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-   -   NEW YORK | 111 W 57th St | 1,428 FT | 85 FLOORS (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=198228)

Barbarossa Mar 18, 2013 8:49 PM

There is no work on this site. Never believe what the developer says.

NYguy Mar 18, 2013 8:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Barbarossa (Post 6056853)
There is no work on this site. Never believe what the developer says.

In most cases, what the developer says is what happens.

Quote:

This slender new condo tower is being developed by JDS Development Group and Property Markets Group, the team behind well-received condo conversion Walker Tower. Located on a vacant lot on 57th Street just west of Sixth Avenue, the 700-foot-tall, 52-story building will have around 30 units, Stern said, many of them duplexes. Plans call for roughly 10,000 square feet of retail on the first and second floors. Construction is slated to begin this quarter and be completed in 2014.
What we don't know is if that was the latest, most accurate information. But at the very least, we wait until the quarter is over. Even then, if it starts a month or two after that, it's really no big deal, as long as it gets built.

JayPro Mar 18, 2013 10:03 PM

@NYGuy;

Thanks for the blow-up image; but I fear that now it just makes it look more like something I would've put together with an random set of Legos when I was maybe twelve, and simply *pretended* to see a curve on one elevation and a slant on the one adjacent to it.

But the one *big* mistake in this render is the half-drawn base occluded by the structure in the foreground.

Details, my friends. Details, details and more details. This, ostensibly, is what those commissioned to make renderings for proposed skyscrapers are supposed to emphasize in order to ultimately get something built.

So here they half-ass it with the podium/base. And they continue to sell the viewer on a nearly 700' structure whose form essentially cannot be fully extrapolated from the render's vantage point, and whose placement in the skyline cannot be properly gleaned, no thanks to what I can plainly see is a horribly inaccurate drawing of One57.

Whoever can, with a straight face, simply up and tell me that this rendering is somehow meant to give an idea of the building's visual and aesthetic presence and contribution to a greater whole is a brave man indeed. No question IMO arises in terms of height, of course when considered per se.

Bottom line?

C o n t e x t. So much in this regard is yet to be found wanting. I'll be happy to wait till more illustrations hit cyberspace.

NYguy Mar 27, 2013 7:56 AM

They just bought the neighboring building...

http://commercialobserver.com/2013/0...t-57th-street/

Quote:

Steinway Hall building, which houses company’s flagship showroom, is 16 stories and 247,000 square feet. The first Steinway Hall was built in 1866 on 14th Street, according to the company’s website.


http://cityroom.blogs.nytimes.com/20...room-building/

http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/...icleInline.jpg

March 26, 2013

Quote:

He said the new owner did not intend to tear down Steinway Hall, which was designed by Warren & Wetmore, the same firm that is known for its work on Grand Central Terminal. As for what will happen to Steinway Hall, Mr. Stern said, “We’re not sure yet. We haven’t determined what our plans are for the property.

JDS Development controls the vacant site just east of Steinway Hall and is ready to break ground on a tower there, he said.




ablerock Mar 27, 2013 4:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy (Post 6068395)
They just bought the neighboring building...


http://graphics8.nytimes.com/images/...icleInline.jpg

March 26, 2013

The two little buildings to the left of Steinway Hall can't be long for this world, I'd imagine.

Busy Bee Mar 27, 2013 5:19 PM

Yeah I'd have no problem with integrating Steinway into the base of a much larger tower, say 1200' or so.. ;)

NYguy Mar 27, 2013 8:48 PM

Although smaller, it has more than twice the space of the planned new tower next door. But I don't think it will be torn down (I don't think it can). These are the people behind the Walker Tower, so they could have success with converting the building to luxury residential.



http://www.montclair.edu/news/media/..._Hall_.jpg.jpg
http://www.montclair.edu/news/articl...ArticleID=7384


http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2151/1...623bcc01_b.jpg
This Week in New York: twi-ny.com


http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2181/1...c5a678da_z.jpg

Design-mind Mar 27, 2013 9:20 PM

Does not look as skinny as Park 432 only because it is shorter. I believe that the floor plate size for 107W 57 is a lot smaller. Does anyone know the sq footage for each of these super skinnies?

easy as pie Mar 27, 2013 9:47 PM

haha, as if they don't know what they're going to do with that building. it's called luxe condos on the upper floors of the steinway building and air rights transfer to the adjacent 107 w57th site, adding something like another 30 floors. seems pretty straightforward aside from the decision about incorporation of the steinway into the base of the tower development/maintaining bottom floors or entire building as stand alone or whatever.

i love this tower design, so personally, i'd rather see the rights transferred off-site, but with how ultra-luxe w57th is these days, seems unlikely unless they already have another site ready to go (or if the rights could be sold at a huge price to another tower in the near vicinity...)

scalziand Mar 27, 2013 9:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Busy Bee (Post 6068751)
Yeah I'd have no problem with integrating Steinway into the base of a much larger tower, say 1200' or so.. ;)

I think it would be better to just transfer the air rights over and leave the Steinway as is.

NYguy Mar 27, 2013 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Design-mind (Post 6069109)
Does not look as skinny as Park 432 only because it is shorter. I believe that the floor plate size for 107W 57 is a lot smaller. Does anyone know the sq footage for each of these super skinnies?

I believe this one is only 105,000 sf. 432 Park is much larger.

Here's the article from earlier...

http://archpaper.com/news/articles.asp?id=6346


Quote:

The currently empty lot at 107 West 57th Street will soon be home to one of the city’s narrowest tall buildings. Slated for completion in 2014, a mixed-use tower will rise 688 feet in the air from the modest 43-foot-wide by 100-foot-deep site. Developed by JDS Development Group and designed by local architecture firm Cetra Ruddy, the 51-story residential high rise with retail on the first four floors will fit into Midtown’s zoning envelope, its south face stepping and tapering back from the street as it ascends. The firm also designed One Madison Park, the slim tower of stacked cubes on 23rd Street.

“We wanted to create something that would carry its own weight among the Midtown towers, of which there are many,” said John Cetra, a founding partner of Cetra Rudy. In addition to the building’s slender, shard-like character, the architects have given it an active skin treatment that will catch eyes whether up close or from a distance. While the north and south facades will feature floor-to-ceiling transparent glass curtain walls, the lot-line walls, which contain the tower’s reinforced concrete structure, will be clad with dark grey stainless steel panels. The panels are rippled and perforated with a semi-random pattern of holes, which, at night, will reveal a kinetic display of light from thousands of concealed LEDs. “We’re not just exposing a wall of concrete,” continued Cetra. “It’s going to have quite a personality in and of itself. Whatever direction you see it from, it will sparkle with light.”

Containing a total of 105,000 square feet, 107 West 57th Street will have no more than one apartment per floor, including 13 full-floor units, 14 duplexes, and a four-story penthouse.
Two elevators housed in a core of concrete shear walls will provide vertical circulation. A tuned-mass damper in the upper mechanical floors will help to reduce building sway and provide a stable environment for residents.
There will be only 28 "exclusive" units here, assuming they don't add on. But they seem to be gearing up for a groundbreaking.

Design-mind Mar 28, 2013 2:46 PM

Thanks for the extra info NYguy. That is a very small floor plate.

NYguy Mar 28, 2013 10:03 PM

http://therealdeal.com/blog/2013/03/...adjacent-site/

JDS, PMG partnership may bring 900-foot tower to Steinway-adjacent site
Purchase of West 57th Street likely allows developers to expand scope of planned project



March 28, 2013
By Katherine Clarke and Mel Gray

Quote:

A partnership led by Michael Stern’s JDS Development and Property Markets Group is considering increasing the height of its planned hotel and condominium tower on West 57th Street to up to 900 feet, following the acquisition of the adjacent Steinway building, a principal at PMG told The Real Deal. The partnership paid $46 million for a stake in the 247,000-square foot building at 109 West 57th Street belonging to Steinway Musical Instruments, the manufacturer of the classic pianos, in partnership with Atlantic Investors earlier this month. The purchase likely allows the developers to ramp up their plans for an adjacent site they bought last spring with Starwood Capital, Kevin Maloney of PMG told The Real Deal last month.

The JDS/PMG partnership paid $40 million for a stake in 107 West 57th Street, between Sixth and Seventh avenues, and subsequently filed plans for a skinny, 679-foot, 51-story condominium property on the 43-foot-wide lot, to be designed by architecture firm Cetra Ruddy. It was slated to have just 29 condominium units. However, the addition of the Steinway site likely gives the developers the option to build a larger structure comparable to the likes of Extell Development’s 1,000-foot One57 down the block. The Steinway building has close to 45,000 square feet of air rights attached, according to PropertyShark.

Michael Stern of JDS declined to comment on the deal or the plans for the property. Plans for a larger project have not yet been filed with the Department of Buildings, records show. While the specific details of the tower have not yet been decided, Maloney told The Real Deal earlier this month that it will likely have a hotel component with condominium units above. All apartments will have unobstructed Central Park views, he said. Maloney noted that the developers will have to work around limitations linked to the Steinway building’s status as a registered New York landmark. The façade on the first four floors of the building is protected, and the property features a ground-floor, two-story rotunda with a 35-foot domed ceiling. A spokesperson for the Landmarks Preservation Commission was not immediately available for comment. Steinway operates its flagship retail space from the building, a spokesperson for the piano manufacturer said in a statement, and will stay in the space rent free for 14 months after the deal for the building closes in the second quarter. A spokesperson for Steinway said the company would not comment on plans for the tower.

Maria Manuche of the Corcoran Group represented Steinway in the sale of the building. The JDS partnership was not represented by a broker in the deal. In addition, the JDS/PMG partnership took control of the land beneath the building, which was subject to a land lease. It was marketed by Darcy Stacom of CBRE. The specifics of the land deal were not immediately clear.

Steinway had wanted to sell its interest in the site since before the financial crisis, Manuche said, but had been pulled from the market as the crisis took hold. Manuche said she was gearing up to launch a new marketing push for the building when the JDS/PMG partnership expressed interest. Manuche declined to comment on the developers’ plans for the site but said they are currently in “think tank mode.”

Fifty-Seventh Street is has been one of the most active corridors for new residential development in the city, The Real Deal previously reported. In addition to Gary Barnett’s One 57 and another Extell condominium at 225 west 57th Street, new residential towers by the Durst Organization and the World Wide Group are going up at 625 West 57th Street and 250 West 57th Street, respectively.

Fardeb Mar 28, 2013 10:43 PM

A 900-footer in a lot that size would be crazy.

hunser Mar 28, 2013 11:00 PM

I say bring it on! As I said some time ago, there's already a massive competition between the developers to build a tower with the best views. And go get those views you need to build up. Especially in Midtown <700' doesn't suffice anymore. 1000 feet is the new mark!

NYguy Mar 28, 2013 11:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hunser (Post 6070721)
I say bring it on! As I said some time ago, there's already a massive competition between the developers to build a tower with the best views. And go get those views you need to build up. Especially in Midtown <700' doesn't suffice anymore. 1000 feet is the new mark!

They say everything old is new again. At the beginning of the last century, building taller was in. Now, at the beginning of this one, height is being pushed as if the skyscraper is new to the city. For years, there seemed to be an aversion to building higher in New York as people grew weary of skyscrapers. But money speaks louder than words, and if there is more to be made from building higher, the trend won't end. There are people out there with money to burn, and the developers know it.

I really hope this does push to 900 ft or so, it would give a little more balance to the skyline from Central Park, and form a bridge between the taller towers of 432 Park, One57, and the Nordstrom tower.

JayPro Mar 29, 2013 12:02 AM

@NYGuy;
I hope you understand what I'm trying to get at here; but I really don't see why there really *should* (never mind *would*) be any reason to go against verticality.

The idea of "getting tired of it" seems easily trumped by the simple proposition that once room to grow *outward* becomes scarce enough that growth *upward* needs to happen, the thing to do should be glaringly obvious.

Re the recent news with this tower, I for one would like to see the 9 and the 6 in the height figure swapped...or thereabouts. I'm digging also the idea of rippled(?!) perforated N/S facades for LED shows. I just don't understand what they mean by "semi-random".

NYguy Mar 29, 2013 12:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JayPro (Post 6070801)
@NYGuy;
I hope you understand what I'm trying to get at here; but I really don't see why there really *should* (never mind *would*) be any reason to go against verticality.

There shouldn't be.


Quote:

I for one would like to see the 9 and the 6 in the height figure swapped...or thereabouts.
Once they make if official, we'll swap it. For not they are in “think tank mode.” Who knows, they may find a way to stretch it to 1,000 ft.

JayPro Mar 29, 2013 1:10 AM

I'm glad we agree; but I was momentarily non-plussed as to why NY'ers would tire of skyscrapers. The ubiquitousness of the standard form perhaps???
I would think that as the American architectural palate continues to acquire a better taste for designs beyond the box (as it were), citydwellers who take anything over 300' for granted will *really* start noticing.

Busy Bee Mar 29, 2013 2:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Busy Bee (Post 6068751)
Yeah I'd have no problem with integrating Steinway into the base of a much larger tower, say 1200' or so.. ;)

Looks like I was on to something. I'd be willing to bet we won't see something as extreme as a facadectomy, but we will see an absorbing of Steinway into the new tower. That is to say that the tower will rise above Steinway, not just using air rights beside it.


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