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esquire Jul 26, 2019 1:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Djeffery (Post 8642157)
I wonder how much confidence the flying public is going to have in this thing even when it does come back into service?

You have to wonder. The image of this model is so tarnished now that I'm sure some people are questioning if it can ever be rehabilitated.

thenoflyzone Jul 26, 2019 9:43 PM

Wonder if they will rename the plane and move away from the MAX branding altogether.

Cage Jul 26, 2019 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire (Post 8642453)
You have to wonder. The image of this model is so tarnished now that I'm sure some people are questioning if it can ever be rehabilitated.

There really no choice for the flying public. Boeing and the airlines can't go back to previous versions of the aircraft. The industry industry cant remain viable and scrap 350+ airplanes. The flying public can't all fly only 320 and older 737 airplanes.

What will happen is that airplanes will no linger be tweaked and extended every few years. Innovation and pace of improved environmental performance will slow down. It will be the dreamliner type of all new generational leap forward or status quo.

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8642877)
Wonder if they will rename the plane and move away from the MAX branding altogether.

There have been many rumors. The I think most probable is that a branding merger with the 737-800/900/700 etc will occur. So AC and WS will both fly the 737-800. Only difference will be minor and only us avgeeks will be able to tell.

Winglets and engine cowlings etc will be made indistinguishable between NG and Max programs.

wave46 Jul 27, 2019 1:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by esquire (Post 8642453)
You have to wonder. The image of this model is so tarnished now that I'm sure some people are questioning if it can ever be rehabilitated.

The McDonnell Douglas DC-10 made a comeback after some pretty public disasters, including one in Chicago where the final moments were caught in photos.

American Airlines Flight 191

Quote:

Originally Posted by thenoflyzone (Post 8642877)
Wonder if they will rename the plane and move away from the MAX branding altogether.

I think that will be the route Boeing and airlines will go - The Boeing 737-MAX 8 will become the Boeing 737-8. People know the 'MAX' branding, not the numbers.

SignalHillHiker Jul 27, 2019 1:40 AM

I'm not even an aviation nerd (at least not in the same strength I'm a history nerd, geography nerd, politics nerd, etc.) But I have watched a dozen or more of Wendovers videos about aviation - the five freedoms of aviation, how airlines make money, how airlines choose where to fly, etc. It's fascinating. Especially to see how first class isn't even a thing in Canada, and is starting to fade worldwide because business class is more profitable. It's fascinating stuff. And I assumed the sardine passengers were covering most of the cost of a flight. In reality, economy class covers 1/3. Business classes cover the vast majority of costs/profit. Highly recommend his videos.

Video Link

J81 Jul 27, 2019 5:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cage (Post 8642900)
Winglets and engine cowlings etc will be made indistinguishable between NG and Max programs.


You cant make the engine cowl on the MAX look like the ones on the NG. Completely different engines which are considerably larger then the CFM-56 on the NG. The size of the new engines and what Boeing had to do to make them fit on the 737 is one of the main reasons Boeing incorporated the MCAS system. At the end of the day very few passengers know what kind of aircraft theyre on and the little cosmetic differences hardly matter to the untrained eye. Only thing id see the airlines having to change is the name on the safety cards.

connect2source Jul 27, 2019 3:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46 (Post 8643019)
I think that will be the route Boeing and airlines will go - The Boeing 737-MAX 8 will become the Boeing 737-8. People know the 'MAX' branding, not the numbers.

Ryanair has already dropped the MAX name. As noted on some of the stored MAX's for Ryanair, the branding now reads as the 737-8200.

MacLac Jul 27, 2019 3:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46 (Post 8643019)
The McDonnell Douglas DC-10 made a comeback after some pretty public disasters, including one in Chicago where the final moments were caught in photos.

American Airlines Flight 191



I think that will be the route Boeing and airlines will go - The Boeing 737-MAX 8 will become the Boeing 737-8. People know the 'MAX' branding, not the numbers.

You "think" that's what Boeing will do? Must work for them in some capacity? Consulting? Coincidentally, BA already uses the 737-800, previous to their MAX. So for them to name the MAX fleet ain't gonna fly.....

Djeffery Jul 27, 2019 5:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacLac (Post 8643293)
You "think" that's what Boeing will do? Must work for them in some capacity? Consulting? Coincidentally, BA already uses the 737-800, previous to their MAX. So for them to name the MAX fleet ain't gonna fly.....

One will be the 737-800 as it is now, the other will be 737-8. Frequent fliers and airline buffs will know the difference. The general flying public that doesn't pay attention to the type of plane they are on won't know or care.

J81 Jul 27, 2019 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacLac (Post 8643293)
You "think" that's what Boeing will do? Must work for them in some capacity? Consulting? Coincidentally, BA already uses the 737-800, previous to their MAX. So for them to name the MAX fleet ain't gonna fly.....

BA does not fly the 737-800

wave46 Jul 27, 2019 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MacLac (Post 8643293)
You "think" that's what Boeing will do? Must work for them in some capacity? Consulting? Coincidentally, BA already uses the 737-800, previous to their MAX. So for them to name the MAX fleet ain't gonna fly.....

Yes, "think".

Synonyms: ponder, reflect, deliberate, meditate, contemplate, muse, cogitate

I don't have "facts" so I only operate on speculation about what seems fairly obvious.

"-8" and "-800" are different identifiers, so I don't see why they'll have a problem dropping the MAX branding. Anyone who cares about aviation in more than a passing sense will probably know why the "-8" is different from the "-800" whereas Joe Public will probably not know what plane they're on.

I doubt most people knew the difference between an Airbus A320 and Boeing 737 prior to this. They look about the same. Similarly, to an average person knowing the difference between a 767, A330 and 787 - they're painted tubes with wings and 2 engines to most people.

For an iconic plane like the Concorde or the 747, yeah, I get those being distinctive.

wave46 Jul 27, 2019 10:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by J81 (Post 8643469)
BA does not fly the 737-800

BA can also be referring to Boeing's stock identifier.

connect2source Jul 27, 2019 10:26 PM

Ryanair's already begun the name change. After today's New York Times article, I'm having my doubts this piece-of-crap will ever fly again.

https://www.theguardian.com/business...es-name-change

SpongeG Jul 28, 2019 5:22 AM

Boeing reportedly kept the FAA in the dark about big changes it made to the 737 Max's flight-control software late in its development

Troy Wolverton Business Insider

The Federal Aviation Administration didn't understand the risks of the flight-control system in Boeing's 737 Max before the first of its fatal accidents last October, according to a new report in The New York Times.

The engineers charged with overseeing the safety of the automated software had little experience with such systems, according to the report.

The FAA allowed Boeing to assess the safety of the system itself, The Times reported.

Boeing largely kept the agency in the dark about the importance and risks of the system and didn't give the FAA an updated safety assessment after making a significant change to the software late in the plane's development, the report said.

https://www.businessinsider.com/boei...ersight-2019-7

J81 Jul 28, 2019 8:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wave46 (Post 8643473)
BA can also be referring to Boeing's stock identifier.

The way he worded it made it sound like he was referring to British Airways but i see now that he was stating that Boeing has used the 737-800 name.

Pinus Jul 29, 2019 11:16 AM

WAA Fuels Growth and Expands Offerings in Second Quarter of 2019

WINNIPEG, Manitoba – July 25, 2019 – Winnipeg Airports Authority (WAA) continued to build on its strong start to 2019, with the second quarter of the year seeing increased domestic and international travel and cargo growth.

Winnipeg Richardson International Airport greeted more than 1.1 million travellers in the second quarter of 2019, a 1.9 percent increase over the same period in 2018. May 2019 saw the greatest increase, up 4.1 percent over the same period in 2018.

“These results reflect a strong demand for air travel in this region,” said Barry Rempel, President and CEO of WAA. “Sustainable growth in passenger and cargo traffic demonstrates that WAA’s plan is working.”

Travellers will have new options for direct routes later this year as low cost airline Swoop has added seven new direct routes including flights to Las Vegas, Los Cabos, Tampa and Fort Lauderdale.

Source: https://www.waa.ca/media/news/articl...uarter-of-2019

Good to see some continued solid growth :tup:

SFUVancouver Jul 29, 2019 4:27 PM

Recent YVR international terminal expansion photos
 
I flew through Vancouver this weekend on the way to the Island and was fortunate to have: (a) a window seat; (b) good weather; (c) a window that wasn't too scratched up; and (d) the wherewithal to have my phone handy to take some photos on final approach. Without further adieu:

https://i.imgur.com/8cGeIMC.jpg?1
Source: me
Date: 2019-07-27

https://i.imgur.com/eq0TQFy.jpg?1
Source: me
Date: 2019-07-27

https://i.imgur.com/0NEuYGA.jpg?1
Source: me
Date: 2019-07-27

I got a different perspective on the expansion on my return flight.

https://i.imgur.com/Vp5AbVQ.jpg?1
Source: me
Date: 2019-07-28

A bit of additional reading on the YVR terminal expansion project and various other initiatives that are rolled up in the airport's $9B capital program... this includes the aforementioned terminal international expansion, a new parking structure, relocation of employee (and economy?) parking to the Templeton SkyTrain Station, runway safety upgrades and expanded taxiway network, expanded cargo village, geoexchange district energy plant, remote stand operations and busing for some domestic and transborder flights, transition to enhanced low impact development (LID) landscaping, etc. Suffice it to say, a lot of work is underway and planned for the coming years.

http://www.yvr.ca/en/passengers/cons...major-projects

YVR is Expanding video on YouTube

G.S MTL Jul 30, 2019 7:42 PM

May 1 602 080 +5.5%
June 1 836 408 +4.2%

YTD 9 684 355 +5.7%

Domestic

May 582 124 +3.2%
June 589 769 +0.1%

Transborder

May 361 156 +1.5%
June 381 054 -0.1%

International

May 608 849 +10.6%
June 783 894 +10.4



Pretty strong on international but Domestic and trans... yikes.

thenoflyzone Jul 30, 2019 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by G.S MTL (Post 8645534)
May 1 602 080 +5.5%
June 1 836 408 +4.2%

YTD 9 684 355 +5.7%

Domestic

May 582 124 +3.2%
June 589 769 +0.1%

Transborder

May 361 156 +1.5%
June 381 054 -0.1%

International

May 608 849 +10.6%
June 783 894 +10.4



Pretty strong on international but Domestic and trans... yikes.

Max related weaknesses on the transborder and domestic fronts no doubt.
Overall numbers and intl numbers are the two most important ones and in those departments, YUL is doing extremely well.

Zmonkey Jul 31, 2019 4:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SignalHillHiker (Post 8643031)
I'm not even an aviation nerd (at least not in the same strength I'm a history nerd, geography nerd, politics nerd, etc.) But I have watched a dozen or more of Wendovers videos about aviation - the five freedoms of aviation, how airlines make money, how airlines choose where to fly, etc. It's fascinating. Especially to see how first class isn't even a thing in Canada, and is starting to fade worldwide because business class is more profitable. It's fascinating stuff. And I assumed the sardine passengers were covering most of the cost of a flight. In reality, economy class covers 1/3. Business classes cover the vast majority of costs/profit. Highly recommend his videos.

Video Link


Business class today is what first class was 15 years ago.
Private planes are getting cheaper too, and now have fractal ownership, that is taking a lot of F business as well.

As someone who has been on Lufthanas first class (on points) it is really nice, and the lounge in Frankfurt is amazing. But if you are spending actual $$ for most people Business is great.


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