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-   -   SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126473)

malsponger Sep 1, 2008 6:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpexpress (Post 3769057)
What's up with the Satai? I thought that this project would be done by the time I returned back to San Diego. 707 Tenth Lofts look good.

Looks to have been halted sometime ago. It's pitty too being it was so close to completion.

kpexpress Sep 2, 2008 9:04 AM

I was giving my buddy a ride home from the East Village over to Little Italy last night and we started talking about downtown developments and started driving around checking everything out.

Why is it sooo depressing to see the potential in downtown SD compared to what is ACTUALLY happening? Call me pessimistic, but WTF is up with this town?

Maybe I am naive in my attitude, cause I really haven't been here for very long and I do understand that a lot HAS happened in the last ten years, but am I the only one who feels that it seems nearly impossible to get a project off the ground and just as difficult to complete one?

I need everyones input to try to nail down the culprit causing these problems.

Soooo, what is it? Corruption, Fraud, Lack of Money, Economy, High Costs, Poor Planning?

Please weigh in.....

Fusey Sep 2, 2008 2:23 PM

Downtown San Diego is vastly different from even just five years ago. Hopefully when I fly back to the US in a couple of months I'll find pictures I took in 2003 around Petco and other buildings nearby while they were undergoing construction.

The biggest problem right now is that you can only build so many luxury condos. With the real estate market in hell right now, especially in San Diego, it's even more difficult to get financing.

The number of projects going up, though, is still quite impressive. When I lived in Sacramento hardly any of the major projects came close to getting constructed (ask any Sac forumer about The Towers and you'll get the idea). Downtown SD will get some good retail infill projects as residents move in over the next few years. Hopefully something big happens with projects planned along the waterfront. I can't tell you how many times I've walked by people getting off cruise ships and one of the first things they talk about are the giant parking lots at the terminal.

mello Sep 2, 2008 3:29 PM

This Marriot Thing has me PISSED
 
This City ceases to amaze me with its ability to get every major project killed or drastically delayed due to its incompetence. Now some corruption scandal with CCDC has blocked what would have become an iconic anchor for the South End of the Skyline. Twin 500 footers..... GONE :hell: Do you realize what a blow that is to the image of our skyline?

I was really counting on these getting built. Library Tower and Cosmo Square are dust so we still have no real talls in that part of town. Hilton pussed out and only built a 30 floor tower instead of going for something special. Seriously I am this close to giving up on San Diego. Huge parking lots on the water front STILL!! In 2008. Where is Lane Field? Where is NBC? Lagging once again while the parking lots sit there collecting plastic bags.

No Chargers Stadium, no Gaylord... What is it with every big project in this County getting mired in bullsh*t. This is a major metropolitan area and we are acting like and getting results worthy of Boise, Shreveport, or Fresno. But hey atleast they have better airports then we do :haha:


So much potential wasted..... :yuck:

staplesla Sep 2, 2008 5:07 PM

I've been in San Diego for now 11 months. I've lived in New York City, Dallas, Nashville, and Heidelberg, Germany. NYC of course is always building, Dallas has 40+ high-rises going up at an incredible pace. Though we moved away from Dallas because of the heat, I'm impressed that Dallas sees the need to not only build up, but incorporate things that make living in the CBD great such as landscaped and larger walkways, monuments or statues scattered about, grand parks.

Yes San Diego has Balboa Park, but my spouse and I actually laughed when we looked at high-rise condos in downtown SD. Most of the streets are 100% concrete, too narrow, and are non-pedestrian friendly. And when you walk around there is really nothing special unless you are looking for a restaurant. It seemed to us that SD was more interested in building mid/high-rises instead of beautifying the city core and making the city more attractive. Instead there are just a bunch of concrete parking lots. We felt the quality of life should we have picked to live in downtown wouldn't have been all that so we purchased in La Jolla and rarely go downtown.

What irks me too is that it seems San Diegans are more passive than other cities when it comes to what they want or believe in. In NYC, Dallas, Nashville, etc., you have thousands of emails coming in regarding demands for this and that.....people really get involved. Having worked for the planning commission here, I can say that SD gets maybe 10-50 emails or letters per topic if that. People may complain on here, but are people contacting their representatives demanding action. I think the airport is a joke too, considering the level of tourists this area gets compared to most other U.S. cities. My gosh, Nashville and Oklahoma City have larger and grander airports. I just think it is a big miss considering what a larger airport, with more landing capacity situated elsewhere in the county would mean to this county's economy. It to me shows the lack of responsible leadership in this area.

HurricaneHugo Sep 2, 2008 11:52 PM

Random question....are there any food places open 24/7 in downtown?

Last sunday we went to On Broadway and after the club, we were really drunk and really hungry. So we went on a mission to find a place to eat. One hour later, we came empty handed and knocked out in my car. I know 7/11 is open, but that doesn't count.

dl3000 Sep 3, 2008 6:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla (Post 3773338)
I've been in San Diego for now 11 months. I've lived in New York City, Dallas, Nashville, and Heidelberg, Germany. NYC of course is always building, Dallas has 40+ high-rises going up at an incredible pace. Though we moved away from Dallas because of the heat, I'm impressed that Dallas sees the need to not only build up, but incorporate things that make living in the CBD great such as landscaped and larger walkways, monuments or statues scattered about, grand parks.

Yes San Diego has Balboa Park, but my spouse and I actually laughed when we looked at high-rise condos in downtown SD. Most of the streets are 100% concrete, too narrow, and are non-pedestrian friendly. And when you walk around there is really nothing special unless you are looking for a restaurant. It seemed to us that SD was more interested in building mid/high-rises instead of beautifying the city core and making the city more attractive. Instead there are just a bunch of concrete parking lots. We felt the quality of life should we have picked to live in downtown wouldn't have been all that so we purchased in La Jolla and rarely go downtown.

What irks me too is that it seems San Diegans are more passive than other cities when it comes to what they want or believe in. In NYC, Dallas, Nashville, etc., you have thousands of emails coming in regarding demands for this and that.....people really get involved. Having worked for the planning commission here, I can say that SD gets maybe 10-50 emails or letters per topic if that. People may complain on here, but are people contacting their representatives demanding action. I think the airport is a joke too, considering the level of tourists this area gets compared to most other U.S. cities. My gosh, Nashville and Oklahoma City have larger and grander airports. I just think it is a big miss considering what a larger airport, with more landing capacity situated elsewhere in the county would mean to this county's economy. It to me shows the lack of responsible leadership in this area.

I think the reason beautification is minimal is because of lack of funding available. Also I think most citizens are disillusioned by the city as a whole ever since the pension corruption came about.

kpexpress Sep 3, 2008 8:45 AM

anyone have a link to the news article explaining this "corruption" scandal?

Marina_Guy Sep 4, 2008 1:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dl3000 (Post 3774933)
I think the reason beautification is minimal is because of lack of funding available. Also I think most citizens are disillusioned by the city as a whole ever since the pension corruption came about.

That is bunk. There is a ton of money in the redevelopment budget for beautification. Instead the redevelopment agency spends 10+ million on a bridge, 17+ million on the quiet zone (anyone know how ugly that is going to make the rail crossings look?)... Tell me that 27 million would not get us some great parks and improved sidewalks. I think the redevelopment agency (CCDC) is not spending money in the right places.

Please attend the 9/11/08 meeting to tell the Board of CCDC what you want in a new President. Don't let the conspiracy theorists out there run that show.

And has this agency ever thought about a program to recruit retail into downtown???

Thank you.

Derek Sep 4, 2008 1:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 3774205)
Random question....are there any food places open 24/7 in downtown?

Last sunday we went to On Broadway and after the club, we were really drunk and really hungry. So we went on a mission to find a place to eat. One hour later, we came empty handed and knocked out in my car. I know 7/11 is open, but that doesn't count.

I liked your two-thousandth post. :P



There has to be a place somewhere thats open all night.

bmfarley Sep 4, 2008 3:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marina_Guy (Post 3776545)
That is bunk. There is a ton of money in the redevelopment budget for beautification. Instead the redevelopment agency spends 10+ million on a bridge, 17+ million on the quiet zone (anyone know how ugly that is going to make the rail crossings look?)... Tell me that 27 million would not get us some great parks and improved sidewalks. I think the redevelopment agency (CCDC) is not spending money in the right places.

Please attend the 9/11/08 meeting to tell the Board of CCDC what you want in a new President. Don't let the conspiracy theorists out there run that show.

And has this agency ever thought about a program to recruit retail into downtown???

Thank you.

You somehow you missed the news that a pedestrian bridge, or tunnel, is required if the City wants to re-open 8th Avenue to Harbor. It was closed due to Petco Park and PUC concerns about perdestrian crowds across heavy rail and light-rail tracks... 4 in all I believe.

Downtown San Diego deserves something iconic.

The alternatives you suggested are really not alternatives at all. Additionally, I do not support additional homeless encampments that parks provide.

staplesla Sep 4, 2008 4:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3776984)
You somehow you missed the news that a pedestrian bridge, or tunnel, is required if the City wants to re-open 8th Avenue to Harbor. It was closed due to Petco Park and PUC concerns about perdestrian crowds across heavy rail and light-rail tracks... 4 in all I believe.

Downtown San Diego deserves something iconic.

The alternatives you suggested are really not alternatives at all. Additionally, I do not support additional homeless encampments that parks provide.

So you don't want to build more parks and beautify the city because it will attract more homeless individuals? That's ridiculous. Why don't our leaders enforce the laws and do something about the homeless and take what few parks we have back and build more.

And one iconic bridge is great for the Petco Park/Convention area, but does little for the rest of downtown.

Marina_Guy Sep 4, 2008 4:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla (Post 3777029)
So you don't want to build more parks and beautify the city because it will attract more homeless individuals? That's ridiculous. Why don't our leaders enforce the laws and do something about the homeless and take what few parks we have back and build more.

And one iconic bridge is great for the Petco Park/Convention area, but does little for the rest of downtown.

While the bridge is a nicety... it really will benefit the Hilton Hotel. Here is another example of tax increment funds being used to help the visitor industry. I'm at least happy that some funds from other agencies were found to 'partially' offset the total cost of the project.

Parks need to be better designed so they are friendly to EVERYONE. The parks we have now are not 'activated' There is none or very little retail (coffee shops, etc) that get people to sit and be the 'eyes' of the park. The homeless are an issue, but why should my quality of life be sacrificed because we don't want to deal with the homeless. The homeless issue is a HUGE failure of CITY AND COUNTY Government. Other cities are doing a better job than SD. We just ignore the problem.

Marina_Guy Sep 4, 2008 4:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3776984)
You somehow you missed the news that a pedestrian bridge, or tunnel, is required if the City wants to re-open 8th Avenue to Harbor. It was closed due to Petco Park and PUC concerns about perdestrian crowds across heavy rail and light-rail tracks... 4 in all I believe.

Downtown San Diego deserves something iconic.

The alternatives you suggested are really not alternatives at all. Additionally, I do not support additional homeless encampments that parks provide.

Excuse me, but, I do understand why the bridge is needed and I think we are now in season 4 of the Padres downtown and there still is NO bridge. I understand it is now 'under construction' I am just concerned that the allocation of finite redevelopment funds are not optimum to improve downtown. We need to spend monies on Parks, public art, improved transportation systems, libraries, recreational facilities, etc and I don't see a clear plan for these. The money is there.

keg92101 Sep 4, 2008 5:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 3774205)
Random question....are there any food places open 24/7 in downtown?

Last sunday we went to On Broadway and after the club, we were really drunk and really hungry. So we went on a mission to find a place to eat. One hour later, we came empty handed and knocked out in my car. I know 7/11 is open, but that doesn't count.

Brians' Eatery on 6th & F is open 24 hours on Friday & Saturday.

staplesla Sep 4, 2008 5:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marina_Guy (Post 3777100)
Excuse me, but, I do understand why the bridge is needed and I think we are now in season 4 of the Padres downtown and there still is NO bridge. I understand it is now 'under construction' I am just concerned that the allocation of finite redevelopment funds are not optimum to improve downtown. We need to spend monies on Parks, public art, improved transportation systems, libraries, recreational facilities, etc and I don't see a clear plan for these. The money is there.

BTW, the bridge is not under construction yet. The ground breaking was pushed back for reasons that have not been announced. I just received an email stating the "ground breaking will be announced at a future date."

To your other points, you are absolutely correct. But people need to email their representatives, or contact the media and demand change or nothing will change. Posting on here does little to influence change.

kpexpress Sep 4, 2008 6:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla (Post 3777029)
So you don't want to build more parks and beautify the city because it will attract more homeless individuals? That's ridiculous. Why don't our leaders enforce the laws and do something about the homeless and take what few parks we have back and build more.

And one iconic bridge is great for the Petco Park/Convention area, but does little for the rest of downtown.

East Village is the fastest growing neighborhood in all of downtown with more housing developments planned than any other neighborhood. As for now, any East Village resident (Me included) must walk down to 5th Ave and cross the hundred plus stairs to get over the convention center in order to access the bay. As for downtown moving forward (considering that most residential developments ARE in the EV) the bridge will do wonders for Downtown.

Developments occupying the Bay Front of San Diego is like the Berlin Wall. I seriously inhibits residents access to the bay.

To quote Rob Quigley, "San Diego really never TOUCHES the bay like cities such as Seattle or SF do." Ever since the Port Authority held a design competition for redevelopment of the tuna harbor between USS Midway and Seaport Village, they have acted like they never saw what Rob designed (and won) for the competition.

http://www.robquigley.com/planning.html# historic harbor front

http://www.robquigley.com/NewFiles/harborfront%2003.jpg

bmfarley Sep 4, 2008 2:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla (Post 3777029)
So you don't want to build more parks and beautify the city because it will attract more homeless individuals? That's ridiculous. Why don't our leaders enforce the laws and do something about the homeless and take what few parks we have back and build more.

And one iconic bridge is great for the Petco Park/Convention area, but does little for the rest of downtown.

You missed the point. But maybe it is my fault.

The City needs to do something at 8th and Harbor if it wants to re-open 8th Avenue. The choices involve doing something iconic, maybe a tunnel, or something cheap that would likely not be iconic and likley be very ugly.

Would you rather have something like the pedestrian overpass currently over I-5 near City College? Or like the one over I-5 near Mission Hills and Palm Street?

I think it's an easy decision; spend the money on a nice iconic bidge. It's also in a very visible location.

Assuming limited financial resources.... absolutely I would choose to put it toward a bridge than a homeless park.

bmfarley Sep 4, 2008 2:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marina_Guy (Post 3777100)
Excuse me, but, I do understand why the bridge is needed and I think we are now in season 4 of the Padres downtown and there still is NO bridge. I understand it is now 'under construction' I am just concerned that the allocation of finite redevelopment funds are not optimum to improve downtown. We need to spend monies on Parks, public art, improved transportation systems, libraries, recreational facilities, etc and I don't see a clear plan for these. The money is there.

I agree on most of what you say. But I disagreed with your initial premise pitting the pedestrian bridge against parks. The ped bridge... for better or worse, is a necessity/requirement while parks are an amenity.

Ideally, I'd like to see additional cultural things downtown too... .ones with nominal maintenance costs yet bring 'place setting' ability and value.

Marina_Guy Sep 4, 2008 2:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3777633)
I agree on most of what you say. But I disagreed with your initial premise pitting the pedestrian bridge against parks. The ped bridge... for better or worse, is a necessity/requirement while parks are an amenity.

Ideally, I'd like to see additional cultural things downtown too... .ones with nominal maintenance costs yet bring 'place setting' ability and value.


Agreed. And I am not anti-bridge, and my writings suggest such. I would have loved to see a Calatrava Bridge there. And anyone who knows me can confirm how much I hate having the bay blocked.

I am a huge supporter of urban areas and all the good things they bring... San Diego is not there and I don't see a path either. Let's spend our limited dollars wisely and get those iconic structures as well.

We do need to let our representatives know how we feel or NOTHING will get done.


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