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-   -   SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126473)

eburress Nov 14, 2016 2:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 7621892)
I totally see this city failing to build a stadium nor an CC expansion

Me too. It's a wonder anything gets done here.

Leo the Dog Nov 14, 2016 6:28 PM

Meanwhile, one of San Diego's largest regional competitors in terms of convention/tourism, since 2006 Metro Phoenix has expanded their convention center, built a new stadium for the Cardinals, which has hosted 2 Super Bowls, built a new hockey arena for the NHL Coyotes, dozens of new Spring Training facilities, which has snagged many teams from Florida, have started plans to replace the NBA arena in downtown Phoenix that opened in 1992 and apparently have just announced today that they are now building a new hockey arena across town in Tempe. Their current home is only 10 years old.

Much of this funding comes from a hospitality/rental car tourism tax that San Diego just voted down.

In addition to all of this, they continue to expand their transportation network with a sales tax increase that has provided a growing freeway network with HOV lanes, opened the longest LR line at 20 miles, have expanded this initial LR line in both directions with more lines planned and funded, constructing a trolley line in Tempe, added BRT, extended bus hours and routes etc...

NHL stadium news: http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/show...96153&page=340

The Chargers should get their act together and rebuild in Mission Valley and stop insisting on an East Village stadium.

Nerv Nov 14, 2016 7:06 PM

Concerns emerge regarding ability of Chargers and Rams to strike a deal

Posted by Mike Florio on November 13, 2016, 8:03 PM EST
SAN DIEGO, CA -

With the San Diego stadium resolution failing miserably, the next question becomes whether the Chargers will take advantage of their opportunity to strike a deal with the Rams to share the L.A. market. The window closes, barring an extension, on January 15, 2017.

Per a source with knowledge of the dynamics, concern currently exists at the league level regarding the ability of the Chargers and Rams to strike a deal and to work together on building and sharing a stadium and a market.

The two sides tried in vain to get something done in the aftermath of the Rams winning the race to L.A., but then the Chargers decided to try to get something done in San Diego. Now that the effort has died, the clock is ticking on the L.A. option.

JerellO Nov 14, 2016 10:07 PM

When will the trolley extend up to Hillcrest, Balboa Park and North Park Area?? The city hasn't built any new lines since like forever -_-" meanwhile in LA they have like 4 rail lines under construction and the city has new developments springing up literally like every week. We could learn a few things from them.

mello Nov 14, 2016 10:25 PM

Leo and Jerello: I agree look at our closest neighbors LA and PHX they are getting waaaay more done than we are with regards to infrastructure and facilities. It was embarrassing giving a new comer to town a tour of Hillcrest and North Park and having to explain why our light rail line doesn't go to our most visited (other than beach) and densely populated urban areas.

I was thinking today that AEG wanted to build an arena at Seaport Village, why not right behind Petco on the "Tailgate Park" or MTS busyard? San Diego State needs to really step up their game with the City and County Supervisors to show the citizens of this Metro area that developing Qualcomm in to a expansion/research facility with massive student and faculty housing would have a huge economic impact.

In other words, giving the "Chargers" money from TOT tax to do their convadium would actually be an investment in our region that would pay off big time by opening up those 160 acres. It would also make it much easier for us to get an MLS team which is a sport on the rise for sure.

Lipani Nov 15, 2016 1:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo the Dog (Post 7622313)
Meanwhile, one of San Diego's largest regional competitors in terms of convention/tourism, since 2006 Metro Phoenix has expanded their convention center, built a new stadium for the Cardinals, which has hosted 2 Super Bowls, built a new hockey arena for the NHL Coyotes, dozens of new Spring Training facilities, which has snagged many teams from Florida, have started plans to replace the NBA arena in downtown Phoenix that opened in 1992 and apparently have just announced today that they are now building a new hockey arena across town in Tempe. Their current home is only 10 years old.

NFL stadiums are a waste of money for taxpayers. They see little use and come nowhere near being profitable. One of my clients has an office right next to Q and I've seen more go-kart races in the parking lot than anything else. The last Super Bowl in Glendale was actually a bust for the city. Even upcoming events at University of Stadium are few are far between. Glendale will also owe almost $150,000,000 in debt for a soon-to-be vacant arena. No doubt San Diego needs major improvements throughout the city, but Phoenix isn't the best model we should be following.

Leo the Dog Nov 15, 2016 4:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lipani (Post 7622749)
No doubt San Diego needs major improvements throughout the city, but Phoenix isn't the best model we should be following.

Not saying San Diego should follow Phoenix, just saying Phoenix gets stuff done, rather quickly compared to SD. My post was in response to eburress' post: "It's a wonder anything gets done here."

The city of Glendale might have lost money on the game, but that's because Glendale is pretty much the hood of Metro Phoenix that made really bad decisions to lure the financially ruined Coyotes. Metro Phoenix benefited greatly from the SB. All the events for the weeklong festivities took place in Scottsdale, Tempe and Phoenix. In the very same article you cited, it states that Super Bowl lifted Valley economy by $720 million. This is the 2nd SB they've hosted since 2008. The 2008 estimate was $500 million. SBs are a great way of exposing/advertising the overall region for future conventions and tourism.

SDCAL Nov 15, 2016 5:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JerellO (Post 7622577)
When will the trolley extend up to Hillcrest, Balboa Park and North Park Area?? The city hasn't built any new lines since like forever -_-" meanwhile in LA they have like 4 rail lines under construction and the city has new developments springing up literally like every week. We could learn a few things from them.

When will the trolley extend up to Balboa Park/Hillcrest/North Park?

Not in our lifetimes, per SANDAG's long range plans.

SANDAG had this line in their long-range plans for awhile, then about 5 years ago they changed it from a trolley to a "street car" plan. Now, they've scrapped that and the only trolley lines in their plan covering the next 30-50 years are the extension of the blue line to UTC and a purple line that will go from the border to Kearny Mesa.

Since Prop A failed, who knows when and if the purple line will ever become reality (luckily the blue line is already funded).

Meanwhile, voters in LA passed their transportation tax increase, so San Diego will most likely continue to lag behind most other major cities in mass transit for quite literally the next 50 years.

One thing about SANDAG is that it's weighted towards suburban and rural areas of the county. SANDAG is comprised of representatives from Vista, El Cajon, Poway, Chula Vista, La Mesa, etc etc. and even though the city of San Diego gets two votes instead of one, we are still way outnumbered at this agency. City officials from all these other cities get to vote on the transit ocuring within the city of San Diego. This is why they do things like scrapping a mid city line which would be totally within the city limits in favor of this purple line which will go through several cities like Chula Vista, San Ysidro, etc and thus gets more votes and panders to more special interests on the SANDAG board.

One thing that desperately needs to be done is the reorganization of SANDAG so the CITY of San Diego is making our own decisions on these matters.

dtell04 Nov 15, 2016 6:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDCAL (Post 7622897)
When will the trolley extend up to Balboa Park/Hillcrest/North Park?

Not in our lifetimes, per SANDAG's long range plans.

SANDAG had this line in their long-range plans for awhile, then about 5 years ago they changed it from a trolley to a "street car" plan. Now, they've scrapped that and the only trolley lines in their plan covering the next 30-50 years are the extension of the blue line to UTC and a purple line that will go from the border to Kearny Mesa.

Since Prop A failed, who knows when and if the purple line will ever become reality (luckily the blue line is already funded).

Meanwhile, voters in LA passed their transportation tax increase, so San Diego will most likely continue to lag behind most other major cities in mass transit for quite literally the next 50 years.

One thing about SANDAG is that it's weighted towards suburban and rural areas of the county. SANDAG is comprised of representatives from Vista, El Cajon, Poway, Chula Vista, La Mesa, etc etc. and even though the city of San Diego gets two votes instead of one, we are still way outnumbered at this agency. City officials from all these other cities get to vote on the transit ocuring within the city of San Diego. This is why they do things like scrapping a mid city line which would be totally within the city limits in favor of this purple line which will go through several cities like Chula Vista, San Ysidro, etc and thus gets more votes and panders to more special interests on the SANDAG board.

One thing that desperately needs to be done is the reorganization of SANDAG so the CITY of San Diego is making our own decisions on these matters.

#SDexit!

eburress Nov 15, 2016 6:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 7622587)
Leo and Jerello: I agree look at our closest neighbors LA and PHX they are getting waaaay more done than we are with regards to infrastructure and facilities. It was embarrassing giving a new comer to town a tour of Hillcrest and North Park and having to explain why our light rail line doesn't go to our most visited (other than beach) and densely populated urban areas.

I was thinking today that AEG wanted to build an arena at Seaport Village, why not right behind Petco on the "Tailgate Park" or MTS busyard? San Diego State needs to really step up their game with the City and County Supervisors to show the citizens of this Metro area that developing Qualcomm in to a expansion/research facility with massive student and faculty housing would have a huge economic impact.

In other words, giving the "Chargers" money from TOT tax to do their convadium would actually be an investment in our region that would pay off big time by opening up those 160 acres. It would also make it much easier for us to get an MLS team which is a sport on the rise for sure.

Broaden your view even farther than that and it gets even worse for SD. Vegas, the Bay Area, Portland, Denver, Seattle, the Texas cities, etc... There are few major cities accomplishing as little as San Diego.

OneRinconHill Nov 15, 2016 6:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eburress (Post 7622950)
Broaden your view even farther than that and it gets even worse for SD. Vegas, the Bay Area, Portland, Denver, Seattle, the Texas cities, etc... There are few major cities accomplishing as little as San Diego.

Not sure if clumping the Bay Area into that is a great idea...the BART extension to San Jose won't be done for several more years, if funded. Caltrain electrification finally passed, but won't go to the new Transbay Terminal for at least 20 more years, BART is crumbling and their new funding will not likely fix most of the problems.

So yeah...at least San Diego's stuff works though, even if it doesn't really go anywhere.

Lipani Nov 15, 2016 7:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo the Dog (Post 7622890)
The city of Glendale might have lost money on the game, but that's because Glendale is pretty much the hood of Metro Phoenix that made really bad decisions to lure the financially ruined Coyotes. Metro Phoenix benefited greatly from the SB. All the events for the weeklong festivities took place in Scottsdale, Tempe and Phoenix. In the very same article you cited, it states that Super Bowl lifted Valley economy by $720 million. This is the 2nd SB they've hosted since 2008. The 2008 estimate was $500 million. SBs are a great way of exposing/advertising the overall region for future conventions and tourism.

You would need several Super Bowls per year to noticeably affect a metro's GDP. Much of this spending would happen whether Glendale hosted a Super Bowl or not. The figures regarding the economic impact are often highly inflated and rarely, if ever, account if the a metro didn't host an event such as this. Exposing/advertising a place like metro Phoenix likely didn't go far, either. The metro is already one of the largest in the country and has a handful of Fortune 500 companies. Having both of those features and generally great weather in the fall/spring (peak convention season) makes it an attractive place for conventions already.

Boatguy619 Nov 17, 2016 4:11 PM

http://allegisdevelopment.com/portfo...y/#hospitality

What's the likelihood in these projects becoming a reality? Some look like really cool concepts.

Streamliner Nov 17, 2016 5:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy619 (Post 7625530)

One Santa Fe Place? KUSI Building? Is it 2005 again? I haven't seen some of these in forever.

SDfan Nov 17, 2016 5:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Boatguy619 (Post 7625530)
http://allegisdevelopment.com/portfo...y/#hospitality

What's the likelihood in these projects becoming a reality? Some look like really cool concepts.

Looking through the hospitality projects, I know the KUSI tower and Gaylord Hotel are dead.

The Campbell tower I'm not 100% sure about, but I don't think it's the current project proposed there (I know there was a proposal put out this year or last that ticked off the continuous convention expansion folks).

The Hilton expansion is MIA until the convention center expands. Everything else is already built.

SDfan Nov 17, 2016 5:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Streamliner (Post 7625692)
One Santa Fe Place? KUSI Building? Is it 2005 again? I haven't seen some of these in forever.

I know, Santa Fe Place OMG. I was 11 when that was first proposed...

plutonicpanda Nov 17, 2016 9:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDfan (Post 7625695)
The Campbell tower .

My first name is Campbell so I'm already a fan of that tower. We need to get that built.

Boatguy619 Nov 18, 2016 1:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDfan (Post 7625695)
Looking through the hospitality projects, I know the KUSI tower and Gaylord Hotel are dead.

The Campbell tower I'm not 100% sure about, but I don't think it's the current project proposed there (I know there was a proposal put out this year or last that ticked off the continuous convention expansion folks).

The Hilton expansion is MIA until the convention center expands. Everything else is already built.

That is what I was most curious about. Would be nice to get more hotel rooms down there to compete with Anaheim and Vegas for conventions.

mello Nov 18, 2016 4:15 AM

In hindsight do you guys think the Gaylord Hotel and Convention Center would have been a successful project? I actually really like the Hotel proposed for where the Bayside Convention Expansion would go, its sleek and really improves the feel of that whole section of water front.

IMBY Nov 18, 2016 4:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eburress (Post 7622950)
Broaden your view even farther than that and it gets even worse for SD. Vegas, the Bay Area, Portland, Denver, Seattle, the Texas cities, etc... There are few major cities accomplishing as little as San Diego.

Vegas? :D We don't even have a light rail line on the drawing boards! When speaking of light rail, we're speaking of a transportation system designed for its local residents.

Please don't mention the Monorail, that only goes between Sahara and Tropicana, as that's strictly for tourists! And, thank you taxi unions, it wasn't allowed to go the Airport or to downtown Las Vegas/Fremont Street.

Vegas was once a refuge for the Desert Tortoise, and that's how slowly things move here in this conservative, Mormon-flavored city/state, at a tortoise pace!

What made it appear that Vegas moved so fast on the potential stadium, is due to Sheldon Adelson, Billionaire Venetian owner, pushing so hard to get it, contributing only $450 million to the $2 billion price tag, and socking the tourists with additional room taxes for the much of the rest of it. If this was going to be such a big money maker for Vegas, and with Adelson's billions, Adelson would have put up the entire amount for it and then slapped his name on the stadium.


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