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-   -   SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126473)

mello Feb 22, 2008 1:05 AM

Too bad the semi large valley that Ramona sits in is kind of filled with low density "ranches" and acre lot homes. That valley is actually quite large. I know that it is surrounded by some steep hills and a freeway would probably have to be tunneled to the hills on the west side of Ramona.

I would say that maybe back in the 70's or early 80's an airport could have been weasled in there without having to buy out or displace tons of people but obviously now it won't work.

The valley that Warner Springs is in is even bigger but the terrain to the West of it is simply too rugged to get a wide freeway to. It really isn't that far East it just takes a long time to get there because the 76 is so windy.

I think the South Western portion of Camp Pendelton could fit in a LAX sized airport in acreage. But my vote is definitely still for Miramar.

Or fuck that wildlife refuge between Imperial Beach and the Border, who needs nature!! They could get parellel 10,000 foot runways in there for sure:yes:

staplesla Feb 22, 2008 2:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CoastersBolts (Post 3370455)
^^ A San Diego City Councilmember actually replied to you?! I've written letters many, many times (and yes, they've all been courteous, nice, and respectful) and never once have I been written back. Madaffer probably feels he has nothing to lose at this point since his term is up.

I actually received a bunch of responses from various members. All agreed that a different location would be better, but seem frustrated that no one can agree on one.

hi123 Feb 22, 2008 2:11 AM

It looks like Vantage point will look much better then in the renderings! There is much more glass then the on the model!

hi123 Feb 22, 2008 5:12 AM

I recently came across this photo on flickr of the del cornado with many building under construction in the background:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2376/...e7d57ce0_o.jpg

Any info or renderings of these projects? They don't seem to be mentioned of the first post.

bmfarley Feb 22, 2008 5:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hi123 (Post 3371149)
Any info or renderings of these projects? They don't seem to be mentioned of the first post.

^^^ Those appear to be the Navy barracks under construction in Southeast San Diego. I believe each of the 3 towers is 16 to 24 floors.

SDCAL Feb 22, 2008 5:51 AM

airport
 
Normally, I have little sympathy for politicians, but in the case of moving the airport I do. They are not fools, they know that Lindbergh's time will be up in the next couple of decades, but what to do when the public is too stupid to peer into the future and see the disaster looming ahead

When these stories ran in the UT, there were tons of comments like:

"I fly a few times a year and it's never crowded"

or

"Lindbergh is so convinient, I don't want it to move"

The average citizen is not concerned with FAA statistics that Lindbergh will reach capacity in 15-20 years. Most don't even realize Sd is the worlds 2nd busiest single runway airport, or that our 1 runway is too short to accomodate large planes.

They simply know that right now, in their own little worlds, Lindbergh fits.

The politicans MUST do a better job of informing the public as to what the FAA is saying, and what the disadvantages will be if Lindbergh is not moved. We will see back-ups in flights, more expenisve tickets, and longer waits as passenger traffic keeps increasing

And, with the current plans of a band-aid fix that DOESN'T address the runway problems but does address the issues of more gates and transportation improvements at Lindbergh, the public will more than ever be suckered into thinking Lindbergh is fine for a long-term option

They will see all the new improvements and think, WOW, see this airport is great where it's at

Any talk of a new aiprot during the years of construction to improve Lindbergh will be ridiculed by people saying "new airport?????? we are spending millions to improve Lindbergh!!!!

I say the politicans need to step and and say, look San Diego - we are NOT sinking ANY money into Lindbergh. It's a money-pit and will reach capacity in the coming 1-2 decades even WITH the proposed improvements. Call on citizens to accept a new alternative

Politicians also need to realize that wherever the new airport location is, people will be pissed. It's a fact of life, NIMBYs, you have to suck it up and proceed anyway else nothing will get accomplished

It is so frustrating because I think a large international airport would bring more money, tourism, business, cluture and development to our city yet I see the situation literally festering well past 2030 :(

mello Feb 22, 2008 6:13 AM

^^^ Post of the year my friend. I echo your sentiments exactly. I really like the point you made about people ridiculing discussion of a new airport site while the construction is going on at Lindbergh. Oh well, if this metro area doesn't step up then this town will begin hemoraging jobs and really stagnate. What a shame.

You would think this kind of thing would happen in Jacksonville or Memphis not a vibrant West Coast city. But wow it has been happening here for decades.

sandiego_urban Feb 22, 2008 6:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmfarley (Post 3363181)

Quote:

Originally Posted by hi123
It looks like Vantage point will look much better then in the renderings! There is much more glass then the on the model!

I totally agree! It doesn't look as brown (even the glass) as I thought it would be - yet.

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla
Hey guys, Jim Madaffer, city council member, sent me the following email:

"Could you please tell me where you might suggest we build a DFW type airport in San Diego County ? 35 years of studies have failed miserably to identify a site, voters have twice rejected Miramar and I doubt more land is available today than there was back then.

Thanks,

Jim
Jim@SanDiego.gov"

I've replied with what I believe would be a good location.

I'm curious though where you all could envision a new airport.

Wow, I'm also impressed that Madaffer responded back to you.

Unlike Dallas, San Diego has man-made and natural restrictions that prevent the city from spreading out in all directions, not to mention all of the canyons and hills throughout the metro area. I'm curious, where did you suggest to him would be a good place for a new airport?

Quote:

Originally Posted by keg92101
Cody from Portland's firm won't be chosen because they don't plan on doing a 1st class facility. The fact that Hines has chosen Pelli Clarke, and has a long standing history of architectural iconic developments is why they will be selected.

You can see what the two finalists submitted to CCDC here: http://www.ccdc.com/index.cfm/fuseac...ts.civiccenter. Just click on the zip files under "Developer Selection".

Because Hines is using Pelli as the main architect, they get my vote! :tup:

bmfarley Feb 22, 2008 6:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDCAL (Post 3371231)
Normally, I have little sympathy for politicians, but in the case of moving the airport I do. They are not fools, they know that Lindbergh's time will be up in the next couple of decades, but what to do when the public is too stupid to peer into the future and see the disaster looming ahead

When these stories ran in the UT, there were tons of comments like:

"I fly a few times a year and it's never crowded"

or

"Lindbergh is so convinient, I don't want it to move"

The average citizen is not concerned with FAA statistics that Lindbergh will reach capacity in 15-20 years. Most don't even realize Sd is the worlds 2nd busiest single runway airport, or that our 1 runway is too short to accomodate large planes.

They simply know that right now, in their own little worlds, Lindbergh fits.

The politicans MUST do a better job of informing the public as to what the FAA is saying, and what the disadvantages will be if Lindbergh is not moved. We will see back-ups in flights, more expenisve tickets, and longer waits as passenger traffic keeps increasing

And, with the current plans of a band-aid fix that DOESN'T address the runway problems but does address the issues of more gates and transportation improvements at Lindbergh, the public will more than ever be suckered into thinking Lindbergh is fine for a long-term option

They will see all the new improvements and think, WOW, see this airport is great where it's at

Any talk of a new aiprot during the years of construction to improve Lindbergh will be ridiculed by people saying "new airport?????? we are spending millions to improve Lindbergh!!!!

I say the politicans need to step and and say, look San Diego - we are NOT sinking ANY money into Lindbergh. It's a money-pit and will reach capacity in the coming 1-2 decades even WITH the proposed improvements. Call on citizens to accept a new alternative

Politicians also need to realize that wherever the new airport location is, people will be pissed. It's a fact of life, NIMBYs, you have to suck it up and proceed anyway else nothing will get accomplished

It is so frustrating because I think a large international airport would bring more money, tourism, business, cluture and development to our city yet I see the situation literally festering well past 2030 :(

Well, I have the perspective that the public needs proof before getting behind something bold.

Lindbergh is just an example. And here, it must expereince 1) miserable delays, 2) constant head banging reports of lost commercial activity, and maybe 3) local defense department heads complaining about delays and possible relocations.... before the public is compelled to act.

Again, Lindbergh is just an example. There are probably a multitude of other problems that need to be addressed with a real solution... yet the public will not budge until failure of that system actually occurrs.

In my opinion... this region is not pro-active. It's re-active.

Jobohimself Feb 22, 2008 7:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek loves SD (Post 3370324)
All those people off the 56 would have the biggest shit fit you've ever seen.

I would LOVE to see that. Both the shit fits and the new airport. Hell, it's better than more sprawl...:yuck:

dl3000 Feb 22, 2008 7:31 AM

That along with the fact that the most prime airport building land is spoken for by the government and will not give it up for another what is it 10 years per BRAC?

SEsdCALconnect Feb 22, 2008 3:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hi123 (Post 3371149)
I recently came across this photo on flickr of the del cornado with many building under construction in the background:
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2376/...e7d57ce0_o.jpg

Any info or renderings of these projects? They don't seem to be mentioned of the first post.

Nice view of my part of town...those towers make up Pacific Beacon at the 32nd St. Naval Station

http://pacificbeacon.com/

This was mentioned a few pages ago as a matter of fact and they are looking pretty good...next up, new high-rises in National City!

Derek Feb 22, 2008 6:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 3370618)

Or fuck that wildlife refuge between Imperial Beach and the Border, who needs nature!! They could get parellel 10,000 foot runways in there for sure:yes:

:yes:

staplesla Feb 22, 2008 8:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDCAL (Post 3371231)
Normally, I have little sympathy for politicians, but in the case of moving the airport I do. They are not fools, they know that Lindbergh's time will be up in the next couple of decades, but what to do when the public is too stupid to peer into the future and see the disaster looming ahead

When these stories ran in the UT, there were tons of comments like:

"I fly a few times a year and it's never crowded"

or

"Lindbergh is so convinient, I don't want it to move"

The average citizen is not concerned with FAA statistics that Lindbergh will reach capacity in 15-20 years. Most don't even realize Sd is the worlds 2nd busiest single runway airport, or that our 1 runway is too short to accomodate large planes.

They simply know that right now, in their own little worlds, Lindbergh fits.

The politicans MUST do a better job of informing the public as to what the FAA is saying, and what the disadvantages will be if Lindbergh is not moved. We will see back-ups in flights, more expenisve tickets, and longer waits as passenger traffic keeps increasing

And, with the current plans of a band-aid fix that DOESN'T address the runway problems but does address the issues of more gates and transportation improvements at Lindbergh, the public will more than ever be suckered into thinking Lindbergh is fine for a long-term option

They will see all the new improvements and think, WOW, see this airport is great where it's at

Any talk of a new aiprot during the years of construction to improve Lindbergh will be ridiculed by people saying "new airport?????? we are spending millions to improve Lindbergh!!!!

I say the politicans need to step and and say, look San Diego - we are NOT sinking ANY money into Lindbergh. It's a money-pit and will reach capacity in the coming 1-2 decades even WITH the proposed improvements. Call on citizens to accept a new alternative

Politicians also need to realize that wherever the new airport location is, people will be pissed. It's a fact of life, NIMBYs, you have to suck it up and proceed anyway else nothing will get accomplished

It is so frustrating because I think a large international airport would bring more money, tourism, business, cluture and development to our city yet I see the situation literally festering well past 2030 :(


I think it is time that many of us start writing the city council and more importantly the media outlets. Until all the facts are reported by the media the mindset of most in San Diego won't change. I don't think we should spend money (especially considering the SD financial problems) on new terminals that do not resolve the major issues in the longrun.

City Council email addresses - http://www.sandiego.gov/citycouncil
San Diego Tribune - letters@uniontrib.com, jeff.rose@uniontrib.com
News8 - news8@kfmb.com
Fox6 - newstips@fox6.com
News10 - webstaff@10news.com
NBC - http://www.nbcsandiego.com/contactus/index.html

Urban Sky Feb 22, 2008 8:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla (Post 3372304)
I think it is time that many of us start writing the city council and more importantly the media outlets. Until all the facts are reported by the media the mindset of most in San Diego won't change. I don't think we should spend money (especially considering the SD financial problems) on new terminals that do not resolve the major issues in the longrun.

City Council email addresses - http://www.sandiego.gov/citycouncil
San Diego Tribune - letters@uniontrib.com, jeff.rose@uniontrib.com
News8 - news8@kfmb.com
Fox6 - newstips@fox6.com
News10 - webstaff@10news.com
NBC - http://www.nbcsandiego.com/contactus/index.html

Writing to the local government is not going to get anything accomplished. You still have to convince the voting public and then talk the federal government into giving up the land around Miramar. That is the only area that makes any sense.

staplesla Feb 22, 2008 8:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Sky (Post 3372328)
Writing to the local government is not going to get anything accomplished. You still have to convince the voting public and then talk the federal government into giving up the land around Miramar. That is the only area that makes any sense.

That's why I suggested contacting media outlets. Unless people raise a fuss, no one will care or report on anything. If the media outlets were being inundated with emails they'd see there is a story there and hopefully dig deeper.

SDCAL Feb 23, 2008 3:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Urban Sky (Post 3372328)
Writing to the local government is not going to get anything accomplished. You still have to convince the voting public and then talk the federal government into giving up the land around Miramar. That is the only area that makes any sense.

It's better than doing nothing.

Someone on this board got a response back from a city council member who seemed interested in finding a solution, if the politicians get enough mail they could start treating the problem with more urgency

I share your skepticism that it won't accomplish much, but it is worth a try!! I am going to write to them,
thanks straplesa for providing the email addresses!!!!

HurricaneHugo Feb 23, 2008 11:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by staplesla (Post 3372358)
That's why I suggested contacting media outlets. Unless people raise a fuss, no one will care or report on anything. If the media outlets were being inundated with emails they'd see there is a story there and hopefully dig deeper.

yeah the media needs to portray that cat that if san diego doesnt get a new airport soon it will be loosing millions of dollars due to their current one-runway airport

HurricaneHugo Feb 26, 2008 4:16 AM

While studying, I randomly came about a book called

Mid-Coast Corridor
San Diego, California
Locally preferred alternative report

by the San Diego Metropolitan Transit Development Board

It was written in 1995, and it's interesting since it outlines several projects, like a Nobel Drive Coaster Rail Station, a Gilman Coaster Rail Station, the Sorrento Valley Commuter Rail Station, the Mid-Coast LRT alignment, and an HOV Lanes project (stretching from the 5/805 split down to the 8).

I didn't know about the Gilman and Nobel Drive coaster stations or the HOV lanes project.

Any ideas if any of these projects will actually be built?

staplesla Feb 26, 2008 4:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 3378581)
While studying, I randomly came about a book called

Mid-Coast Corridor
San Diego, California
Locally preferred alternative report

by the San Diego Metropolitan Transit Development Board

It was written in 1995, and it's interesting since it outlines several projects, like a Nobel Drive Coaster Rail Station, a Gilman Coaster Rail Station, the Sorrento Valley Commuter Rail Station, the Mid-Coast LRT alignment, and an HOV Lanes project (stretching from the 5/805 split down to the 8).

I didn't know about the Gilman and Nobel Drive coaster stations or the HOV lanes project.

Any ideas if any of these projects will actually be built?

According to the website 2014 is the target date.

http://www.keepsandiegomoving.com/mid-coast.html


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