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-   -   noirish Los Angeles (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=170279)

Scott Charles May 31, 2018 8:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Otis Criblecoblis (Post 8205326)
Scott, something involving view-camera movements seems to me to be the only way to achieve an undistorted projection--unless, of course, what was projected was distorted to compensate, or composed so as to mask the distortion. The fact that the area is rectangular implies a rectangular projection, which suggests an optical compensation.

I too am fascinated by the question. Now, where's my time machine?

I'm glad that you “feel my pain”, Otis Criblecoblis ;) - boy, I'd love to see how they worked out the problem. If you find your time machine, please allow me to tag along for the ride!



Since the horse trough in my prior post was identified so quickly, does anyone care to take a stab at the object below? Even a wild guess? Maybe it's some kind of portable fortune teller's booth?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Charles (Post 8204051)
Does anyone know what this object is?

https://i.imgur.com/5HfPOrc.jpgLINK to full sized image

It looks like we are seeing the back of a little blonde haired girl kneeling, but maybe not... if so, she seems out of proportion with the man in the foreground (the girl appears too large). Black smoke appears to surround the object, but I believe the “smoke” is actually some kind of stain on the photographic negative.

The object, which may be some kind of cart or vehicle, seems to be highly ornate and decorative, and the design seems to feature Indian style, Ogee arches.

Anyone have any ideas what this thing was?



John Maddox Roberts May 31, 2018 10:05 PM

The kneeling figure seems to be facing one or two others. Position of the arms suggest holding/playing a musical instrument. Maybe a publicity display for some show in town? My best guess.

ethereal_reality May 31, 2018 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ScottyB (Post 8205316)
Great photo album, very interesting! Looking the opposite direction from previous view:
https://farm1.staticflickr.com/874/4...e9d34d8b_h.jpg

I've been puzzling over this location....my first thought was Lucky Baldwin's Ranch (present-day Arboretum in Arcadia), but I can't place the streets or the rather unique streetlights; I can't find that layout in any of the maps I've looked. (Looks like a three digit address on the left palm.) Stumped!

Oh my! I could not figure how you found this view Scotty B.
Then I realized I missed the photographs the seller posted at the bottom of the ad. :

Here are two additional views of this same boulevard with the unique street lights. (minus the dog)

IMAGE 3

IMAGE 4

and the IMAGE I posted yesterday.

ethereal_reality May 31, 2018 11:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HossC
I'm going to guess that the photographer was in the YMCA building at 715 S Hope.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...922/50NKR5.jpg

Thanks for figuring out the location Hoss (and FW) It makes sense that the GIs stayed at the YMCA.



originally posted by HossC
https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...924/ikycP6.jpg

I see the extraordinarily tall flue I mentioned earlier (circled in red). It's directly behind (or attached to) the First Congregational Church at 845 S Hope.

I can't think of any reason a church would need such a tall flue :shrug:


__

Flyingwedge Jun 1, 2018 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Charles (Post 8204051)

Does anyone know what these two objects are?

https://i.imgur.com/5HfPOrc.jpg

The object, which may be some kind of cart or vehicle, seems to be highly ornate and decorative, and the design seems to feature Indian style, Ogee arches.

Anyone have any ideas what this thing was?


Then there's this object that looks like something out of Stonehenge. It appears to be too tall (let alone, too narrow) to be any kind of guard rail. It does not resemble any horse-hitching post I've seen before. Beyond that, I'm stumped.

https://i.imgur.com/F4PeAqQ.jpg

Any idea what this object is?

The Indian-style cart seems unrelated to the business it's parked in front of (an Oyster bar/restaurant), but the cart could be
a rolling advertisement for another business, similar to what John's Pipe Shop had. Or perhaps the cart is an old parade float?


Also, regarding the water fountain/trough at Main, Spring, and Ninth, the somewhat utilitarian incarnation shown in your
close-up might be the one described here (so the Horse/Man/Dog fountain installed in September 1907 apparently didn't
last very long, although the exact reason for its removal is not given):

http://i1165.photobucket.com/albums/...psfhjmobzr.jpg
http://i1165.photobucket.com/albums/...s.jpg~original

July 26, 1910, Los Angeles Times @ ProQuest via LAPL

BDiH Jun 1, 2018 12:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handsome Stranger (Post 8205871)
Indeed. And...challenge accepted!

BTW, thanks for the snap of the Vine St. Brown Derby & Satyr Book Store, ER. I have never seen it from this vantage point and did not know a porte-cochère was there!

I still have books in my collection with the Satyr Book sticker, as well as some from Gilbert's (around the corner on the Boulevard) and Pickwick. Pickwick was the bookstore in Hollywood, opened by Louis "Mr. E" Epstein, back in 1938. His son, Aaron, still operates the Artisan's Patio, just east of the old site.

ethereal_reality Jun 1, 2018 1:37 AM

Here's an amazing cabinet card.

SELLER'S DESCRIPTION: "Santa Monica California G.A.R. Encampment 1895 Boudoir Cabinet Card Photo"

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...921/FYX42f.jpg
picclick (no longer listed)

The G.A.R. encampment might have taken place in Temescal Canyon (the eventual home of the Chataugua camp), but this location appears to be quite flat.

Can anyone think of a suitable place other than Temescal Canyon?
__

p.s. I believe the date on the card is August 11th, 1895.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/3...922/DMJUXh.jpg

hmmm, the 5 also looks like a 0...or an 8 (what do you guys think?)

Scott Charles Jun 1, 2018 1:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by John Maddox Roberts (Post 8206287)
The kneeling figure seems to be facing one or two others. Position of the arms suggest holding/playing a musical instrument. Maybe a publicity display for some show in town? My best guess.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Flyingwedge (Post 8206450)
The Indian-style cart seems unrelated to the business it's parked in front of (an Oyster bar/restaurant), but the cart could be
a rolling advertisement for another business, similar to what John's Pipe Shop had. Or perhaps the cart is an old parade float?


Also, regarding the water fountain/trough at Main, Spring, and Ninth, the somewhat utilitarian incarnation shown in your
close-up might be the one described here (so the Horse/Man/Dog fountain installed in September 1907 apparently didn't
last very long, although the exact reason for its removal is not given):

http://i1165.photobucket.com/albums/...psfhjmobzr.jpg
http://i1165.photobucket.com/albums/...s.jpg~original

July 26, 1910, Los Angeles Times @ ProQuest via LAPL

It does look like there are another two people seated opposite, John Maddox Roberts. I wish there were a closer photograph of this “vehicle” to gather clues from...

Very interesting regarding the vehicle from John's Pipe Shop, Flyingwedge! It seems reasonably enough to assume that my "mystery vehicle" is probably something similar.

I guess I probably won't be able to find any definitive answer to what my vehicle is. Thanks, you two, for giving it a shot, anyway! :)

Very interesting article on the fountain, Flyingwedge - it's amazing the amount of information the forum members have been able to find about the horse trough... thanks again to all who responded! :tup:

ethereal_reality Jun 1, 2018 2:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Handsome Stranger (Post 8205871)
Indeed. And...challenge accepted! :typing: (Tho the results are not 100% satisfactory.)

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...923/yhEHLK.jpg

Thanks for the improvement Handsome Stranger. I appreciate it.


This poor guy is having car trouble.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/8...921/bWTgRz.jpg
DETAIL

Are my eyes playing tricks on me, or is this a slight pull-over area with an opening to let you walk to get help/or gas.

__

Handsome Stranger Jun 1, 2018 3:36 AM

BDiH, I've never heard of the Artisan's Patio until now. I'll have to go investigate it this weekend.

ethereal_reality Jun 1, 2018 4:07 AM

re: mystery cart.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Charles
Maybe it's some kind of portable fortune teller's booth?

Like you Scott, the first thing to come to mind was a mobile fortune teller. (mechanical)

Next, I thought it might be an oyster cart since it's parked directly in front of an oyster house.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/8...923/5U4mAQ.jpg
DETAIL

But oyster carts tend to be utilitarian.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...924/dbSvsJ.jpg
DAILY MIRROR, LOS ANGELES
__


and too...

It came as a big surprise that slides were projected onto the sides of buildings back then. (like a steam-punk Blade Runner)

Next you'll tell me there were dirigibles flying around too. ;)

https://imageshack.com/a/img923/3111/TaxR7h.gif
CECIL B. DeMILLE'S 'MADAM SATAN' [1929]

__

Lojack Jun 1, 2018 4:50 AM

So in a current GSV of the intersection, you can see the old location of the trough on the corner, and while there is a divider just to the south, it now has art and vegetation. Did they remove the facilities, or just pave them over?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Scott Charles (Post 8205019)
I'm not certain whether or not I possess an ounce of brains, rentatrip, but I would no more expect a person from 2018 to recognize an urban horse trough any more than I'd expect a person from 1917 to recognize an electric car charging station. An utterly anachronistic object is hardly obvious to a person who has never seen one before.

I don't know how long it's been since you visited downtown LA, but I can assure you that horse drawn carriages are becoming a bit scarce in the area.


Wrong.

Your conveniently tiny image hides a fact that everybody here is already aware of - your arrow is pointing at a public toilet, not a drinking trough.

As seen from the north side. Men can be seen entering and leaving the underground restroom. You can even see the head of a man as he descends the stairs:

https://i.imgur.com/vae74wp.jpgLINK

As seen from the south side (and a close-up of the very same image you just posted):

https://i.imgur.com/5y0hxqb.jpgLINK

Here's a top-down illustration if you're still confused:

https://i.imgur.com/icNbZlR.jpg


Scott Charles Jun 1, 2018 5:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lojack (Post 8206698)
So in a current GSV of the intersection, you can see the old location of the trough on the corner, and while there is a divider just to the south, it now has art and vegetation. Did they remove the facilities, or just pave them over?

This has been discussed on the forum previously, but I can't locate the relevant posts - my forum-searching skills are not that great, sadly.

If I recall correctly, most people here assumed the restrooms were just paved over, with the restrooms themselves still lying underground to this day. It would be really interesting to visit that area today with a steam shovel!

odinthor Jun 1, 2018 5:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 8206664)
re: mystery cart.

Like you Scott, the first thing to come to mind was a mobile fortune teller. (mechanical)

Next, I thought it might be an oyster cart since it's parked directly in front of an oyster house.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/8...923/5U4mAQ.jpg
DETAIL

But oyster carts tend to be utilitarian.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...924/dbSvsJ.jpg

_________________________________________________________

https://s26.postimg.cc/jxx79kpt5/Mn3n_Det.jpg
odinthor collection

"a fine place at Third and Main atop which he put the cart."

_________________________________________________________


Quote:

Originally Posted by ethereal_reality (Post 8206664)
DAILY MIRROR, LOS ANGELES
__


and too...

It came as a big surprise that slides were projected onto the sides of buildings back then. (like a steam-punk Blade Runner)

Next you'll tell me there were dirigibles flying around too. ;)

https://imageshack.com/a/img923/3111/TaxR7h.gif
CECIL B. DeMILLE'S 'MADAM SATAN' [1929]

__

______________________________________________________

Madam Satan, a film I very much like! Die Fledermaus with a dirigible!

https://s26.postimg.cc/x3cpfaefd/Madam_Satan.jpg
pinterest

CaliNative Jun 1, 2018 9:18 AM

How is the "noirish era" in L.A. defined?
 
By age, anything before the 1960s, say? By events, really dark events? The era when "film noir" was made? Every era is colorful to those living in it. Will our era seem "noirish" and quaint in 50 or 60 years? Most "noirish" era ever? Maybe the "Dark" Ages, after the collapse of the western Roman Empire? But I'm sure the ordinary people living then lived in a technicolor world and lived as best they could. And the eastern empire, Byzantium continued. And China was booming. Every era has some "noire" aspects. Best "noirish" T.V. series.......77 Sunset Strip, or Perry Mason, or maybe Hitchcock Presents? All in glorious black & white.

CaliNative Jun 1, 2018 9:30 AM

delete

CaliNative Jun 1, 2018 9:38 AM

[QUOTE=ethereal_reality;8205043]That's a much needed improvement Handsome Stranger.


So I take it this slide is Ektachrome :yuck: as well.

https://imagizer.imageshack.com/v2/1...924/LlDkLp.jpg
EBAY

The grand old Richfield Oil tower is unfortunately just out of the photo on the left. Richfield was my favorite "noirish" L.A. building. It was especially magnificent at night, with the "oil derrick" spire lit up. Almost 380 feet to the top of the spire. Second in height to City Hall in the '50s. A pity the ARCO towers project couldn't have built around it & preserved it, but it was viewed as an aged relict (as were all the Victorian neighborhoods on Bunker Hill), so it was torn down in 1968/69. "Progress"? Thankfully many of the 'noirish" buildings around Broadway survive. Eastern Columbia is great. Like someone said, freeway medians were quite primitive and inadequate before the 1960s and 70s.

Scott Charles Jun 1, 2018 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliNative (Post 8206795)

The grand old Richfield Oil tower is unfortunately just out of the photo on the left. Richfield was my favorite "noir" L.A. building. It was especially magnificent at night, with the "oil derrick" spire lit up. Almost 380 feet to the top of the spire. Second in height to City Hall in the '50s. Like someone said, freeway medians were quite primitive and inadequate before the 1960s and 70s.

CaliNative, are you saying that you actually saw the Richfield Tower in person?

If so, (1) that's amazing, and (2), could you describe what the lights on the “derrick” actually did? I've heard the lights were animated, and simulated an erupting geyser - is that correct?

The Richfield Tower is one of my favorite LA buildings, too. I wish I could have seen it - it was torn down while I was still an infant. :(

Of course, I'd LOVE to see a movie of the tower's lighting, but I don't know that such a thing exists.

Quote:

Originally Posted by CaliNative (Post 8206795)
A pity the ARCO towers project couldn't have built around it & preserved it, but it was viewed as an aged relict (as were all the Victorian neighborhoods on Bunker Hill). So it was torn down in 1968/69. "Progress"?

If the Mona Lisa, Acropolis, and Notre Dame had their home in Los Angeles, they too would have been considered “relics” and gleefully destroyed in the name of progress. It's a travesty what was done to Los Angeles in the name of “progress”. :pissed:

MichaelRyerson Jun 1, 2018 2:14 PM

Help! Anybody know where...
 
the Arlington Hotel was located? And where was 'the Tenderloin'? I know, I feel like I should know this but the only 'Tenderloin' I'm familiar with was in San Francisco. Can't find the Arlington on any of my maps and, of course, the Tenderloin' wouldn't be noted by any cartographer. Thanks.

HossC Jun 1, 2018 3:27 PM

:previous:

I don't know what time period or area you're looking for, but I found some Arlington Hotels in the CDs. Pre-1900 there seems to have been one in Riverside and one in Santa Barbara. After 1902 there are a few references to an Arlington Hotel at 214 Commercial Street, although this one was called New Arlington House in earlier CDs. After 1934, another Arlington Hotel appears at 611 E 5th Street. This one was previously known as the Hoover Hotel, and seems to have been built as a rooming house in 1913. It's currently St Mark's Hotel.

There's no mention of the Tenderloin in the CDs.


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