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PhxDowntowner Jun 7, 2011 6:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5306940)
This is a move from Midtown, though. Correct?

Even if that's true, it could still be positive b/c maybe it frees up space/opportunity for some other company farther out than Midtown to come to Midtown. And then maybe some other company way out on the fringe moves inward to fill that company's spot. Incremental shifts to the center; squeeze it in, people! :banana:

I dunno, just a thought.

westbev93 Jun 7, 2011 9:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DowntownDweller (Post 5306922)
My company is moving its AZ HQ to CityScape in a few months. Wonder if I'll still be working here by then.

Are you the one who mentioned their company moving out of Park Central? It would be nice to see that go back to retail use rather than office. There is already a ton of empty office in midtown to fill if somebody were really interested in moving closer to the core. I was speaking with a colleague in court yesterday, and his building at 3101 Central is over 30% empty (just one example of many in midtown).

HooverDam Jun 7, 2011 10:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PhxDowntowner (Post 5306744)
I think the key to getting companies to HQ in downtown, aside from financial incentives like TIFs, is the residential. If downtown becomes a place that a quality workforce wants to live (and can from a capacity standpoint, which we currently don't have), more companies will eyeball downtown as an attractive location. So basically I think we need more quality housing downtown to increase our appeal to HQ location decisions.

That's certainly true. But how do we attract more folks to live Downtown without the jobs and retail that make up an urban life in the 1st place? Its the whole chicken-egg situation as always.

I think maybe a big part of it is shade and trees. If you make the Downtown core the shadiest, most walkable, most misted, well awned (is that a phrase? I'm trying to say, 'place with most awnings'), et cetera place in town I think thats the 1st big step that the City itself can take. Put in the infrastructure for the pedestrian lifestyle, even if there's not a super abundance of places to walk yet, and maybe it'll all grow from there.

Quote:

Originally Posted by westbev93 (Post 5307291)
Are you the one who mentioned their company moving out of Park Central? It would be nice to see that go back to retail use rather than office. There is already a ton of empty office in midtown to fill if somebody were really interested in moving closer to the core. I was speaking with a colleague in court yesterday, and his building at 3101 Central is over 30% empty (just one example of many in midtown).

Thats disappointing to hear. A healthy Midtown is good for Downtown, in an ideal world Midtown would operate as office relief for Downtown with slightly lower rents.

I agree that it would be nice to see Park Central have more retail. I'd love that parking lot out front to be turned into a park/square ("Park Central Square" perhaps) with towers (20-ish stories) to the North & South with retail on the bottom floor. That area could be one of the best spots for grocery and other large-ish scale retail in the Central core.

E: Regarding turning Park Centrals surface lot into a great public space for Midtown, check out this awesome planned public square for Masdar, UAE:

http://inhabitat.com/lavas-winning-d...darcitycenter/

Those giant lilipad shade structures are reminiscent of FLW's Johnson Wax Bldg and more locally of the 44th St/Walter Bimson Valley National Bank and its 'mushrooms'. Those pads open during the day & close at night, I imagine they could be closed during the nice winter months to allow more sun into the plaza too.

westbev93 Jun 7, 2011 10:34 PM

Making downtown more friendly at the human level would help bring more uses of all kinds. That means shade here. It's hard to convince businesses or people to move to an urban environment, which is supposed to be pedestrian friendly, when the weather can be so oppressive. Plus, shading is very cheap compared to the other silver bullets we keep trying.

Midtown office is in rough shape. Many firms are moving downtown due to the cheap rents and proximity to the courts. Then the midtown offices just sit vacant. As for cheap midtown rents, I can tell you that my building (3003 central) is just as expensive, if not more, than comparable buildings downtown. For so long there was such an aversion to downtown that midtown was actually cheaper. That's how so many law firms ended up in midtown and are only now going back downtown due to new class a buildings and an improved perception of downtown overall.

I don't agree with the perception, but for many years lawyers wanted midtown because their clients perceived it as nicer/safer/cleaner/more expensive than downtown.

Park Central is the only realistic option for large-scale retail in the core. In this economic client, it will be far easier to revamp the existing large-scale buildings on that site rather than build all new somewhere else.

Vicelord John Jun 8, 2011 12:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by westbev93 (Post 5307352)
I don't agree with the perception, but for many years lawyers wanted midtown because their clients perceived it as nicer/safer/cleaner/more expensive than downtown.

I've always had the same perception, as long as I am on Central. Go one block off central and all that shit is out the fuggin window. I don't want to be anywhere near 3rd ave and Osborn at any time of day.

Buckeye Native 001 Jun 8, 2011 1:24 AM

I also used to work at Park Central (did you by chance work for United Healthcare, Downtown Dweller?) and the lack of things to eat (within a certain price range) around there drove me nuts. If I wanted decent food for lunch, I had to go either up to Camelback or closer to Downtown, which took a significant chunk of time off my lunch break factoring in traffic and other miscellaneous issues.

And yeah, I used to send packages from the post office near the Safeway on 7th and Osborne. That area's gone to hell (Indian School looks worse).

I'm not sure if it would be easy or cheap to turn Park Central back into a retail center. The interior is a clusterfuck of weird corridors and oddly-proportioned offices.

DowntownDweller Jun 8, 2011 2:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5306940)
This is a move from Midtown, though. Correct?

That facility is moving to CS. There are 6 valley locations, we are going to 2, with the HQ in CS, and the IT-types down by the Broadway Curve. There's a lot of pissed off people in the IT camp.

westbev93 Jun 8, 2011 3:19 PM

Weird corridors and offices are easier and cheaper than new buildings. For all the offices in the area, Park Central is extremely light on retail and restaurants. One can only eat Thai Basil so much.

On top of that, you have all the nearby historic neighborhoods that need and would support larger-scale retail that they now travel to Colonnade/Town & Country for. If Park Central will be empty, it seems very logical to replace the office with the original intended use of retail.

Back to the discussion about 7th Ave and McDowell, I keep riding by on my bike, and I still don't see anything going on at all.

PhxDowntowner Jun 8, 2011 3:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by westbev93 (Post 5308042)
Back to the discussion about 7th Ave and McDowell, I keep riding by on my bike, and I still don't see anything going on at all.

It's not quite at 7th Ave, but are you guys aware of the work happening around 335 W. McDowell? (used to be Sage Antiques)

westbev93 Jun 8, 2011 3:58 PM

Didn't pay any attention to that this morning. I'll look on my way back home. What's going on there (or is that what you are asking)?

PhxDowntowner Jun 8, 2011 6:45 PM

Ashley Harder recently bought it and is going to turn it into a unique space with 2-3 (probably 3) merchants. Probably a blend of food & retail; she's still nailing down those details.

She's had a "housewarming" for it -- hosted a Radiate -- opened for First Friday with 4 artists, a food truck, and multiple table vendors -- and is having Short Leash there for lunch every Wednesday (as in *now*) this summer.

nickw252 Jun 8, 2011 10:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by westbev93 (Post 5308042)
Back to the discussion about 7th Ave and McDowell, I keep riding by on my bike, and I still don't see anything going on at all.

I live right by 7th Ave and McDowell and go by there frequently. I also haven't seen any work. Keep your fingers crossed.

nickw252 Jun 8, 2011 11:36 PM

Horne Building at 7th Ave & McDowell
 
I walked over by the building today at about 3 PM and there was no construction. The inside looks the same as it did a few weeks ago. It's completely gutted and looks like it's ready for something to move in but no work is being done.

http://i51.tinypic.com/rh1q80.jpg

http://i51.tinypic.com/1zdskl1.jpg

http://i55.tinypic.com/2d8jsy0.jpg

http://i52.tinypic.com/2ztkj77.jpg

westbev93 Jun 8, 2011 11:53 PM

And that's how it has looked for months. The only work that I've seen since Horne apparently sold the building last fall is the jack-hammering of a small portion of the facade on the north side of the building.

nickw252 Jun 9, 2011 3:26 AM

Does anyone know if there is parking at the Flagstaff Amtrak station? I've googled it and can't find a definitive answer.

I'm thinking of taking Amtrak to Kansas City this fall for a wedding.

Buckeye Native 001 Jun 9, 2011 5:11 AM

Yeah, there's long-term parking there, but not much. There's also a couple of city-run parking lots near the station, but one's currently closed for renovation (stupid, I know...), and I'm not sure how long the city would let you keep your car parked there.

Beyond the novelty of travelling cross country by train, why not just fly? PHX to MCI is only a two hour flight.

nickw252 Jun 9, 2011 1:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckeye Native 001 (Post 5309081)
Beyond the novelty of travelling cross country by train, why not just fly? PHX to MCI is only a two hour flight.

Mostly the joy of taking a train - it's like a vacation in itself. You get to see the countryside, mountains and rivers from the comfort of your roomy seat with no worries about driving, gas and airport security. There's plenty of room for luggage, plugs at your seat for laptops, diner cars with food, coffee and drinks, and you can get up and walk around any time you want.

I took the California Zephyr last year from Elko Nevada to Reno and I didn't want the train ride to end.

Vicelord John Jun 9, 2011 4:53 PM

The ride from flag to Kansas city is longer than that. It will seem like it's never going to end.

Crispy Jun 9, 2011 4:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by westbev93 (Post 5308778)
And that's how it has looked for months. The only work that I've seen since Horne apparently sold the building last fall is the jack-hammering of a small portion of the facade on the north side of the building.

There was a lot of work done on the inside. There were structural issues that needed to be addressed and asbestos remediation. Lots of demo to prep for TI's.

Buckeye Native 001 Jun 9, 2011 7:06 PM

It'd be cheaper to fly (even in spite of airline prices spiking thanks to rising fuel costs). Hell, it'd probably be cheaper to drive. Personally, I don't have the time or patience to travel for that long. I'd rather get to my destination as quickly (and hassle-free) as possible.

Don B. Jun 10, 2011 12:55 PM

^ I think taking a train would be cool. I hate flying now and would prefer never to get on another airplane.

--don

Vicelord John Jun 10, 2011 11:26 PM

ever wondered what would happen if we got nuked?

http://www.carloslabs.com/node/20

Buckeye Native 001 Jun 10, 2011 11:34 PM

That's a lot more fun than it has any right to be, as far as hypothetical nuclear destruction is concerned.

So I might be heading down to Phoenix for a concert next week at US Airways Center, but I'm not sure if I'm better off finding parking Downtown somewhere (not sure where, I haven't driven Downtown for any length of time in nearly three years) or if I'm better off using light rail via park-n-ride (used to take the light rail into Downtown from 42nd/Washington when I lived in Ahwatukee, but I'm coming south on I-17 from Flagstaff). If I park downtown, shall I play it safe and use the garage mahal or are there better parking locations that I don't know about?

Vicelord John Jun 10, 2011 11:39 PM

just drive to where the concert is (I'm assuming USAC or Dodge.) How much is parking, $10? by the time you park the car, wait for a train, buy a ticket, and walk, you will be better off just to pay the damn parking fee.

If you must ride the train, park at 19/Montebello which is just a mile from the Bethany exit off I-17.

HooverDam Jun 11, 2011 12:10 AM

Why pay for parking at all? If you're going to drive anyhow just park in a non metered spot downtown, there are plenty of them. Along the Portland Street parkway by Portland Square apartments is all free. Garfield between Central and 1st is free and there's lots more if you look. You can then just walk to where you're going or hop on the train for a few stops and either pay like a good boy or be a rebel and hop you don't get caught since you're only going a few stops.

Vicelord John Jun 11, 2011 12:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HooverDam (Post 5311447)
Why pay for parking at all? If you're going to drive anyhow just park in a non metered spot downtown, there are plenty of them. Along the Portland Street parkway by Portland Square apartments is all free. Garfield between Central and 1st is free and there's lots more if you look. You can then just walk to where you're going or hop on the train for a few stops and either pay like a good boy or be a rebel and hop you don't get caught since you're only going a few stops.

Portland? Garfield? Those are fine if you want to bring your bike with you or walk .75 mile.

HooverDam Jun 11, 2011 12:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5311482)
Portland? Garfield? Those are fine if you want to bring your bike with you or walk .75 mile.

I've parked in both those places dozens upon dozens of times when I didn't live in Downtown, to go to Suns, D'backs games, whatever. Its not a bad little walk at all for someone in decent shape in their 20s or 30s.

Vicelord John Jun 11, 2011 1:04 AM

I'm not questioning whether or not the walk can be done. Lord knows I can handle that walk since I bicycle 100 miles a week, but does that mean I want to? I don't want to arrive to the event covered in sweat and I don't want to plan extra time for the walk just to save $10

westbev93 Jun 11, 2011 1:17 AM

I take the train downtown these days, but I used to park at Renaissance Square's parking garage for baseball and concerts. It used to be that they opened the garage arm somewhere between 9 and 10p, and nobody was in the parking booth after that. So as long as you were staying into the evening for your event, you could park completely free downtown.

As for free parking on Garfield, I am fortunately at a place in life where I can afford $10, but before that, it was the RS garage.

HooverDam Jun 11, 2011 1:30 AM

oh yah speaking of garages with arms up, the garage facing VB on the other side of 44 Monroe, where Sonoma is (was?) is usually free after 8pm I think it is.

Vicelord John Jun 11, 2011 1:46 AM

yeah that garage is a good place to get away with parking for free. Unfortunately, it's also a great place for a theif to get away with something from your car for free, and that elevator scares the crap out of me.

combusean Jun 11, 2011 1:57 AM

I believe all the city garages are free after 8 PM, or technically free if you leave after 8 PM. If the arm goes up and you haven't paid yet, you aren't obligated to.

Buckeye Native 001 Jun 11, 2011 4:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 5311482)
Portland? Garfield? Those are fine if you want to bring your bike with you or walk .75 mile.

Plus, I'll have been driving for 2.5 hours after working 8 hours and coming from 75-degree weather. Walking that distance isn't exactly something I want to tack on to my itinerary before a concert.

I'd really rather not take the light rail, just seems like more hassle since I'm not able to leave Flagstaff until at least 4pm (concert starts at 7:30), and I hate getting out of the garage mahal after an event (there's a Dbacks game that night as well). I'll see what I can do, guys. Thanks for the heads up

Vicelord John Jun 11, 2011 4:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckeye Native 001 (Post 5311675)
Plus, I'll have been driving for 2.5 hours after working 8 hours and coming from 75-degree weather. Walking that distance isn't exactly something I want to tack on to my itinerary before a concert.

I'd really rather not take the light rail, just seems like more hassle since I'm not able to leave Flagstaff until at least 4pm (concert starts at 7:30), and I hate getting out of the garage mahal after an event (there's a Dbacks game that night as well). I'll see what I can do, guys. Thanks for the heads up

get off the 17 at jefferson, turn left. Park in Patriots Square Garage. Easy cheesy.

pbenjamin Jun 11, 2011 4:49 PM

If the concert is not until 7:30, and you aren't arriving super early, just take a bunch of quarters and use a meter.

bwonger06 Jun 11, 2011 6:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pbenjamin (Post 5312004)
If the concert is not until 7:30, and you aren't arriving super early, just take a bunch of quarters and use a meter.

I agree. Meters shut off at 8 so you have plenty of time to catch the main act.

nickw252 Jun 11, 2011 11:37 PM

Arpaio's Proterster's Counter-Protesters made it out in full force from Sun City this Friday.

http://i51.tinypic.com/1ovxwo.jpg

http://i54.tinypic.com/f1y3dd.jpg

Buckeye Native 001 Jun 12, 2011 2:36 AM

Wow.......

nickw252 Jun 20, 2011 4:30 AM

7th Avenue and McDowell
 
I walked over to Pei Wei at 7th and McDowell tonight for dinner (Sunday) at about 8pm. The place was packed and people kept coming in after me. If Pei Wei is that busy on a Sunday night then a Chipotle across the street would be a gold mine!

Those buildings on the east side of 7th Ave need to fill up! :cheers:

HooverDam Jun 22, 2011 9:36 PM

If you're interested I wrote another article thats on Blooming Rock today. Its about PHX's current Weak Mayor/Council Manager type of system and my position that we should switch to a Strong Mayor/Mayor Council system.

Classical in Phoenix Jun 22, 2011 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HooverDam (Post 5325049)
If you're interested I wrote another article thats on Blooming Rock today. Its about PHX's current Weak Mayor/Council Manager type of system and my position that we should switch to a Strong Mayor/Mayor Council system.

Read your last one, well written and thought out. Thanks for introducing me to that blog, it's very interesting

HooverDam Jun 26, 2011 3:45 PM

Here's a cool article on the history of architecture in the Valley:
http://www.azcentral.com/centennial/architecture/

HX_Guy Jul 1, 2011 5:44 AM

Check out this crazy picture of the Salt River by the airport...

http://www.brazilbrazil.com/p1/skyharbor_flood3.jpg

More here... http://www.brazilbrazil.com/skyharbor.html

HooverDam Jul 1, 2011 3:01 PM

^Dang, thats awesome. We really need water in the river from Town Lake over to 19th or 27th Ave. I bet it would help with the heat island in addition to spurring development and being beautiful.

PHX31 Jul 1, 2011 3:29 PM

Holy shite, that is an awesome pic. It looks like the mighty Yangtze.

Why must Phoenix and the civic leadership we have suck so much? If only we could have a nice Salt River (tamed a bit via SRP) through the City, rather than a massive open wound of utter desolation. If only we could (have) preserve(d) our historic core, rather than tear everything down for barren dusty ugly lots. If only we could have kept our nice shade trees all over the city, and continue to plant new ones, rather than let what we have rot and die, shrivel up and die, or cut them down altogether (anyone notice APS out in the City cutting back nice big trees away from the overhead utility lines? Is it a fire hazard or something? It looks disgusting... nice spherical huge tree crowns chopped straight down the middle into spindly 'Y' shapes). If only our planners and zoning laws through time wouldn't cater directly to suburban uses and forms. If only blah blah blah... basically our city is utter shit compared to what it could be.

PHX31 Jul 1, 2011 4:20 PM

This City needs a facade rehabilitation program. Tucson's seems quite successful, I've read that even the City of Peoria is trying to strenghten some type of program. The City of Phoenix REALLY needs to connect better with its history. Having a few more historic buildings around town would be a blessing (there are many that are hiding in plain sight).

Who could be contacted at the City to try to push something like this along? Mayor? Councilman? Historic Preservation Office?

HooverDam Jul 1, 2011 8:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PHX31 (Post 5334731)
Who could be contacted at the City to try to push something like this along? Mayor? Councilman? Historic Preservation Office?

Thats an excellent idea and you should email all of the above. Obviously Mayor Gordon won't do much about it as he's on his way out, but you may as well CC him on any email. Additionally Greg Stantons website has an area where you can email in suggestions. I'd also say post the idea (with a link to Tucsons program if possible) on Stantons Facebook wall. That way not only does he see it, but other people do as well.

HooverDam Jul 5, 2011 3:46 PM

Anyone seen this site before?:

http://www.connectingphoenix.com/

Its a project headed up by Kevin Kellogg. Here's a video trailer to sort of show what its about:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=VfncErqsNmI

E: Whoa, just noticed that my barber, "Fast Eddie" is in the video.

HX_Guy Jul 5, 2011 4:04 PM

I'll have to take a look at that later...iPad = No Flash.

On a different note, what's up with us having what seems like really shitty luck with big sporting events and the weather?

When we got the Super Bowl a few years back, everyone I'm sure expected nice sunny skies and mild temps. While the temps were mild compared to the Eastern cities, it was pretty cold and it rained or was overcast.

Now with the All Star game, people will expect the hot but dry heat they hear about but instead it looks like we'll have low 100s with 40+ humidity and 65+ dew point.

HooverDam Jul 5, 2011 4:09 PM

^^^^ The site is basically about TOD, station design along the LRT, etc. They're starting with Central/Osborn for the first place to do station design. I filled out a survey a while back that I think was listed here on the forum somewhere about the station design for that intersection.

While its nice that this sort of thing is finally being done, it really should've been done a long time ago in the 10 year planning phase of LRT. We're way behind the 8 ball now and need to get as much of this done so when the economy does finally bounce back we have the systems in place for new growth to be infill and not on the fringes.


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