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-   -   SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126473)

mello Feb 16, 2012 5:52 AM

I wouldn't say Miami is a hole, it has some very nice qualities and some that aren't so great. Could San Diego learn things from Miami, Vancouver, Melbourne of course. Our downtown waterfront has so much untapped potential and I think we could have some more coastal towers with quality architecture in Imperial Beach, Pac/Mission/Ocean Beach, and I know many won't like this but what about Fiesta Island? I see a lot of potential there.

bobdreamz Feb 16, 2012 6:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laguna (Post 5592700)
You sound like a child moving pieces on a Monopoly board. The realities of cities are buillt over centuries-you probably didnt know tht San Diego is over 500 years in the making. Your comments sound like you have never even been here, except maybe with your parents at Sea World. I had a good laugh at your idea of turning our city into a Mexican theme park or a copy of Miami. Miami is a hole and not something to emulate and TJ is fine for TJ.

Excuse me? Why do you have to trash Miami and how exactly is it a hole? I think Miami has developed well considering the city is only 115 years old.

mello Feb 16, 2012 6:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobdreamz (Post 5592731)
Excuse me? Why do you have to trash Miami and how exactly is it a hole?

^^^ Don't worry about him, he is just a troll and anything other than San Diego back in the 70's or 80's when "it wasn't so crowded" and he wasn't a crabby old man, is just a hole to him. I could see calling Corpus Christi a hole or someplace like that but Miami... Who wouldn't want to go spend a few days in Miami in the winter time if someone wrote them a $5k check and said go stay at the Ritz Carlton or Breakers etc.

HurricaneHugo Feb 16, 2012 6:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aquablue (Post 5592312)
As an outsider, I think San Deigo wasted its potential. Its location and climate are ideal. It should be a far greater international draw, but it developed itself in the wrong way.

First, move your airport outside of your city center. Agreed, won't be anytime soon
Create a proper transit system. Yep. The 2050 plan they have looks good enough, though it'll be awhile.
Develop a proper waterfront with a walkway along it away from major roads. Also, add retail NEV Plan, Lane Field, Navy Complex, and the Midway Pier will give us opportunities to do this. The Wings of Freedom site would be the perfect site for a signature attraction
Create a major tourist attraction (bibao effect) - world class design for a musuem or cultural venue. So yeah, build it on the Midway pier
Develop a vibrant downtown with retail - emphasize mexican american style buildings/styles The Horton Plaza remodel will help somewhat. Still need to open it up more. The C Street redevelopment will help as well. East Village needs more work but overall I think downtown is good
Focus more on building a unique san diego architecture and move away from corporate glass towers with no personality. All the residential towers are starting to look the same, yeah. Mexican american style though? I don't know what you mean by that and if it was what I think it is I don't think it looks good lol
Move military presence/navy ships and any bases far away from city center. Get rid of the naval base and noisy planes. The naval base is here to stay, it's a huge catalyst to the local economy. MCAS Miramar, on the other hand, can not move soon enough. Perfect site for a new airport. The city needs to look into helping them move whether to Camp Pendleton or somewhere out east.
Reduce highway clutter. How? Our PT system is not big enough to handle all the traffic. Both the 5 and the 805 have expansions in the near future to help with traffic
Turn Coronado or whatever beach area into a miami beach style area high density low rise streets, restaurants, w/ more ritzy resorts and boutique hotels on ocean. Coronado is perfect the way it is, no need to copy Miami Beach. Maybe a tunnel connecting with DT SD can help?

San Diego went the wrong way and does not develop its strong points -- i.e, beaches, weather, compactness. It should be a major resort city with international prestige like Miami. It should develop tourism fully despite lacking a large corporate presence. It should drop the family image and start to develop a more sophisticated one. It is a major resort city, it does develop it's tourism. It just depends on it too much and does not pay enough attention to corporate expansion. That's what the city needs to do, attract big businesses here to improve the local economy. It's sad that we have such a low number of Forbes 500 companies.

.

HurricaneHugo Feb 16, 2012 6:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 5592719)
and I know many won't like this but what about Fiesta Island? I see a lot of potential there.

What's the point of Fiesta Island?

Not gonna lie I would not mind putting the Chargers stadium there.

Or next to Sea World Drive.

Or between Sea World Drive and the 5.

I don't see the point of all that wasted land.

mello Feb 16, 2012 7:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 5592771)
What's the point of Fiesta Island?

Not gonna lie I would not mind putting the Chargers stadium there.

Or next to Sea World Drive.

Or between Sea World Drive and the 5.

I don't see the point of all that wasted land.

Exactly, here is where San Diego can learn from Miami look at all those cool little islands in Biscayne bay that have midrises and towers on them. When you look at the 8 corridor west of the 5, the Sports Arena site, and all of the land off of Sea World Drive/Fiesta Island we have a huge area of underused to unused land just sitting there and this is prime real estate.

SDCAL Feb 16, 2012 7:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by brantw (Post 5591696)
http://media.utsandiego.com/img/phot...053cbc530c46a8

Plans to redevelop Lane Field, the former home of the Pacific Coast League Padres, into a mid-scale 400-room hotel tower and public park, were given the go-ahead Tuesday by San Diego Port Commissioners.

The board granted an option to a development team to build a 14-story structure housing two different hotels — a 250-room Homewood Suites and a 150-room Hilton Garden Inn. The $110 million project, which also calls for a nearly two-acre park and plaza along Harbor Drive, is a downscale version of what was once envisioned as a luxury InterContinental Hotel tower.

The economic downturn, which made financing impossible to obtain, coupled with the added park requirement, forced the developers to rethink the project design, said Jerry Trammer, project executive for Lane Field. Still planned, however, is a second phase that calls for a 400-room InterContinental on the southern portion of the site, which Trammer hopes could be financed once the economy fully rebounds.

The developers of the hotel project include San Diego-based Lankford & Associates, Hardage Suite Hotels and C.W. Clark.

The San Diego Unified Port District, which wouldn’t start getting rent payments until at least 2017, could expect annual revenues of $2 million to $3.9 million during the later years of the agreement. The project, which still requires approval from the California Coastal Commission, could be completed by late 2014, Trammer said.

The developers would also be responsible for creating a new park that would include landscaped areas, a food pavilion, public restrooms and a special homage to the Padres’ former minor league team that used Lane Field between 1936 and 1957.

“One idea is to celebrate the original baseball stadium by having a replica of home plate in the same location where it once was and to also replicate the base pads and the pitcher’s mound,” said Trammer. “And the foul line would shown with in-ground lighting.”

The next step, said Trammer, is to design the hotel and park site, with a goal of starting construction in early 2013.

http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2012/...se-lane-field/

WOW, this is disappointing. I like the original Lane Field plan, this sounds like a cheap, campy embarrassment for being such a prominent site. A Homewood suites and a baseball theme? Yikes.

I realize Lane Field was a baseball historic site and there are tasteful ways to incorporate that into the plan, but this idea of recreating the plates, etc. sounds like a literal translation that will look pretty stupid. Not to mention we already have the baseball theme around Petco, now doing this on the bay seems a bit odd.

Personally I'd rather the city just wait out the economic downturn rather than squander prime property on some half-assed joke like this sounds.

SDCAL Feb 16, 2012 7:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDfan (Post 5591079)
Because we aren't that kind of a city. I mean come on, this is a city where a Marriott, a Hyatt, a Hilton and a Holiday Inn already adore our bay front crown (a crown this city bought from party city I might add).

San Diego isn't a luxury city. Our best mall is a B mall by LA standards. Our main attractions are a zoo, an over-sized aquarium, and a lego day care center. We have beaches, yes, and so what?

The gaslamp is cute, but not in anyway spectacular when compared to the streets of Hong Kong, London or New York where property values are so high, that visiting alone can attract the money that any of the hotels you listed above would salivate over.

San Diego is a family-oriented, middle-class vacation destination. We get zonies, weekend trip LAers, Californians, and the occasional Brit who accidentally got on the wrong plane.

Don't get me wrong, we have some class, I'm just saying, a Homewood Suites should come as no surprise. We might fare better in the future, but for now, this navy town will keep its middle image.

When you say San Diego isn't a luxury city, I agree with you but it still surprises me. We have some of the most affluent communities in the nation - La Jolla, Rancho Santa Fe, but for some reason the type of wealthy folks San Diego attracts seem to be the stay at home conservative types as opposed to the culture and nightlife jet-set crowd.

dl3000 Feb 19, 2012 6:21 AM

The main reason San Diego is behind the curve on the whole luxury/corporate presence aspect is because it developed into a military town. Back in the days of guys like Spreckles, San Diego had a lot going for it, then it became so navy focused it has basically dictated the way San Diego is today. The airport would be somewhere in Miramar, North Island would probably be developed in a huge way, San Diego would be a very different town, nothing against the armed forces, I'm just saying thats why San Diego is the way it is.

Derek Feb 19, 2012 6:59 AM

http://www.sandiego6.com/news/local/...139563323.html

Tico Feb 21, 2012 3:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek (Post 5596727)

I thought they would relocate the airport to Miramar...

eburress Feb 21, 2012 5:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 5592787)
Exactly, here is where San Diego can learn from Miami look at all those cool little islands in Biscayne bay that have midrises and towers on them. When you look at the 8 corridor west of the 5, the Sports Arena site, and all of the land off of Sea World Drive/Fiesta Island we have a huge area of underused to unused land just sitting there and this is prime real estate.

I couldn't agree more. What was/is the plan for all that land anyway? Was it intended to be more hotels and amusement parks or was there some other plan...or no plan at all?

eburress Feb 21, 2012 5:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDCAL (Post 5592794)
When you say San Diego isn't a luxury city, I agree with you but it still surprises me. We have some of the most affluent communities in the nation - La Jolla, Rancho Santa Fe, but for some reason the type of wealthy folks San Diego attracts seem to be the stay at home conservative types as opposed to the culture and nightlife jet-set crowd.

San Diego is not the primary residence for so many La Jolla/Rancho Sante Fe/Fairbanks Ranch homeowners, and the ones that do live here year-round tend to be older.

This isn't entirely related, but I suspect the surprising lack of civic philanthropy here in San Diego is at least partially to do with this not being the primary residence of so many of San Diego's wealthy.

eburress Feb 21, 2012 5:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dl3000 (Post 5596702)
The main reason San Diego is behind the curve on the whole luxury/corporate presence aspect is because it developed into a military town. Back in the days of guys like Spreckles, San Diego had a lot going for it, then it became so navy focused it has basically dictated the way San Diego is today. The airport would be somewhere in Miramar, North Island would probably be developed in a huge way, San Diego would be a very different town, nothing against the armed forces, I'm just saying thats why San Diego is the way it is.

Also true. San Diego's military presence does have a lot to do with why it is the way it is.

IconRPCV Feb 21, 2012 8:05 PM

The JAL Service is BIG
 
I no longer live in SD but watch this thread from up north in LA. Hey guys not all is doom and gloom. SD is slowly but surely getting connected to the world via direct airservice: London (British Airways), Toronto and Vancouver(Air Canada), Calgary(WestJet), Guadalajara, and Mexico City(Volaris) Cabo San Lucas and Puerto Vallarta(Alaskan), and soon Tokyo(JAL). I feel with the new Boeing Dreamliner we can expect a link to China and perhaps one to Germany soon as well. These direct flights are a boon for the local economy. Perhaps with rich foreign tourists instead of zoners from Arizona we can qualify for a few more upscale hotels instead of the Homebridge Suites or whatever low scale ones we are receiving.

aquablue Feb 21, 2012 8:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by IconRPCV (Post 5599578)
I no longer live in SD but watch this thread from up north in LA. Hey guys not all is doom and gloom. SD is slowly but surely getting connected to the world via direct airservice: London (British Airways), Toronto and Vancouver(Air Canada), Calgary(WestJet), Guadalajara, and Mexico City(Volaris) Cabo San Lucas and Puerto Vallarta(Alaskan), and soon Tokyo(JAL). I feel with the new Boeing Dreamliner we can expect a link to China and perhaps one to Germany soon as well. These direct flights are a boon for the local economy. Perhaps with rich foreign tourists instead of zoners from Arizona we can qualify for a few more upscale hotels instead of the Homebridge Suites or whatever low scale ones we are receiving.

Yes, but for real growth in the future, a new airport should be constructed. The noise over the city is also a turn-off especially over the park. The city seems unambitious and happy to be what it is. A new airport is vital to increase land values downtown and to encourage more international growth. If the airport is relocated, the city can become an even greater tourist focus. Together with relocation of the Navy out of NAS North Island to somewhere else in the state, more resort/beach hotels can be built.


I disagree with him. San Diego should build a new international airport at Brown Field. They could then link it by a decent train link to city and major suburban nodes (fast electric commuter rail) and also close the current airport. That would allow San Diego to grow in height and density, while reducing noise over the downtown area. The city will become a more desirable place to live and work. The old airport will be redeveloped into parks, housing, and hotels.

HurricaneHugo Feb 21, 2012 9:48 PM

^^ Mountains will get in the way I believe.

HurricaneHugo Feb 21, 2012 10:08 PM

Also apparently they want to put a Wal-Mart in Sherman Heights...

Quote:

Please let your family know that we have a very important meeting coming up on 2/29/12 at the SHCC at 6:15 pm.

Wallmart bought the Farmer's Market Building and the parking lot to the West of it, and they plan on opening a new store in the existing building by this Fall. According to Walmart, it's a small Neighborhood Market Model, which is the first of its kind in California. Just a grocery market that will fit within the space of the existing building. The former owners of the Farmer’s Market own some of the surrounding parcels side and front parcels, except for Elichondo’s corner. I am worried that Wal-Mart may purchase the other parcels and expand the store in the future. I am also worried that the upcoming Community Plan Update may allow for greater higher height levels in the near future and that Wal-Mart may change the characteristic of the store to a large regular Wal-Mart or again, that they may consolidate lots and expand later. Can you imagine the nightmare of huge Wal-Mart smack in the middle of the neighborhood? Low prices will be appealing to all residents but property owners who live here need to think of how this will affect our property value and our quality of life, i.e. traffic, parking, people from other neighborhoods, etc...

The director of the SHCC and I will be meeting with Wal-Mart next Thursday hear what they have to say. Reps from the key organizations in SM/LH are already meeting. The Labor Unions will certainly oppose because the jobs are minimum wage/non union. The business owners, especially the owners of the small supermarkets will be up in arms because they will very likely be put out of business. Wal-Mart consultants have been poking around since last year, giving out mordida money to some of the local non-profits such as Barrio Station, Fiesta del Sol and a few others. They tried to bribe the SHCC too but we sent them away.

Lots of changes are going to happen in the neighborhood in the next few years and property owners and business owners need to get informed and organized. We are not taking a position until we have the community meetings and hear what the residents, property owners, and business owners have to say. It’s very difficult to stop Wal-Mart but if they are going to come in, we need to force them to make a contribution to the neighborhood and sign and Community Benefits Agreement to that effect that also assures that they will not expand their store model in the future.

It's important that someone from your family make it to the meeting if they can.
Building in question...well I couldn't find a picture of it. But it's here.

http://maps.google.com/?ll=32.706147...30.52,,0,-0.41

mello Feb 21, 2012 10:12 PM

^^^ Getcha Sherm sticks! Shermville is on the rise Hugo. Watch your property value skyrocket.

HurricaneHugo Feb 22, 2012 1:57 AM

Would it really increase the value?

I'm only against Wal-Mart because I hate the big box design with an ocean of parking. But if they can just renovate the building I wouldn't be against it.

They complain about the minimum wage jobs/non-unions, as if the mom and pop stores are high paying unionized jobs.

If they do come in, maybe we can get other better stores to come in


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