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-   -   Canadian Airport Thread (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=153826)

Marty_Mcfly Jan 13, 2021 2:32 AM

Realistically, as soon as the pandemic is over and things start returning to normal the St. John's-Toronto flight will be restored. Just a pain in the ass right now. However, it's really just workers traveling back and forth on that route currently. I'd say, on any given normal day, the early morning YYT-YYZ is the most-travelled route out of St. John's, since it allows for early-morning connections out of Pearson.

zahav Jan 13, 2021 2:40 AM

As much as it is brutal right now with lack of flights, travel really should only be if absolutely necessary right now. So much spread is due to travel, it's been shown over and over. Everyone wants things to bounce back of course, but in the meantime this is a consequence of people doing what they are told.

Prairiedawg Jan 13, 2021 3:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory (Post 9157811)
I believe those smaller airports (particularly Sydney, Saint Johns and soon Fredericton) have no commercial flights at all. One would have to drive to Moncton or Halifax.

I have to admit I really don't know how far of a drive it would be for most people in those provinces to get to Halifax or Moncton. I've always thought of those provinces as smaller scale in area.

In Alberta, cities similar sized to Frederickton, Saint Johns or Sydney like Lethbridge, Red Deer and Medicine Hat have to fly to or simply drive to Calgary at the best of times to fly to further afield destinations or arriving home. In my mind I sympathize that those eastern provinces have lost their commercial flights but it isn't much different than what most rural people in Alberta already have to do all the time.

Hali87 Jan 13, 2021 5:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Prairiedawg (Post 9157925)
I have to admit I really don't know how far of a drive it would be for most people in those provinces to get to Halifax or Moncton. I've always thought of those provinces as smaller scale in area.

In Alberta, cities similar sized to Frederickton, Saint Johns or Sydney like Lethbridge, Red Deer and Medicine Hat have to fly to or simply drive to Calgary at the best of times to fly to further afield destinations or arriving home. In my mind I sympathize that those eastern provinces have lost their commercial flights but it isn't much different than what most rural people in Alberta already have to do all the time.

Sydney (the main urban centre in Cape Breton) to YHZ is about a 4-5 hour drive. The northernmost parts of CB (around Highlands National Park) would be a bit further. In the other direction, Yarmouth-Halifax is about 3 hours. Most other points in NS would be closer than that to YHZ, which is located near the geographic centre of the province.

Moncton is in the southeast corner of NB near the border with NS and the bridge to PEI. Saint John and Fredericton are each about 1-2 west of Moncton. Northern NB cities like Campbellton and Edmundston are probably about 5 hours away and might be slightly closer to Quebec City (not sure). Moncton-YHZ would be about a 3 hour drive, Edmundston-YHZ about 8 hours.

Worth noting that while YHZ is still operational, many of its routes have been suspended since the beginning of the pandemic, some even earlier due to the Max8 groundings. Pretty much all international service (including US) has ended and service within Canada is quite limited.

hollywoodcory Jan 13, 2021 12:51 PM

Looks like AC is cutting the following domestic destinations:

Yellowknife
Kamloops
Goose Bay
Gander
Fredericton
Prince Rupert

samuelx88 Jan 13, 2021 6:42 PM

According to Radio-Canada, AC will also cut YQB-YYZ. I'm very surprised by that since it was twice daily last week and YQB is the 7th largest city in the country and is not affected by any quarantine for visitors from other provinces, as opposed to Halifax for exemple

whatnext Jan 13, 2021 7:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory (Post 9158046)
Looks like AC is cutting the following domestic destinations:

Yellowknife
Kamloops
Goose Bay
Gander
Fredericton
Prince Rupert

Comox and and Sandspit are also gone.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/busi...ff-1700-staff/

Dominion301 Jan 13, 2021 8:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by samuelx88 (Post 9158443)
According to Radio-Canada, AC will also cut YQB-YYZ. I'm very surprised by that since it was twice daily last week and YQB is the 7th largest city in the country and is not affected by any quarantine for visitors from other provinces, as opposed to Halifax for exemple

Last week was the end of the holiday “rush”. Another example is YOW-YHZ was operating up to 3x over the holidays and is now cut too.

For the next few weeks we’re going to see traffic levels similar to last May.

thenoflyzone Jan 14, 2021 9:39 AM

Air Canada is picking up the pace of A319/A320 retirements. With the Max return to service imminent, plus all those A220 deliveries, it was a matter of time.

So far this month, 5 A319s and 5 A320s flew to MCI (Kansas City) for part out and scrapping. They include C-GBIP, first A319 prototype to roll out of the Airbus factories, with first flight back in August of 1995. AC took delivery of the plane in 1998. The list also includes, C-FZUH, the retro Trans Canada Airlines jet.

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/reg...LC=nav4&page=1

SignalHillHiker Jan 14, 2021 11:04 AM

I’m not by nature a fearful person - I’ll get any vaccine and all of that - but I’m surprised by how deeply uncomfortable I am with the idea of flying on a MAX. I just think... get fucked, Boeing. Never again.

Dominion301 Jan 14, 2021 5:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 9159253)
Air Canada is picking up the pace of A319/A320 retirements. With the Max return to service imminent, plus all those A220 deliveries, it was a matter of time.

So far this month, 5 A319s and 5 A320s flew to MCI (Kansas City) for part out and scrapping. They include C-GBIP, first A319 prototype to roll out of the Airbus factories, with first flight back in August of 1995. AC took delivery of the plane in 1998. The list also includes, C-FZUH, the retro Trans Canada Airlines jet.

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/reg...LC=nav4&page=1

I never knew AC had the 319 prototype. Sad to hear that the TCA 319 is being retired. I flew that bird twice. I would imagine the younger 319s and 320s (obviously the rouge 320s) will stick around with the 321s. I know AC said back in May that all non-Jetz 319s were being retired, but that plan seemed to have change...maybe it’s changed again?

As for the MAX, I’ll wait a good 2 years before setting foot on one in order for it to prove itself...not that I’ll be flying anytime soon as it is.

wave46 Jan 14, 2021 9:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominion301 (Post 9159635)
I never knew AC had the 319 prototype. Sad to hear that the TCA 319 is being retired. I flew that bird twice. I would imagine the younger 319s and 320s (obviously the rouge 320s) will stick around with the 321s. I know AC said back in May that all non-Jetz 319s were being retired, but that plan seemed to have change...maybe it’s changed again?

As for the MAX, I’ll wait a good 2 years before setting foot on one in order for it to prove itself...not that I’ll be flying anytime soon as it is.

I think AC's fleet plan includes keeping only the younger A320s and A321s. The A319s are getting up there in age and with a bunch of new A220s coming online, they just don't need the capacity right now for that particular segment (~120-140 seats). At this juncture, an A319 is worth more as parts for keeping the rest of the fleet going.

I'd fly the MAX, but Boeing has spent the last few years leaving a sour taste in my mouth with the way they've acted (see: CSeries, MAX crashes, revelations of culture rot in the company), so to see them get their comeuppance doesn't make me shed a tear.

The big question for me is how long AC flies the MAX for. They've cancelled all their MAX 9 orders and reduced their MAX 8 orders (as part of Boeing's compensation deal?). They're keeping their newer A320s/321s, which leads me to believe they'll eventually come back to Airbus in a few years for A320neos after all this mess shakes out for airlines. Running 3 different narrowbody fleets doesn't really make sense - I'd imagine one will be phased out.

wave46 Jan 14, 2021 9:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 9159253)
...the retro Trans Canada Airlines jet...

Hopefully we can get an A220 in a retro livery. Maybe a '70s livery version?

hollywoodcory Jan 15, 2021 12:02 AM

Speaking of Air Canada and the MAX, it looks like they've added it to several routes in February.

For example: YYC-PHX/CUN & even OGG are all scheduled to be operated by a MAX by mid-February.

Quite a different approach from WestJet's re-introduction plan in which they operate on routes with multiple flights per day, allowing pax to change flights if they aren't comfortable flying on a MAX.

thenoflyzone Jan 15, 2021 7:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory (Post 9160266)
Speaking of Air Canada and the MAX, it looks like they've added it to several routes in February.

For example: YYC-PHX/CUN & even OGG are all scheduled to be operated by a MAX by mid-February.

Quite a different approach from WestJet's re-introduction plan in which they operate on routes with multiple flights per day, allowing pax to change flights if they aren't comfortable flying on a MAX.

YYC-OGG...>ETOPS180......hmm....I wouldn't fly on that one, personally. At least not yet. The rest is no problem. These planes have been sitting somewhere for close to 2 years now. No way they were able to visually inspect every gasket/seal on these planes. I wouldn't want to cross an ocean on the first month of return to service.

Dominion301 Jan 15, 2021 7:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hollywoodcory (Post 9160266)
Speaking of Air Canada and the MAX, it looks like they've added it to several routes in February.

For example: YYC-PHX/CUN & even OGG are all scheduled to be operated by a MAX by mid-February.

Quite a different approach from WestJet's re-introduction plan in which they operate on routes with multiple flights per day, allowing pax to change flights if they aren't comfortable flying on a MAX.

Looking at 19FEB21, I see the MAX scheduled on the domestic following routes:
YOW-YYZ (most of any route with 3/4 daily - the other being a 321)
YUL-YYZ
YEG-YYZ
YHZ-YYZ
YWG-YYZ
YVR-YYZ (on 22FE21)

A few other observations domestically with the latest AC schedule upload:

-Very few A320s scheduled, so their numbers are dwindling.

-A lot more A220 flying.

-No A319s scheduled - they might be done for good (excluding the Jetz birds) as soon as the MAX is cleared again.

-Strangely there's no YYC-YYZ or YYC-YUL flights. AC must be rotating the MAXes in/out of YYC via the transborder routes...or YYC-YYZ has the MAX on select days of the week.

-AC actually have a new domestic route. You can book YXE-YQR in both directions on AC for the first time in at least a decade. YXE-YYZ appears to be another dropped route (or it operates less-than-daily [or maybe n/s in 1 direction only as YXE-YVR appears to be] as 19FEB21 is the only date I checked). There's a CR9 that is timed to connect to the sole CR9 YQR-YYZ flight. It's probably the same aircraft even though there's a change in flight number.

thenoflyzone Jan 15, 2021 7:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominion301 (Post 9161144)

-Very few A320s scheduled, so their numbers are dwindling.

-No A319s scheduled - they might be done for good

Indeed. An 11th frame (this month) went to MCI yesterday. A320 C-FMSX. There were quite a few in December 2020 as well. Numbers are going down fast.

https://www.skyliner-aviation.de/regdb.main?LC=nav4

AC still has 4 A319s left I believe, not counting the ones at Rouge. They are all 23 years old, just like the ones that retired this month, so will most likely be gone soon.

wave46 Jan 15, 2021 7:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 9161141)
YYC-OGG...>ETOPS180......hmm....I wouldn't fly on that one, personally. At least not yet. The rest is no problem. These planes have been sitting somewhere for close to 2 years now. No way there were able to visually inspect every gasket/seal on these planes. I wouldn't want to cross an ocean on the first month of return to service.

Certainly not. I don't want to be the first to make 'Engines Turn or Passengers Swim' a phrase rooted in reality.

If the MAX had engine issues coming out of storage (I think they had to divert recently for that issue), I'd want at least a year of reasonably intensive trouble free operation before heading over that much open water.

Heck, I'd trust one of their still usable but older A320s before a new MAX at this juncture.

nname Jan 15, 2021 8:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dominion301 (Post 9161144)
-AC actually have a new domestic route. You can book YXE-YQR in both directions on AC for the first time in at least a decade. YXE-YYZ appears to be another dropped route (or it operates less-than-daily [or maybe n/s in 1 direction only as YXE-YVR appears to be] as 19FEB21 is the only date I checked). There's a CR9 that is timed to connect to the sole CR9 YQR-YYZ flight. It's probably the same aircraft even though there's a change in flight number.

AC to consolidate both YQR and YXE routes:

YYZ-YXE-YQR-YYZ
YVR-YQR-YXE-YQR-YVR

Each segment will have a different flight number though.

casper Jan 16, 2021 3:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nname (Post 9161280)
AC to consolidate both YQR and YXE routes:

YYZ-YXE-YQR-YYZ
YVR-YQR-YXE-YQR-YVR

Each segment will have a different flight number though.

Back to that. That was the norm before AC purchased the Embraer E90 and the CRJ-705/900 aircraft. Back then the YYZ-YXE-YQR-YYZ route was usually on an A320 type aircraft.


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