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PEI highway guy Apr 9, 2020 9:40 PM

[QUOTE=LO 044;88890

We are asking the same questions to our company is it starts doing temp layoffs. "If Air Canada can do it why can't we?". Will the Parks and Rec City staff in Edmonton be paid for not doing anything after getting laid off? Slippery slope. We'll get a 10% GST in a couple of years to pay for this.[/QUOTE]

OFF topic, however, I can only imagine what we will be paying in EI rates in 2 years.

Djeffery Apr 9, 2020 11:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LO 044 (Post 8889097)
?

Also i don't believe the company need to top up the 25% at all so essentially you're just getting free money from the government.

Yeah, it's only "expected where possible to maintain remuneration" on the government website but it's not a passed piece of legislation yet, so who knows what the final bill that goes into law will say. I think it should be mandatory that the employer top up the difference if they are going to participate in this. Otherwise, why have this? Why not just raise the EI cap? Wouldn't it be better for the government to just be giving 16,500 laid off AC employee up to $847 per week (I think that's the max number, I might be off) rather than all 30,000 or so AC employees that if the employer isn't required to top up? I guess it makes the unemployment statistics look better at least, if anyone is actually putting any real stock in what those numbers mean right now anyway.

casper Apr 10, 2020 12:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djeffery (Post 8889480)
Yeah, it's only "expected where possible to maintain remuneration" on the government website but it's not a passed piece of legislation yet, so who knows what the final bill that goes into law will say. I think it should be mandatory that the employer top up the difference if they are going to participate in this. Otherwise, why have this? Why not just raise the EI cap? Wouldn't it be better for the government to just be giving 16,500 laid off AC employee up to $847 per week (I think that's the max number, I might be off) rather than all 30,000 or so AC employees that if the employer isn't required to top up? I guess it makes the unemployment statistics look better at least, if anyone is actually putting any real stock in what those numbers mean right now anyway.

It is better for everyone for these people to stay AC employees paid by their employer, getting AC benefits with a plan to return to work after this is over.

vrs.

On a government program where they are disconnected from their employer, are getting no benefits, are filling out a form each week explaining what they are doing to try to search out new work and how they have not turned down any opportunity that they have been given.

Dominion301 Apr 10, 2020 1:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominion301 (Post 8887035)
So far at YOW, US preclearance is still open to service the two remaining transborder fights - DL to DTW and AA to PHL. Both flights depart early afternoon, so obviously preclearance has reduced hours from the usual 0500-1900 to likely 1000-1400.

Also given how few flights there are now, the number of gates in use is cut. I only see 6 & 11 in use on the transborder side (layout is 1-6, 11-12) and 14 to 17, 19 & 23 on the domestic side (normally 13-30). 11 to 13 are domestic/international-transborder swing gates, but there’s obviously no need for this right now.

YHZ have consolidated everything into 4 gates: 15, 16, 18 & 20: https://halifaxstanfield.ca/flight-i...on/departures/. 6 departures for Saturday.

Djeffery Apr 10, 2020 1:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casper (Post 8889501)
It is better for everyone for these people to stay AC employees paid by their employer, getting AC benefits with a plan to return to work after this is over.

vrs.

On a government program where they are disconnected from their employer, are getting no benefits, are filling out a form each week explaining what they are doing to try to search out new work and how they have not turned down any opportunity that they have been given.

I get that it's better for the employee, especially if the company does top up. Is it really better for Canada for the government to be paying double the amount of people this way? Seems like between this and the CERB, there is a lot of opportunity for taking advantage of. For example, practically all of my daughter's high school friends got nice little $2000 deposits in their banks this week for losing their $200 a week jobs.

whatnext Apr 10, 2020 1:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djeffery (Post 8889551)
I get that it's better for the employee, especially if the company does top up. Is it really better for Canada for the government to be paying double the amount of people this way? Seems like between this and the CERB, there is a lot of opportunity for taking advantage of. For example, practically all of my daughter's high school friends got nice little $2000 deposits in their banks this week for losing their $200 a week jobs.

Yes and I've heard of people getting both EI and CERB because they filed for both not knowing which they should apply for.

I can't see AC using flight attendants or pilots to install seats, so they will basically be paid to sit around at home. Now, I'm not against federal aid to AC or WS as critical employers but this seems silly. My employer has the financial reserves to pay our (admittedly small) staff for two months rather than lay them off. But why bother to absorb that loss if we can transfer it to the Feds?

LO 044 Apr 10, 2020 3:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatnext (Post 8889588)
Yes and I've heard of people getting both EI and CERB because they filed for both not knowing which they should apply for.

I can't see AC using flight attendants or pilots to install seats, so they will basically be paid to sit around at home. Now, I'm not against federal aid to AC or WS as critical employers but this seems silly. My employer has the financial reserves to pay our (admittedly small) staff for two months rather than lay them off. But why bother to absorb that loss if we can transfer it to the Feds?

Completely agree. Your employer had a safety cushion like many were taught to live by when something went wrong but they should get the handout as well. You have to make it across the board. It is unfair that some get and some don't.

These people will get back to their own job is over. Where are they going to go a competitor who also has the same issues? At my work you still get benefits on a temp layoff but you have to pay half of it for a couple of months.

thenoflyzone Apr 10, 2020 3:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djeffery (Post 8889551)
For example, practically all of my daughter's high school friends got nice little $2000 deposits in their banks this week for losing their $200 a week jobs.

You sure they already got the money? That was a bit fast.

Either way, students are not eligible for CERB. My guess is your daughter's friends are going to get a nice letter from the Canada Revenue Agency in a few months, asking for their money back.

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatnext (Post 8889588)
Yes and I've heard of people getting both EI and CERB because they filed for both not knowing which they should apply for.

Same thing for those people. They cannot claim both EI and CERB. It's one or the other.

A lot of people will try to screw the system. They will eventually be asked to return the money, probably with interest if past a certain deadline.

Djeffery Apr 10, 2020 3:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8889922)
You sure they already got the money? That was a bit fast.

Either way, students are not eligible for CERB. My guess is your daughter's friends are going to get a nice letter from the Canada Revenue Agency in a few months, asking for their money back.

https://www.canada.ca/en/services/be...pplication.htm

I don't see anything there that specifically excludes students, even the second item for eligibility is being 15 years old. It seems the story indicates the issue is the making $5000 in the previous year. Maybe many university students are too focused on studies to work, but as I said, my daughter is in high school, as are her friends, and have all worked for the last few years and easily passed that $5k threshold.

As for the people claiming both, I think even the PM said when he announced the CERB that if you had already applied for EI, you didn't need to do anything they would automatically enroll you in whatever program was best for you. Wouldn't surprise me at all if people got both, at least at the start, before the government figured out who gets what. Since the CERB can also be backdated to the middle of March, some people have received $3000 already, so maybe they think that is CERB and EI and just don't realize it's all CERB.

casper Apr 10, 2020 6:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by whatnext (Post 8889588)
Yes and I've heard of people getting both EI and CERB because they filed for both not knowing which they should apply for.

I can't see AC using flight attendants or pilots to install seats, so they will basically be paid to sit around at home. Now, I'm not against federal aid to AC or WS as critical employers but this seems silly. My employer has the financial reserves to pay our (admittedly small) staff for two months rather than lay them off. But why bother to absorb that loss if we can transfer it to the Feds?

A significant number of the pilots need to be retrained. AC has a number of aircraft types that are leaving the fleet. Those pilots need to be moved onto other types.

thenoflyzone Apr 11, 2020 1:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djeffery (Post 8889939)
https://www.canada.ca/en/services/be...pplication.htm

I don't see anything there that specifically excludes students

Click on the link in my post.

MonctonRad Apr 11, 2020 1:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by casper (Post 8890085)
A significant number of the pilots need to be retrained. AC has a number of aircraft types that are leaving the fleet. Those pilots need to be moved onto other types.

Presumably the flight attendants and maintenance crews would need training on the new equipment as well.

kwoldtimer Apr 11, 2020 2:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8890654)
Click on the link in my post.

The article you linked says that "many students" are not eligible. That would imply that some (i.e. those that meet the other criteria?) are eligible. Although, since working students are not eligible to receive EI, I'm not sure why they could collect CERB. :shrug:

Alexcaban Apr 11, 2020 3:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MonctonRad (Post 8890657)
Presumably the flight attendants and maintenance crews would need training on the new equipment as well.

Flight Attendants get trained way before the new aircraft enters the fleet. They need to be trained for all aircraft type that the carrier owns. Pilots can only be trained one aircraft at a time.

Djeffery Apr 11, 2020 6:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8890654)
Click on the link in my post.

Obviously my reply indicates I did read the story. " It seems the story indicates the issue is the making $5000 in the previous year. " If you are a student now who didn't work a lot last year to hit $5000, and then are facing zero job prospects this year, then that is the issue these students are having. They didn't make enough to qualify, it isn't the fact that they are students making them ineligible.

The link in my post is from the government site, and as I said, says a qualification is to be 15 years old. It doesn't say "15 years old and not be a student".

ssiguy Apr 11, 2020 7:51 PM

My brother-in-law recently had to fly from Vancouver to Toronto and said it was bliss compered to before the crisis. Tons of close parking, no line-ups, and the plane left and arrived on-time. He said it reminded him of what air travel use to be like when we were younger.

Those of you under 45 don't fully appreciate how dreadful air travel has become and especially for domestic flights. You never had to get your own boarding poass on a machine as the tellers did it for you and the line-ups weren't near as long, you could bring more heavy baggage on the overhead with no extra fees, you got a meal even on the shortest flights, pillows galore, no security line-ups at all...................you basically just got your boarding pass and then waited for the plane.

That was back when people looked forward to travelling by air as opposed to now which has become a truly painful affair just one notch above Chinese water torture.

whatnext Apr 11, 2020 8:00 PM

How Air Canada is adding cargo capacity:

Air Canada replaces seats with cargo in 777-300ER cabin
11 APRIL 2020 BY SETH MILLER

Air Canada is boosting its cargo capabilities with some creativity in the passenger cabin of its 777-300ER aircraft. Three of the planes, the largest in the carrier’s fleet, no longer have economy class seats on board. Instead the large space will be used to increase cargo carrying capacity on board...


https://paxex.aero/2020/04/air-canad...removed-cargo/

thenoflyzone Apr 11, 2020 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssiguy (Post 8890910)

Those of you under 45 don't fully appreciate how dreadful air travel has become

Pretty sure I don't need to be 45 to appreciate the dreadfulness of air travel, but I get your point.

Dominion301 Apr 12, 2020 4:00 PM

Proportionally, YVR's current daily pax count of 3,000 slides right in between YYZ's 5,000 and YOW's 300-800: https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/vanc...s-april-7-2020

Coldrsx Apr 12, 2020 4:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ssiguy (Post 8890910)
My brother-in-law recently had to fly from Vancouver to Toronto and said it was bliss compered to before the crisis. Tons of close parking, no line-ups, and the plane left and arrived on-time. He said it reminded him of what air travel use to be like when we were younger.

Those of you under 45 don't fully appreciate how dreadful air travel has become and especially for domestic flights. You never had to get your own boarding poass on a machine as the tellers did it for you and the line-ups weren't near as long, you could bring more heavy baggage on the overhead with no extra fees, you got a meal even on the shortest flights, pillows galore, no security line-ups at all...................you basically just got your boarding pass and then waited for the plane.

That was back when people looked forward to travelling by air as opposed to now which has become a truly painful affair just one notch above Chinese water torture.

Hahaha... so true.:cheers::(


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