://flyhamilton.ca/news/north-ame...e-to-hamilton/

HAMILTON, ON (October 15, 2018) – John C. Munro Hamilton International Airport has been recognized by Airports Council International as being North America’s Fastest Growing Airport after achieving an 80% growth in passenger traffic in 2017. Hamilton International also remains Canada’s largest overnight express cargo airport with a 14% year-over-year increase in cargo activity. This represents exceptional growth in both the passenger and cargo segments of Hamilton International’s business.

......

Over and above Hamilton International supporting just under 3,500 direct, indirect and induced jobs in the Hamilton region, the Airport’s activity reaches into the broader province with an additional 4,000 jobs.
When comparing this activity from 2017 to the results of the previous study conducted in 2013, the comparison shows growth across every economic metric and demonstrates the growing positive impact that the Airport has on the region, including a 25% increase in jobs created since 2013. Specifically, direct employment of 2,300 jobs associated with Hamilton International could even be considered as ranking the Airport as the ninth largest employer in the City of Hamilton.

jmt18325 Oct 16, 2018 9:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaskScraper (Post 8347530)
^ yes, I wrote that very confusing, not sure how to write in differently...:shrug:

oh wait! I'll write it with a bolded period instead of a comma this time :tup:
<Edit>
"British Airways. KLM & Icelandair which codeshare with Westjet, or Westjet direct to London..."

Sorry, my bad.

SaskScraper Oct 16, 2018 11:20 PM

^^ no worries, I often like to introduce myself as...

"Hello, my name is German Bold Italic!" ;)

https://youtu.be/4Fw2Labli4k

casper Oct 17, 2018 5:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaskScraper (Post 8347491)
I fly from England back home to Saskatchewan a lot and I've found my best options are through Calgary or Edmonton.
.....

For 13 years I lived in Saskatoon and would regularly need to travel to Europe for business.

I almost always found Calgary the best option. The one exception is from time to time in the summer Air Canada would operate the Saskatoon-Ottawa flight as a Saskatoon-Ottawa-Halifax flight. When they did and the schedules worked the fastest route from London to Saskatoon was always via Halifax with a fuel stop in Ottawa.

thenoflyzone Oct 17, 2018 6:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casper (Post 8348085)
When they did and the schedules worked the fastest route from London to Saskatoon was always via Halifax with a fuel stop in Ottawa.

thats one hell of a milk run....;)

nname Oct 17, 2018 10:37 AM

Looks like a route being converted to mainline:

Code:

AC 810        333        24567        YUL - ALG        21:15 - 10:00
AC 811        333        13567        ALG - YUL        13:00 - 16:35

AC is running out of 800-series numbers... I guess if YVR-DUB ever going mainline, it would be AC 804/805 then...

p_xavier Oct 17, 2018 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SaskScraper (Post 8347865)
^^ no worries, I often like to introduce myself as...

"Hello, my name is German Bold Italic!" ;)

https://youtu.be/4Fw2Labli4k

Haw! I loved that song.

casper Oct 17, 2018 2:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8348089)
thats one hell of a milk run....;)

Yes it is but due to connections it was always the fastest route door to door


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