My understanding was that they did not want to damage the agricultural land in the Turtle Valley, and it would have still required maintenance of the existing route. However, would a bypass have offset the maintenance cost by increasing economic activity? It would reduce the drive time between Salmon Arm and Kamloops to well under an hour, which would attract shoppers and commuters from Salmon Arm to Kamloops. Also it would decrease shipping costs and drive times for trucks.

^The bypass seems to make all kind of sense to me.

^There's politics in there somewhere for sure, not wanting to bypass the towns for political reasons would make sense.

Donald and Kicking horse are proceeding
 

According to Revelstoke news reports today (Nothing on the BC gov sites - as they're always the last to be updated lol), the small #1 twinning project by Donald (just west of Golden) has been funded and will proceed this year. Hopefully it will fix up the forced highway lane changing and merging mess they created by the weigh scales!:tup:

Unfortunately it'll still leave a long section just west of Golden that isn't twinned, and won't be twinned for at least a decade or more. It's not even on the long term radar even though it's a relatively straight and flat section that's always packed with convoys of vehicles stuck behind one clueless or frightened driver)

The expensive kicking horse 4 km section just east of Golden is also finally funded but will take a frustrating 2 years before they start and another 7 years at least to finish. So 9 years to twin 4 km! (more if you count all the years waiting around for funding). I'm glad it's happening - but personally I think it would be more effective to fix up more km of danger zones for the same money - but hey - when politicians are running for election they want sexy projects. Either way it'll be good to get this dangerous roadblock out of the way!

The news reports speculate that at ~$450 M it might be the most expensive highway in Canada. Perhaps by km, but no where near for example the price of the ring road around Calgary. (Add in Edmonton and my guess is those 2 new highways in AB could perhaps cost more than the entire twinning project in BC and will certainly finish many years before BC ever gets serious about twinning the highway). But that's just speculation on my part about the costs - especially when BC will be spreading the twinning cost over their 100-200 year construction timetable :haha:. (They speculate 60 years - but lets be realistic here - it'll take a lot longer than that)

If they ever get around to funding and doing the projects they announced but haven't actually proceeded with it looks like they'll be about 40% done the twinning project in about 10-20 years. And I don't think that counts the federal parks sections which have all but been ignored in BC for 60 years. So all told nobody reading this in 2017 will be around to see the #1 twinned between Kamloops and Alberta in their lifetime.

But on the bright side even baby steps by BC are better than nothing.:cheers:

On the sad side there was another head on fatality on the #1 around Blind Bay - which of course we can assume wouldn't have been a fatality if the highway was twinned and properly separated. (Another flaw we see in BC is some of the twinned sections don't have any medians or barriers between lanes - except of course if you consider paint on pavement as a complete safety measure :koko:) Oddly if you talk to a politician or BC transportation you'll hear that "safety is their #1 priority :shrug:)

That was an odd post....

Thanks for the information though.

And yes, they do mean per km. Your comparison of the Calgary and Edmonton ring roads shows exactly why it is so hard to build highways in BC.

If BC were flat like the parries it would be much easier, cheeper, and quicker to twin the entire highway 1 project.

Sadly Canada does not have a national highway program, so BC has to spend its highway dollars on the Vancouver region (criss crossed with wide rivers and inlets), Vancouver Island (mountains, inlets), and of course the mainland (mountain ranges after mountain ranges, deep canyons, inlets, etc...). The massive changes in geology from spot to spot also does not help.

The only areas that the feds will pay for are the national parks, which they are finally starting to do in Yoho Park.

I agree that more focus should be made on the #1 in BC though, the speed is construction is too slow for my liking as well, and Salmon Arm should be completely by-passed.

Well that's exciting. I'm happy this is finally starting.

Definetely good, but I wanted to re-fresh myself with the design, and I may be wrong, but looking at the alignment it looks like there will be no tunnels anymore, just bridges.

Maybe someone else can double check for me.

The lack of tunnels in Canada (North America in general) has always amazed me. So many tunnels in Europe and Asia. I was recently on a small island here in Japan (population only around 30 thousand) yet the island has about 6 or 7 road tunnels...

The geology in Japan may be easier to build tunnels through, but still...

^ do you have a link to some detailed alignment maps? I can only find some 'project overview' maps with nothing for details.

http://www.kickinghorsecanyon.ca/khc_maps.htm

That is the one I was looking at, it directly labels the bridge sections, but fails to show any tunnels (it also labels all the retaining walls).

Also I can't find the 3D fly through video of the project, showing the tunnels, anywhere on the website (I only searched for about 5 minutes though)

Here, you can see a more detailed map:

http://www.kickinghorsecanyon.ca/khc_phase-4.htm

They didn't go with the long tunnel plan. This one was far less expensive. It looks like they've dropped the plan to eliminate the traffic lights in Golden for now.

Not talking about the 3km long tunnel concept, that was scraped years ago, the concept that I am talking about had 2 tunnels and a couple bridges. The longest tunnel section being around 450 meters long.

Don't care if this section has tunnels or not, it will just be good to have it completed and if no tunnels means a lower cost then that is a good thing too.

Maybe some of the savings could go to the Golden-Donald section, like others have said - it is a most frustrating section.

Yahoo!! :fireworks
I'm very excited to hear the final section of Kicking Horse is finally going ahead. I will admit to being a little disappointed there are no tunnels and the traffic signal is remaining in Golden but those were just little "bonus" items for me anyway.
QUESTION: Will the section near the tall retaing wall that is currently 3 lanes become 4 lanes as part of this project ? I always found it strange that it wasn't built with 4 lanes in the first place.

What I find slightly more frustrating is the 2 year wait before construction starts. I would have thought with all the time waiting for funding that this project would be ready to go to tender as soon as funding was secured. And, as mentioned, lets hope BC doesn't go with no center barrier/median as they've been known to do.
All in all though, I'm very excited.

As for fixing up the Donald weigh scales section, that is good news too. Everytime I drive through there I think "why wasn't this done right when they built it?". Rediculous that you need to switch lanes.

And finally: I too would like to see the section west of Golden twinned. It seems like simple terrain to allow this (relatively speaking of course).

It's been a good few months with this announcement and the Yoho announcement earlier. I won't live long enough to see the TCH twinned from Kamloops to Alta border but I do have hope that some reading this will. :)

Yes - it wasn't made 4 lanes because the alignment wasn't finalized.

^Oh good - thanks for confirming.

I posted this in the Canadian section:

So to go with this conversation here are the planned upgrades for highway 1 near chase.

Looks like the preferred options are to be grade separated (one protected T will be constructed west of these projects).

Here is the preferred option for the western portion of Chase. Grade separated:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2179/3...4ec88036_o.jpgChaseP1 by Ian, on Flickr

Here is the runner-up option, also grade separated:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2454/3...f5ab9ca2_o.jpgChase1B by Ian, on Flickr

And here is the at grade option:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/1/697/32...04c6a0b2_o.jpgChase1C by Ian, on Flickr



Now on the eastern half of Chase, here is the preferred grade separated option:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2644/3...4e5f6534_o.jpgChase2A by Ian, on Flickr

And the at grade option:

https://c1.staticflickr.com/3/2100/3...40c4af71_o.jpgChase2B by Ian, on Flickr


There will be another access point east of Chase for a few properties. It says that it is technically "at grade" but a closer looks shows that there are no movements across traffic (no break in the median divider).

So it looks like the interchanges are the preferred options, but it never hurts to help by sending in your comments to the BC ministry of Transportation supporting the grade separated interchanges for these projects.

2022 is the expected completion dates. So Kamloops to Chase will be 4 lanes the entire way when these are complete with primarily interchanges (as stated before).

Option Chase P1 is the preferred option, and they are just completing the Traditional Use EA for this section (Traditional Use EA is an environmental assessment that has active participation of all local First Nations (Neskonlith, Adams Lake, Little Shuswap, Splatsin, Shuswap) in the study, so they have direct input into the EA and also the "value components"). Chase east is a different contract, and they will be completing the Traditional Use EA for that section later this year.
MoTI is going this route to use Trad EA's for Highway 1, because these First Nations have reserves and traditional territory along most of the corridor to Alberta. Makes it easier from a permitting standpoint to address any FN concerns while highway design and studies are being completed, as they can adjust if required before spending a lot of money on design and survey.

It looks like they are starting construction for the new on and off ramps at Hwy 91 and 72nd Ave. They have heavy equipment and storage containers on site and today I saw a small crane there from the Alex Fraser Bridge.

TransCanada Highway expansion updates:

Bids were opened on Feb 24th for the Highway No. 1 TCH - 202 St. to 216 St. Highway widening and 216 St. Interchange project. Construction start should follow soon.

http://i67.tinypic.com/33kd9v4.png


http://i66.tinypic.com/15qcegl.png


TCH No. 1 - on Vancouver Island - the Malahat Village Safety Improvements will be awarded soon. This includes:

-Expanding five kilometres of highway to four lanes with wider shoulders
-Installing three kilometres of median barrier
-Providing improved and safer highway access through a frontage road system and consolidated accesses

The median barrier and frontage road system is much needed in this area.

There will also be another widening project for the TCH. No. 1 - within greater Victoria between Leigh Road Interchange and the Westshore Parkway - coming out later this year. Yay!

The TCH No. 1 and McKenzie Interchange project in Greater Victoria is well underway - the tender for Phase two will be out this spring.

Well highway 1 west of Revelstoke is shut down again today because of yet another head on collision. It's support to be shut down for 10 hours without a detour. Last week highway 97 south of Kelowna was shut down for several hours without a detour because a semi hit the concrete median, and an oncoming vehicle smashed into the concrete as it was pushed into the traffic.

When the F with the province start building highways with proper earthen divided freeways?

I dont think that is economically viable in many places in BC.

This exact debate already happened on the Canada section about 2 weeks ago. Just go back a few pages and reread that entire conversation.

Odd in what way?

I gave info, gave personal opinion. Isn't that what a discussion forum is all about?

Maybe it's because I put too many points in one post. :shrug: That's what paragraphs are for :haha:

I think the biggest issue in BC is that past governments virtually ignored the transcanada highway for the first 50 years after it was built. It wasn't the old excuses about geology or difficulty of terrain. They didn't even twin the relatively flat easy sections - and yes there are flat easy sections.

I might complain about the current pace - but I'm thankful that the current trend is to actually start twinning! I'm disappointed though that easy stuff like safety barriers dividing the finished highway aren't the standard. (3 semi accident yesterday with 1 death).

I just don't like the political double-speak where they imply they're twinning the highway when they clearly aren't. (Even members of their own party were fooled into thinking the 10 year plan for twinning meant it would be twinning it all in 10 years). They're twinning sections of the highway so putting up signs implying you're twinning it all is just a political lie. (It would be like NASA putting up a sign saying they're building a Mars base- sure someday)

I find it odd too that one reason they chose the bridge etc building by Golden over the tunnel is they could do the build in stages - yet we have to wait 2 years for them to even start. And then they're starting on it all at once. Oh well, glad they're starting it.:)

That excuse is getting old. The example I give is the 450 km "Cariboo Connector" from Cache Creek to Prince George. It's flat and mostly rolling hills. Very easy ground, much easier than most of the US or anything outside of the Prairies in Canada, and yet the province wants to do 4 laning with no proper medians the entire way.

I don't appreciate you trying to stifle constructive criticism of BC highways. If Glacier wants to ask the question, he has a right to do that without people directing him to another thread.

I agree with you Glacier the excuse of "economic feasibility" just doesn't work for BC's pathetic highway system. Especially when they have a perfect example of how a highway through the mountains is SUPPOSED to be constructed less then an hour south of our border:

http://i66.tinypic.com/jrafkj.png

When is BC going to wake up and do TWO staggered cuts in a mountainside for opposing directions of traffic

SOUTH BOUND
http://i65.tinypic.com/11hdz49.png

NORTH BOUND
http://i67.tinypic.com/2cp5nol.png

Note the wide shoulders, steel guard rails (using them on the edge of a drop off is more appropriate than cement barriers), and rumble strips on BOTH sides. These are design features BC refuses to incorporate into the highways it builds.

I wonder when that section of the I-5 was constructed, because it's not too different from Highway 1 east of Bridal Falls.

image: http://i.imgur.com/M3xbyo6.jpg

link to similar section of bc1

Now considering when this section of highway 1 was built, the funding allocation/mechanisms may have allowed this type of construction, I don't know. It doesn't seem too far out too suggest that earthern barriers are outside the modern BC twinning budget.

Cariboo Connector? Yea sure. Places like kicking horse? definitely not.

Having driven the Cariboo Connector many times one reason for not spending the money on a earthen divide is the relatively low traffic count. I do agree that all the new 4 lane sections should have the concrete medium barriers in place (many of the new sections don't, which iI do think is penny pinching).

People look at specific road (such as the Cariboo Connector) and say that it is not so expensive to have an earthen divide, but the thing is the MoT has to share the same pot of money for the entire province. So to do so on the Cariboo Connector might mean the cancelation of a 4 landing project or two along the #1.

This earthen divide debate feels like an annoying distraction seeing how many first world nations use them sparingly (or not at all) and their highway networks are world class. Concrete barriers get 99% of the job done for a fraction of the cost. More than one way to skin a cat.

If earthen divides are the be all and end all that means every single urban highway in North America that only uses a concrete divider is a sub standard design ;)

Focus this energy where it should be, such as demanding that the MoT use interchanges on their upgrades and not traffic lights.

A 4 lane highway divided by a concrete barrier is a very standard highway design throughout the world, and given BC's relatively small population (with far flung pockets of population), vast expanses, rugged terrain of mountains, canyons, fiords, rivers, etc..., and the lack of a true federal highway program means that the extra expense for an earthen median is not worth it.

Our older highways did use them because highways were cheaper to build in the past, much of BC didn't have enough population to support 4 lane highways outside of the south coast, and most of the areas that have them are incredibly flat and easy to do so (most of the 99 and #1 through the valley is flat as a pancake).

Maybe if the island highway was built as a 4 lane highway with a concrete median instead of the earthen median it has it would have been built as complete free flow as originally intended with no traffic lights... (I am aware that there were other issues at play, but just maybe there would have still been enough funding left to build all the interchanges, which is far far far more important than an earthen barrier).

I agree.

The Cariboo Connector has the traffic that highway 1 had when it was twinned between Chilliwack and Hope, and growing rapidly every year. If they don't do it properly the first time, it becomes prohibitively expensive, and given the long distances from anything up there, it's even more important to have fast, efficient highways in the 21st century.

Please straighten out Highway 3! It looks like a heart monitor readout haha! It should only take us 4-5 hours to get to Vancouver but instead it takes 7-8!
Glad they've done some work on the Hope Princeton recently.

Anyone know the plans for the improvements of the #1 just east of Golden? saw signs for the project driving through there last weekend...

Yea, that section just got funded. The design has changed a lot from the original concept, it's all bridges now, and no tunnels. There's a bit of discussion on the previous page.

Original concept was just a tunnel.

Second concept was a mix of tunnels and bridges.

Now it is only tunnels and large amounts of blasting / retaining walls, and it will still be the most expensive stretch of highway in Canada ever built.

The curse of BC's topography.

Is there any concept drawings of the finalized design?

I read that the phase 4 section is very unstable and that is maybe why they are going the tunnel route. I could be totally out to lunch though.

Sorry, I meant only bridges.

The stability issue is largely why they are not using any tunnels now.

There is one schematic available on the official website.

I did not know this! Do we have any documents/images/concepts of this?

Just announced: Six laning Highway 1 from 216th to 264th!

There once was an entire 3D fly through video, but that has now been removed.

The link is unlisted, but I saved it a while ago.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oBLRAGu1Ujw

Thanks for posting that, looks great! even though it's going to be almost a decade before it's done, this is desperately needed.

So is that video of Kicking Horse Phase 4 the current plan ?

No, that was the previous one.

The new alignment is essentially the same, but they will be using a few more bridge structures and will blast away the mountain sides, and then use retaining walls, instead of the tunnels.

Very North American style.

Phase 4 of the Kicking Horse Canyon, preliminary concept, included a tunnel as well as rock sheds/snow sheds on the western half. The cost thereto would have likely been closer to $650 million as opposed to the $400+ million in the final design.

Same 100 km/hr design speed except that the tunnel/rocksheds/snowsheds have been replaced by retaining walls as well as cantilevered highway/additional bridging. Brought down the cost. From BC MoTi:

here are the drawings for phase 4. The project is officially still in design, so this may be updated, but it's the latest version
https://www.th.gov.bc.ca/kickinghors...-D_REDUCED.jpg

^ Looks good, i went back a few pages but couldn't find any timeline info. Is there an expected start and end date yet?

The start date is 2019.

Awesome! - thanks for posting that.