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Okstate Mar 13, 2009 6:31 PM

I love how these multi million $ deals get planned for years by fairly smart groups of people then one day:
In my humorous imagination this is how it goes- a pimple faced 19 yr. old intern speaks out..."ummm i don't think it will all fit on there, sir" To which the officials say, "get outta here kid & get me some coffee." As the kid closes the door feeling ridiculous, the men look at each other & whisper, "damnit!"

zilfondel Mar 13, 2009 7:51 PM

This is why real estate firms should first hire an architect or planning firm to figure out those pesky details...

MarkDaMan Mar 13, 2009 10:21 PM


said the proposal to build a new baseball park next to the Rose Garden threatens the future of the Blazers' business
This is really one of the more ridiculous things I've heard.

-The Blazers have not done anything with the property they have owned since the arena opened 12 years ago, even when the Pearl and SoWa took off from nothing during that same time period. Without presenting a development plan for their property, they now deem the city property necessary to their business model?

-The Blazers have complained about the burdens associated with the MC and their agreement with the city for the original funding for the Rose Quarter.

-The Beavs play on the exact opposite side of the calendar than the Blazers, bringing more bodies into the area for potential businesses year round. Businesses that would, in theory, be renting from buildings owned by the Blazers...or Vulcan, or whoever.

I've come around to love the Blazers again. I sure hope their administration doesn't come along acting all cocky and spouting nonsense, reminding me what a jack-assed organization they are, and a fool Paul Allen can be.

NewUrbanist Mar 16, 2009 6:31 PM

Has anyone tried to go to a bar after thirsty thursdays at PGE Park? First - they stop serving beer early (I think it was the 6th inning), so loads of people are still thirsty at the end of the game - especially if the games go into overtime.

My friends and I tried to grab beers at the Marathon during the summer, but there was so many people flooding the nearby bars that there was a bouncer, a line, a fee, and the place was packed inside for the rest of the night. We opted for Muu Muu's on 21st which wasn't quite as busy with game -goers.

This made me realize that attendees from the suburbs are often only willing to walk so far from the game to have a drink/ socialize afterwards. The Rose Garden doesn't have much nearby, so people tend to either stop on the way home elsewhere, or just drive/MAX home afterwards. Development could be timed to allow for the nearby construction of medium sized restaurants/ pubs nearby that can handle the heavy flows after events. If I wanted to continue living in this city, I would love to try and build small jewel box like bar with outdoor/ rooftop seating at that broadway triangle in front of left bank.

RoseCtyRoks Mar 18, 2009 8:54 AM

Here's an Oregonian article from Mark Larabee with an artist's rendering of a baseball park, and obviously no M.C., at the Rose Quarter, if this were to happen.

Maybe one of you wouldn't mind bringing up the picture onto this page. Thanks, in advance!

JordanL Mar 18, 2009 11:33 AM

MarkDaMan Mar 19, 2009 12:48 AM

^Hmmm, so the opening of the stadium is looking at the I-5 and Lloyd instead of towards the Pearl, downtown, the Willamette River and/or Broadway bridge?

I know that grain silo blocks a lot of any view towards downtown, but I don't think it will be there forever.

twofiftyfive Mar 19, 2009 1:46 AM


Originally Posted by MarkDaMan (Post 4147779)
^Hmmm, so the opening of the stadium is looking at the I-5 and Lloyd instead of towards the Pearl, downtown, the Willamette River and/or Broadway bridge?

I know that grain silo blocks a lot of any view towards downtown, but I don't think it will be there forever.

You can't have the batter facing southwest into the setting sun.

PacificNW Mar 19, 2009 5:26 AM

↑ Yup, open air baseball stadiums playing fields are specifically designed in such a way to minimize the impact of the sun.

Okstate Mar 19, 2009 6:55 AM

Outfielders don't wear black marks under their eyes for style?

zilfondel Mar 19, 2009 10:38 AM

This one's a bit bigger. From the Oregonian.


Drawings show an open-air but covered courtyard with a stage, surrounded by the businesses and outdoor seating. One idea is to use Memorial Coliseum's roof but take out the walls and remake what's below. Another drawing shows a baseball stadium with the entertainment district in the place of the Blazers' office building next to the Rose Garden.
^ I like these ideas. Much more sustainable, too.


But he now says he was misunderstood. He supports Major League Soccer coming to town and even thinks a baseball stadium in the Rose Quarter could bring more people to the area. But it can't be built "at the expense of the live district," he said.

"We're very supportive of having it all," Isaac said. "But just replacing Memorial Coliseum with a baseball stadium will leave us as a facilities district."


It's not certain where in the Rose Quarter the stadium would go. The city's agreement with Paulson calls for it to be built where Memorial Coliseum now stands. But Adams said that was a scriber's error and that an exact footprint has yet to be determined.

MarkDaMan Mar 25, 2009 2:04 AM

Baseball stadium, Live! district may join Rose Quarter

Plan to bring MLS to Portland may include replacement of Memorial Coliseum
Daily Journal of Commerce
POSTED: 04:00 AM PDT Tuesday, March 24, 2009

As Portland Timbers owner Merritt Paulson pursues his goal to bring Major League Soccer to Portland in 2011, plans for the Rose Quarter are still a work in progress.

Paulson last week received approval from MLS to begin the franchise in Portland, on the condition that his company, Shortstop LLC, and the city forge a partnership to renovate the Timbers’ stadium, PGE Park.

The $124 million deal includes moving Paulson’s baseball team, the Portland Beavers, to a new stadium in the Rose Quarter.

“The baseball stadium is a huge space eater,” said J.E. Isaac, senior vice president for business affairs for the Portland Trail Blazers. “The size of the stadium means there are only a couple places to put it.”

The challenge may be finding room for the new stadium and a Live! district that the Blazers have proposed to co-develop in the Rose Quarter. The Live! district would be a destination entertainment district with retail and restaurants that would attract visitors to the Rose Quarter during Blazers and Beavers games, but also on days and nights when there are no games.

In one scenario, the entertainment district could replace the Blazers’ 65,000-square-foot office building. In that scenario, the Beavers’ stadium would replace Memorial Coliseum. In another scenario, the new entertainment area could use the shell of Memorial Coliseum, which would be reconfigured from a large sports/entertainment venue into the Live! multi-use venue, and the Beavers stadium would have to be in another area of the Rose Quarter.

The Live! district proposal is based on a development approach by the Baltimore-based Cordish Co. Cordish has developed and planned entertainment venues called Daytona Live! and Philly Live!, that include restaurants and casinos. The company was also behind Baltimore’s Power Plant Live! – the redevelopment of two vacated blocks into an entertainment district near the city’s Inner Harbor.

“It’s critical to have the Live! block immediately adjacent to the Rose Garden and as close to the Convention Center as it can be,” said Isaac.

City Commissioner Randy Leonard said the Cordish proposal “is a good starting point.”

However, he added that he wants to “better understand the Cordish model. It needs to be an approach that really reflects Portland. I’m not sure the Kansas City or Los Angeles model really translates to Portland.”

He said the Live! district should focus on attracting local businesses, such as the McMenamins pub and brewery chain.

“We need to take a look at the entire [Rose Quarter] site and make a decision about what works best,” Leonard added.

Blake Cordish, vice president of development for the Cordish Co., said his company would not use a cookie-cutter approach for the Rose Quarter district and that he is “committed to developing a world-class project that reflects Portland’s unique and creative culture.

“The vision of the partnership is to create a district that embodies the principles of sustainable development and that is authentic to Portland,” Cordish said. “It is not appropriate to use any of our existing projects as examples except from an overarching commitment to our quality and dedication to long-term ownership. The ultimate vision for the Rose Quarter and the timing of development depends on many factors, including input from the Portland community and reaching an agreement with the city.”

The Live! block could have restaurants, clubs, a 2,500-seat music venue, boutique hotel and a “Nike experience” area, Isaac said. That would be phase one, and in phase two the development could add a residential component and office space.

Isaac said Blazers management first learned of Cordish when the company responded to a request for proposals several years ago to manage the Rose Garden. In the intervening years, he said Cordish had “perfected” the Live! concept, and the Blazers initiated contact with Cordish about bringing it to the Rose Quarter.

“When you do something like this you have to have gravitational pull,” said Isaac, referring to the right blend of entertainment and restaurants. “It’s got to have its own draw, separate from the (Rose Garden) or (Beavers) stadium that it’s adjacent to.” Earlier attempts at having restaurants near the Rose Garden failed because they could not attract people to the area on non-game days, Isaac said.

Whatever the mix of restaurants and other activities, Isaac said the Live! block would use “cutting-edge sustainability principles.” He said “a big portion” of the block’s energy should be created on-site through the use of solar panels or wind turbines.

Though the economy is in a recession, Isaac said it’s important to begin planning now. “By the time we would be leasing (Live! space), I’m hoping we’ll be in a new business cycle,” he said.

zilfondel Mar 25, 2009 10:11 PM

Reviving the Rose Quarter
by Douglas L. Obletz, guest opinion
Saturday March 21, 2009, 9:06 AM
Douglas L. Obletz

Consider new, old ideas for creating a dynamic vision

With Friday's announcement that Major League Soccer is coming to Portland, we have a rare opportunity to make sustainable, long-term decisions about the Rose Quarter that can help cement its place alongside Portland's other exciting neighborhoods and create an anchor for economic development for the east side from which all Portlanders can benefit.

What's needed now is for the community, political leaders and the sports and entertainment interests to immediately begin working together toward a shared vision of a successful and sustainable Rose Quarter. Here are some ideas, new and not so new, that will help create that dynamic vision:

Minor league ballpark: A baseball stadium should not be shoehorned onto a demolished Memorial Coliseum site that would stand empty half the year. Instead, put it on the site of the Portland School District's oversized and outdated Blanchard Education Center just north of Broadway.

By moving the school district's administrative offices and warehouse to smaller, more energy-efficient buildings (or vacant space downtown), the district will save on operating costs; and the eight-block site will extend the Rose Quarter and its development opportunities.

This site is big enough to accommodate a stadium for the minors today that can be readily expanded for Major League Baseball in the future. Smart.

Save Memorial Coliseum: The Coliseum, which turns 50 this year, is just now old enough to be considered a historic landmark, but it has not worn out its usefulness. Don't tear it down -- do the Portland thing: Re-use it. By saving the glass box and removing the seating bowl, we can create a huge, flexible space and fill it with new uses.

A 2004 proposal to convert the Coliseum to the Memorial Athletic and Recreation Center, or MARC, is a big, bold Portland idea.

Portlanders paid for the Coliseum originally, and they should be given a chance to decide its future. Let's ask if they are willing to convert the Coliseum to a public sports and recreation center with pools, gyms, indoor soccer and lacrosse fields, a velodrome and indoor track open to all, with scholarships and grant programs to make sure no one gets turned away.

Let's also do what's right for our veterans by integrating a highly visual and accessible memorial.

Paul Allen's arts and entertainment center: With removal of the unsuccessful office and retail building and redesign of the large plaza west of the Rose Garden, there is plenty of room for the venue envisioned by Allen, extending the legacy of great entertainment in the Coliseum. Elvis, Dylan, Hendrix, Ike and Tina, even Evel Knievel rocked the Coliseum.

With the MARC and baseball stadium in the neighborhood, we'd build new memories. Everybody wins.

Health and wellness center: Area hospitals are interested in building health and wellness facilities that can have a truly positive impact and help reduce the cost of health care by teaching people healthy lifestyles. With Portland Streetcar crossing the Broadway Bridge this year, the accessibility of the Rose Quarter by public transit, bike and auto makes it a natural for this use.

Nike Oregon Sports Museum: This belongs in the MARC redevelopment, and it would have a lot more synergy with the thousands of kids and adults that would use those athletic facilities every week.

Other opportunities: Let's redevelop the old Red Lion Hotel site for housing to help open up underutilized waterfront properties and create more public access to the riverfront. And on Broadway, north of the Coliseum, there are two blocks that are a key gateway to the Lloyd District which could be developed compatibly to enhance the economic growth of the area.

Community: There is one other critical piece of this vision. Let's figure out a way to bring together the best resources and talents of the city, the neighborhoods surrounding the Rose Quarter, the Blazers, Beavers, Nike, Columbia Sportswear, Adidas and other members of our sports industry.

We need the cycling, fitness and running communities, the local soccer and lacrosse clubs, local hospitals and youth sports advocates, downtown and Lloyd District business interests. We need the people of Portland.

Let's make the Rose Quarter a showplace for Portland's sustainability and healthy lifestyle, its commitment to families, its love of participant and spectator sports and entertainment. Let's make it a place the people of Portland can be proud of and a place that captures the essence of Portland's livability.

Creation of a certain urban growth boundary in 1973 gave us guidance and made us the envy of national planning -- it's high time we do it again. The Rose Quarter can be a centerpiece for Portland's vision. The place is here. The time is now. It's up to us.

More information:

-- Douglas L. Obletz is president of Shiels Obletz Johnsen Inc., a Portland- and Seattle-based development and project management consulting firm.
image hosted at
courtesy of the Oregonian

zilfondel Mar 25, 2009 10:13 PM

Portland Architecture on the Rose Quarter redevelopment:


Instead of tearing down Memorial Coliseum for the ballpark, Obletz says, we should build the stadium across Broadway on the site of the Portland Public Schools Blanchard Education Center, which he calls "oversized and outdated."

And regardless, I think Obletz's proposal is much, much better than what the Blazers and Beavers owner Merritt Paulsen have planned so far.

twofiftyfive Mar 26, 2009 1:16 AM

The city does not own all the land on that alternate baseball stadium site. PortlandMaps shows the assessed value of one of the blocks at nearly $5 million. Even if the city used eminent domain, that would significantly increase the cost of the stadium.

JordanL Mar 26, 2009 5:00 AM


Originally Posted by twofiftyfive (Post 4160237)
The city does not own all the land on that alternate baseball stadium site. PortlandMaps shows the assessed value of one of the blocks at nearly $5 million. Even if the city used eminent domain, that would significantly increase the cost of the stadium.

The BESC is most of that space, and Multnomah County and Portland Public Schools jointly own that I believe... or perhaps it was PPS that owned it and Multnomah that rented space, I can't remember.

Anyway, PPS has been trying to get out of that building for almost four years.

MarkDaMan Mar 26, 2009 5:50 AM

^much longer than four years! I remember hearing about PPS moving all the way back to mid 90's.

JordanL Mar 26, 2009 6:39 AM


Originally Posted by MarkDaMan (Post 4160682)
^much longer than four years! I remember hearing about PPS moving all the way back to mid 90's.

True, but I mean actively looking for buyers. I mean they'd been "looking" for someone to purchase Washington High for years too, but it wasn't until a few years ago that they actually got something going. There was no effort.

BESC is a hideous building. I would support the bond measure just to see it torn down.

scottyboi Mar 26, 2009 5:17 PM



BESC is a hideous building. I would support the bond measure just to see it torn down.
Many people would say the same for Memorial Coliseum...

JordanL Mar 26, 2009 5:59 PM


Originally Posted by scottyboi (Post 4161261)

Many people would say the same for Memorial Coliseum...

I'm actually of the opinion that MC is pretty ugly, but many here aren't.

It doesn't even begin to approach BESC though.

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