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mello Dec 19, 2008 5:39 AM

So with this list of "green lighted projects" that are "shovel ready" about to get funding with Obama's new plan I would think that our new Federal Courthouse which went through a demolition of an old building and some "shoveling" would definitely qualify to get the additional funding that it needs to start construction.

Hopefully it can be built to the full 26 floor level originally planned instead of the scaled down version.

kpexpress Dec 19, 2008 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 3982856)
So with this list of "green lighted projects" that are "shovel ready" about to get funding with Obama's new plan I would think that our new Federal Courthouse which went through a demolition of an old building and some "shoveling" would definitely qualify to get the additional funding that it needs to start construction.

Hopefully it can be built to the full 26 floor level originally planned instead of the scaled down version.

The list was composed by the mayors of cities so you would think that projects more dedicated toward local government would get the green before a federal project would go, then again, it would hopefully bring in more jobs and such. I would like to see the extension of the trolley, parks downtown and maybe something with the airport.

I want to hear from everyone here, which projects in SD would you give a "shovel-ready" status to off the bat?

mello Dec 19, 2008 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpexpress (Post 3983103)
The list was composed by the mayors of cities so you would think that projects more dedicated toward local government would get the green before a federal project would go, then again, it would hopefully bring in more jobs and such. I would like to see the extension of the trolley, parks downtown and maybe something with the airport.

I want to hear from everyone here, which projects in SD would you give a "shovel-ready" status to off the bat?

This is my point, the federal courthouse would really add jobs to our economy. And it is a "local project" it happens to be a federal building but it will bring jobs to San Diegans and it is a "San Diego Courthouse". It isn't like an interstate highway that is used by people going cross country this is a building in "our community".

So I don't see any reason why Jerry Sanders the mayor of the 8th largest municipality in the U.S. wouldn't have it on that list.

Marina_Guy Dec 19, 2008 3:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 3983123)
This is my point, the federal courthouse would really add jobs to our economy. And it is a "local project" it happens to be a federal building but it will bring jobs to San Diegans and it is a "San Diego Courthouse". It isn't like an interstate highway that is used by people going cross country this is a building in "our community".

So I don't see any reason why Jerry Sanders the mayor of the 8th largest municipality in the U.S. wouldn't have it on that list.

Jerry Sanders is a short sighted mayor who does not have a clue how to build a world class city. We have spent years obsessing over the pension and ignoring the future.

In fact, I think San Diego has much to lose from the $$$$$$$$ planned to be spent. Our leaders have not had put any vision/leadership into public buildings, parks, 21st transit systems, etc. Now there will be money and San Diego will have little to show for.

How about undergrounding C street, undergrounding the rail along the bay, how about the transportation hub at the airport, trolley lines to UTC and UCSD, rubber trolley system circling 4th and 5th avenue (downtown to Hillcrest), the downtown library, the Federal Courthouse??? Put the Navy headquarters some where else downtown, and put a public building on NBC instead.

Just some thoughts...

Marina_Guy Dec 19, 2008 3:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 3983123)
This is my point, the federal courthouse would really add jobs to our economy. And it is a "local project" it happens to be a federal building but it will bring jobs to San Diegans and it is a "San Diego Courthouse". It isn't like an interstate highway that is used by people going cross country this is a building in "our community".

So I don't see any reason why Jerry Sanders the mayor of the 8th largest municipality in the U.S. wouldn't have it on that list.

Just one other thought... how about replacing every crummy bus in this town with a new one and use the capital $$$ saved to increase the frequency of the trolley and bus system. Studies show people will use them much more if the wait times are short and the system is reliable.

IconRPCV Dec 19, 2008 5:09 PM

I think that the Blue Line extension to La Jolla will be greenlighted as well as the Federal Courthouse. My wish would be that the County Admin Center Park and the North Embarcadro Plan would be funded as well.

A probably unrealistic dream would be a trolley extension up Park Blvd. to Hillcrest and North Park, oh yea and a shiny new airport at mirmar with the Blue Line Trolley extension serving it.

If I am really dreaming then when they move the airport we turn Lindberg into a park with a beautiful new stadium for the Chargers and one day the Olympic Opening Ceremonies.

Elect me mayor and all this will come to fruition.:yes:

staplesla Dec 19, 2008 7:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kpexpress (Post 3983103)
The list was composed by the mayors of cities so you would think that projects more dedicated toward local government would get the green before a federal project would go, then again, it would hopefully bring in more jobs and such. I would like to see the extension of the trolley, parks downtown and maybe something with the airport.

I want to hear from everyone here, which projects in SD would you give a "shovel-ready" status to off the bat?

The CA list will be harder to finalize as "shovel ready," meaning that all approvals have been completed, permits are in order, and the project is just awaiting funding.

As we all know other states require less approvals to "green light" a project. I was discussing this with a colleague of mine yesterday in the Dallas planning office and he said because of this you'll see other states getting a larger portion of the money compared to CA as they have more projects ready to go. In fact I was amazed at all the things Dallas was wanting (Calatrava bridges over the interstates, a new convention center highrise hotel, new Police department headquarters - all which the dallas city council met and approved since the Obama announcement and are ready to go.)

In addition, I've since learned that the trolley will not receive any funds as they have no projects with all approvals completed....so no line extensions. The only exception is the board could meet before the deadline of supplying the list to the Obama administration and approve the need and funding for newer trolley cars.

Also, the high-speed rail won't receive any of the funds as they are only in the design phase and will be for the next 5+ years.

Finally, none of the parks in the area have been "green lighted" except for the North Embarcadero.

HurricaneHugo Dec 21, 2008 5:43 AM

Yep, this city is pathetic.

eburress Dec 21, 2008 6:06 PM

^^ I'll second that. If it wasn't for San Diego's geography and climate, this would be such a depressing place to live. What a ridiculous city this is.

Marina_Guy Dec 21, 2008 6:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eburress (Post 3986630)
^^ I'll second that. If it wasn't for San Diego's geography and climate, this would be such a depressing place to live. What a ridiculous city this is.

I truly believe this.. The weather really helps people get away with a lot things in this 'town'. Seems be part of the fabric / culture. Maybe global warming will change that :)

Thoughts?

bmfarley Dec 21, 2008 8:29 PM

What is striking to me is the lack of leadership. It seems each elected official is afraid of being on the wrong side and remain within the confines of 'representing' their constituency.... and not truely stepping forward.

Mayor Sanders should be the regions leader... but he's spinning his wheels in the mud working on the city's budget. To me it feels he has opportunity there to make huge strides by pursuing fees for garbage collection, or use of 'gray' water for use in parks and non-human consumption. Or, to keep the Charger's in San Diego. But, he does nothing except further take an exacto knife to the budget; firepits?

No one on the council stands out. Neither of the remaining concilmembers have much charisma. Young has tried to step forward on some things, but he seems to lack the right step forward. Frye is a borderline loon. Faulconer... to early in his position to tell.

Our ex-city attorney tried and tried and tried to be a leader, but he was a borderline certifiable loon. Didn't he once request an escort to get to La Jolla to take command of the landslide? Or, during the fires suggest that the entire city be evacuated?

County Supervisor Ron Roberts... I am unsure I agree with his politics, but he seems to be associated with a lot of good things in the region. I am reminded of his performance during the fires and his efforts to get people to exchange their gas-powered lawn mowers for ones that are energy effecient. He's also spoken to keeping the Charger's here and on airport issues; such as a east-side terminal for improve access to the roadway and transit network.

Come to think of it... I am liking Roberts.

CoastersBolts Dec 21, 2008 10:33 PM

Corruption has always seemed to be rampant in this city as well. The past decade was certainly not the first time you had city councilmembers convicted of egregious acts; I believe a few were also thrown in prison in the 1970s around the time Pete Wilson was elected mayor. And let's not even get started with raising pension benefits while purposing underfunding the entire system for whatever weird reason.

This apparent corruption is always countered with the other extreme - the NIMBY/conspiracy theorist. Exemplified by this are your Donna Frye's, Mike Aguirre's, and others. This new council doesn't seem to represent a change from the past. Look at what former 10News reporter Marti Emerald did by stupidly and selfishly going up to the Miramar crash site two weeks ago and identifying the names of the victims ON AIR before the Fire Department notified next-of-kin. The only new councilmember I really have high hopes for is Todd Gloria. You have to have a pretty good head on your shoulders if, like him, you served as a district director for a US Congresswoman.

Marina_Guy Dec 22, 2008 12:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3986776)

....County Supervisor Ron Roberts... I am unsure I agree with his politics, but he seems to be associated with a lot of good things in the region. I am reminded of his performance during the fires and his efforts to get people to exchange their gas-powered lawn mowers for ones that are energy effecient. He's also spoken to keeping the Charger's here and on airport issues; such as a east-side terminal for improve access to the roadway and transit network.

Come to think of it... I am liking Roberts.

Roberts has run for mayor, like 50 times, and lost each time. I hear he is finally giving up is supervisor seat. For some reason San Diego didnt like him...

Falconer represents Downtown, Pt Loma, and the Beaches. That is a one difficult group of constituents to make happy. I don't think he gives a hoot about the Downtown resident.

I think Susan Davis has a chance to make some good here. She is the only one who is stepping up on Navy Broadway Complex and requesting the Navy look for another place for their headquarters building...

And there are a bunch of NIMBY conspiracy theorists who think CCDC is run by crooks and think all they do there is hand out checks to developers...

Oh my.

kpexpress Dec 22, 2008 1:34 AM

So has anyone here made their comments and criticisms known to the council? It seems that everyone is fed up with the lack of work and output the council and mayor has done in the past years (too many) but nothing ever changes. How do we fix the problems? I think it is sad that we have to sit around and poke people to see the city mature and develop. Saddest of all, is the fact that San Diego has some serious potential to become a truly world class city and a serious example of how to build cities and how to make memorable places that produce happy people.

Besides all the criticism, I love San Diego, and not just for the weather. I love all the quant little charismatic neighborhoods, geography, diverse citizens, and maritime-centered lifestyle (and you could pile on the criticism about how the city has turned it's cheek on it's natural maritime surroundings and climate).

laguna Dec 23, 2008 12:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 3986179)
Yep, this city is pathetic.

It must suck to be you.

Lets get pissy and demand that the broke government build trains that no one will ride, expand the trolley that no one but the homeless ride. But they are cute and I had a train set when I was a child and I never grew up. Lets move the airport and kick the Navy out, we dont approve of guns and fighter jets anyway, they are too militaristic. Besides that Bush makes wars and you know how we feel about him. I want the government to spend more and more, I dont care that the state and fed are beyond broke. It anyone disagrees with us, lets call them stupid or do like we did to those who voted for Prop 8. I want what I want-wa-wa-wa!

bmfarley Dec 23, 2008 5:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by laguna (Post 3988808)
It must suck to be you.

Lets get pissy and demand that the broke government build trains that no one will ride, expand the trolley that no one but the homeless ride. But they are cute and I had a train set when I was a child and I never grew up. Lets move the airport and kick the Navy out, we dont approve of guns and fighter jets anyway, they are too militaristic. Besides that Bush makes wars and you know how we feel about him. I want the government to spend more and more, I dont care that the state and fed are beyond broke. It anyone disagrees with us, lets call them stupid or do like we did to those who voted for Prop 8. I want what I want-wa-wa-wa!

Laguna, Maybe you're not from the San Diego area or know much about it, but the Trolley is the 4th most used light rail system in the country, behind only Boston, San Francisco and Los Angeles. It's always filled with people. Over 110,000 ride it each day. Of all the trips made on the system, 2/3rds are linked to downtown as either an on or an off... and tha majority at peak times are going to or from work. The Trolley is the biggest transportation success story in theis region, and among the tops in the country. The only mistake MTS makes... is not marketing their success story more loudly. Further, transit security is very present at stations and onboard trains... homeless that have the money may be on, but those that don't find themselves in a quick fix and end up not making that mistake again. Regardless, the large majority of time, people keep to themselves and avoid eye contact with each other... much like every where else where the public crosses paths.

Come to think of it, are you angry. I seem to notice a lot more angry people out and about lately.

Crackertastik Dec 23, 2008 4:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3989360)
Laguna, Maybe you're not from the San Diego area or know much about it, but the Trolley is the 4th most used light rail system in the country, behind only Boston, San Francisco and Los Angeles. It's always filled with people. Over 110,000 ride it each day. Of all the trips made on the system, 2/3rds are linked to downtown as either an on or an off... and tha majority at peak times are going to or from work. The Trolley is the biggest transportation success story in theis region, and among the tops in the country. The only mistake MTS makes... is not marketing their success story more loudly. Further, transit security is very present at stations and onboard trains... homeless that have the money may be on, but those that don't find themselves in a quick fix and end up not making that mistake again. Regardless, the large majority of time, people keep to themselves and avoid eye contact with each other... much like every where else where the public crosses paths.

Come to think of it, are you angry. I seem to notice a lot more angry people out and about lately.

This is a cool bit of information...one question though. Are New York and Chicago transit systems not considered light rail? There is no way we have more passengers than them, i wouldn't think.

Seriously though, Southern California would be literally heaven on earth if it could fix two big problems. Traffic/transit and Air Quality. Luckily the area is hard at work doing so.

I imagine in 50 years, :( ill be old by then if around at all, Southern California will have a spider web of light rail working day and night, clean cars, less traffic, and clean air.

Honestly though, San Diego needs to market their success with transit more, and continue it. Until you can go pretty much everywhere on a rail line within the county, more regularly.

bmfarley Dec 23, 2008 4:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crackertastik (Post 3989954)
This is a cool bit of information...one question though. Are New York and Chicago transit systems not considered light rail? There is no way we have more passengers than them, i wouldn't think.

Those agencies operate heavy rail. The distinction between heavy and light is sometimes blurred, but characteristics include operating in-street environments, and lower speed.

The San Francisco example is their Muni Rail... the N J M N lines and so forth. Boston's is the Green line. LA's is also their Green and Orange lines (may have missed one).

As an example, BART in SF is heavy rail and so is LA's Red Line.

Marina_Guy Dec 24, 2008 2:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3990029)
Those agencies operate heavy rail. The distinction between heavy and light is sometimes blurred, but characteristics include operating in-street environments, and lower speed.

The San Francisco example is their Muni Rail... the N J M N lines and so forth. Boston's is the Green line. LA's is also their Green and Orange lines (may have missed one).

As an example, BART in SF is heavy rail and so is LA's Red Line.

My beef with the trolley is the wait times. I dont think you should have to wait more than 5 minutes for a train. That may not sound reasonable, but people have no patience, especially those who can use their cars instead. And why do we still have to switch trains in Old Town... That is the dumbest thing. I know it has to do with what types of cars the Mission Valley segment can support, but come on, that should have been corrected years ago.

bmfarley Dec 24, 2008 4:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Marina_Guy (Post 3991039)
My beef with the trolley is the wait times. I dont think you should have to wait more than 5 minutes for a train. That may not sound reasonable, but people have no patience, especially those who can use their cars instead. And why do we still have to switch trains in Old Town... That is the dumbest thing. I know it has to do with what types of cars the Mission Valley segment can support, but come on, that should have been corrected years ago.

I feel for you. I agree too. I happen to know that plans are in place to retrofit each of the stations from Old Town into downtown and along the Bay Side all the way to the backside to the 12th & Imperial Trolley Station. The retrofit will raise the platforms a bit so that the new low floor cars can serve them; specifically for the wheelchair ramps so that the incline is within ADA requirements for slope. Once that is complete, the Green Line will be extended from Old Town into downtown.

It could happen in phases.... 1st to Santa Fe Depot and then along Bayside. When that happens, the Blue Line would be pulled back to Santa Fe Depot and not run up to Old Town. And the Orange Line would be pulled back to America Plaza... or possible end also at Santa Fe Depot. It could keep it's current pattern, but then that would mean unnecessary service along Bayside and possibly put too many trains in a single track at 12th & Imperial.

Obviously some details remain to be worked out.... lack of track/platform space at Santa Fe Depot prevents all three lines serving the station without additional improvements there. And, scheduling and possibly safety affect the Orange Line laying over at America Plaza for extended times when the Blue Line would run through it. Both Blue and Orange could possible terminate at America Plaza, but a compromise would be a transfer with a walk across Kettner to get from Santa Fe Depot to America Plaza.

Some of this could begin in the next couple years at the earliest. MTS plans to first focus on rehabilitating the line down to San Ysidro... which is terribly bumpy and in need of improvement. It needs new road bed, rail and catenary. The stations need work too.

Concerning better headways.... I also happen to know that the regional Transportation Plan depicts headways improving on all the Trolley lines.... some lines see it earlier than others. It's demand based.... b/c as we know, running more trains costs more money. And, although the Trolley gets a good share of its operating revenue from fares, a lot of public subsidy is still needed to operate the system. And, where is that suppose to come from if there isn't any available.

That said, when additional capacity is needed the Trolley/MTS first look at adding a train car onto existing trains. That's cheaper and does not require a schedule change. It can also be done on the fly, for the most part, but running more cars does cost more too.

It's pertinent to know that the Trolley network is extremely complicated, despite what it looks like on a map. Some line segments can only handle a limited number of trains in each direction each hour.... like minimum or closest headways. The downtown C Street and Park corridor is one... 4 minutes between trains is the best that can be practically scheduled... now trains average 5 minute spacing at peak times (Blue & Orange lines together). From Old Town to Santa Fe Depot signals permit trains running as close as 5 minutes.., now at peak times trains run as close as 7-8 minutes. From downtown to San Ysidro... the best is 7 minutes... but the rehab work may include signal improvements that would improve that capability.

Another, because the Orange Line terminates at the Gillespie Field Station and occupy valuable track space while the train operator switches ends of the train, and the network configuration with scheduling parameters elsewhere... the best headway that can be practically scheduled on the Green Line is a train every 15 minutes. A siding off the mainline for the Orange Line to terminate at would provide more scheduling flexibility... and I think at El Cajon would be the best location for that to occur.


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