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-   -   SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126473)

SDfan Mar 10, 2013 11:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HurricaneHugo (Post 6045385)
People say Olympics lose money because the city spends billions on infrastructure and only gets a few billion back.

...but if we fix A LOT of our infrastructure and hold an Olympics...is it not worth losing money?

I don't know. This is San Diego, where a downtown park with seed money takes 35 years to develop and NIMBY's run wild and free.

I would love it if it happened though, even if it was just a bid run.

SDfan Mar 10, 2013 11:07 PM

Old Police Station Development:

Quote:

http://www.utsandiego.com/news/busin...d-development/

GROWTH & DEVELOPMENTPOLICE HQ: FROM MAYHEM TO MARGARITAS
After 26 years in a deep sleep, the former San Diego Police Department headquarters at the downtown waterfront is waking up. Heavy equipment operators, carpenters, painters, utility workers and many others since last summer have been readying the 100,000-square-foot landmark on Pacific Highway for a second life. Located just north of Seaport Village, “The Headquarters at Seaport District” will become a restaurant mecca, complemented by trendy shops, all expected to open by year’s end.

S.DviaPhilly Mar 10, 2013 11:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tyleraf (Post 6045046)
SDviaPhilly, is this the article you're referencing? http://www.hughesmarino.com/articles/downtown-dirt/

I did not read it in an article. I am a Realtor and we have thursday morning downtown meetings and another agent brought it up. she said it was a fact that Bosa bought that building, but a rumor about the tower going up there.

spoonman Mar 11, 2013 1:05 AM

^ Unless he's flipping it, the tower must be a fair assumption (or rumor)

tyleraf Mar 16, 2013 5:17 AM

Wow! Check out Brandon Martella's latest concept for downtown, Fracture.
http://www.brandonmartella.net/p/fracture.html

Bertrice Mar 16, 2013 5:50 PM

"fracture" would totally steal the thunder from the NEVP and ron roberts county waterpark

SDfan Mar 16, 2013 9:08 PM

Wow. That's just. Salivating.

:omg:

wadams92101 Mar 18, 2013 3:28 PM

Are Tall Buildings Bad For Downtown?
 
Interesting article in Planetizen. It looks at the correlation between high rises and strong or weak downtowns: Are Tall Buildings Bad For Downtown? I also posted the link in my blog UrbDeZine. (Personally, I think the desirability of high rises is often over-emphasized)

SDfan Mar 18, 2013 5:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wadams92101 (Post 6056310)
Interesting article in Planetizen. It looks at the correlation between high rises and strong or weak downtowns: Are Tall Buildings Bad For Downtown? I also posted the link in my blog UrbDeZine. (Personally, I think the desirability of high rises is often over-emphasized)

Interesting read, thank you for posting.

I think some of those arguments could be applicable to SD. The most vibrant section of downtown happens to be the gaslamp where there is a 12-story limit. However, it's also a thematic and entertainment district, and is surrounded by high-rise structures on all sides. So much like this article, their are no concrete conclusions to be drawn from either side of the yea or nay high rise debate.

I do believe in SD we have to accept the reality that high-rise construction will be limited to downtown. On the other end, we also must accept that mid-rise density (5-12 story) should and needs to be accepted in many of our urban neighborhoods. These densities, when properly designed to connect back into the street, would benefit their communities in terms of investment, housing and economic opportunities, and growth.

wadams92101 Mar 18, 2013 8:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDfan (Post 6056499)
Interesting read, thank you for posting.

I think some of those arguments could be applicable to SD. The most vibrant section of downtown happens to be the gaslamp where there is a 12-story limit. However, it's also a thematic and entertainment district, and is surrounded by high-rise structures on all sides. So much like this article, their are no concrete conclusions to be drawn from either side of the yea or nay high rise debate.

Agree. I think there are many factors that go into evaluating what height is appropriate or helpful to urbanization for a particular area. I also believe that many communities are better served by incremental increases in density and small lot development, rather block clearing projects or completely out of scale projects: the Park Station proposal for La Mesa comes to mind.

Leo the Dog Mar 19, 2013 1:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by wadams92101 (Post 6056850)
Agree. I think there are many factors that go into evaluating what height is appropriate or helpful to urbanization for a particular area. I also believe that many communities are better served by incremental increases in density and small lot development, rather block clearing projects or completely out of scale projects: the Park Station proposal for La Mesa comes to mind.

Park Station La Mesa looks great. For a suburban location it sure adds nice density AND open space and would utilize the trolley. It would replace open lots and a used car lot(?) and add more permanent pedestrians in the Village area.

mello Mar 19, 2013 6:52 PM

I just looked at Park Station La Mesa and that looks great! Get that going now.

Was walking around downtown on Saturday and that area were the fountain was next to Tin Fish and Hard Rock Hotel looks TERRIBLE! That is such a dead space and just ruins the aesthetic of that whole section of downtown. What is the deal with that? Any solution? Why doesn't Hard Rock pay to make it look better....

Oh and also walked up the steps of Convention center and boy is it showing signs of age, the steps look terrible and the Center has fading clading with rust marks and water spots. It really does need to be fixed up a bit. Looks like the construction materials were not top notch.

Derek Mar 19, 2013 6:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 6058203)
I just looked at Park Station La Mesa and that looks great! Get that going now.

Was walking around downtown on Saturday and that area were the fountain was next to Tin Fish and Hard Rock Hotel looks TERRIBLE! That is such a dead space and just ruins the aesthetic of that whole section of downtown. What is the deal with that? Any solution? Why doesn't Hard Rock pay to make it look better....

Oh and also walked up the steps of Convention center and boy is it showing signs of age, the steps look terrible and the Center has fading clading with rust marks and water spots. It really does need to be fixed up a bit. Looks like the construction materials were not top notch.



Portland has a similar area comparable to the fountain by Tin Fish, except ours is a tiny little parking lot crammed into the same amount of space. I'd rather have a "dead" fountain than a tiny parking lot crammed into a corner lot in the middle of downtown. :(

SDfan Mar 20, 2013 5:01 PM

While I wouldn't be opposed to Park Station in my neighborhood, I can see how people in La Mesa may question why an 18 story high-rise is being put up in an area not accustomed to that kind of development. Granted, I think that area could handle that type of development, it's a place with accessible trolley and bus routes and a good street grid layout. I think if it's done well it could potentially be a role model for more dense development in similar places in the county.

mello Mar 20, 2013 9:16 PM

[QUOTE=SDfan;6059633]While I wouldn't be opposed to Park Station in my neighborhood, I can see how people in La Mesa may question why an 18 story/QUOTE]

In reality though 18 stories is nothing look at the TOD's in Toronto and Vancouver (Coastal Elitist City with views just like SD) go up to 40 floors in there "Vertical Villages" or what ever they call them I forget the proper term.

The fact is people who live outside of DTSD will HAVE TO just get used to tall structures being in their, the future has arrived. It is 2013 for christ sakes time for some CHANGE. Why does everyone think things will always just stay the same? Verticality is not your enemy as long as the structure is designed well and not big chunky stucco towers like in UTC but nice glassy stuff like Vancouver and downtown.

(Oh and I will add, vertical development obviously has not affected property values in Vancouver, it is a very expensive city especially for one without a lot of high paying jobs - just like good ole SD and its sunshine tax - )

SDfan Mar 21, 2013 1:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mello (Post 6060075)
In reality though 18 stories is nothing look at the TOD's in Toronto and Vancouver (Coastal Elitist City with views just like SD) go up to 40 floors in there "Vertical Villages" or what ever they call them I forget the proper term.

The fact is people who live outside of DTSD will HAVE TO just get used to tall structures being in their, the future has arrived. It is 2013 for christ sakes time for some CHANGE. Why does everyone think things will always just stay the same? Verticality is not your enemy as long as the structure is designed well and not big chunky stucco towers like in UTC but nice glassy stuff like Vancouver and downtown.

I think we need to be a little more sympathetic to places where these kinds of developments have not been introduced, well, ever.

I mean 18 stories is nothing in Toronto and Vancouver because high-rise structures have been in those regions for decades. La Mesa has what? 5, 6 story precedent? I mean you're comparing two very different situations.

Now say this was Mission Valley, or UTC, or even National City or western Chula Vista where there could be reasonable high-rise development (30-40 stories), then I would think that those communities would need to be given some education as to why they need to absorb more of these types of projects.

Again, I wouldn't disapprove of Park Station, I think it would be lovely if it was in downtown Oside, or in a number of areas uptown. In La Mesa, however, I would take it more slowly. Maybe introduce that community to 10-12 story structures first rather then propose something three times the height of every other structure in their community?

The future is coming, but we need to be more mindful (and respectful) of our neighbors sense of community and place. Otherwise, the next time something similar is proposed, they may fight tooth and nail and turn radically against all new urban ideas and concepts (think 1970's coastal height limit type actions).

Leo the Dog Mar 22, 2013 4:51 AM

Since we're talking about East County, I always thought that El Cajon has so much potential. It's a moderate sized city, confined in a valley, served by the trolley. I think they should create a street-car line through their DT that connects to the trolley. Their core could easily develop and densify and I'm sure the city would welcome large projects to revitalize the area.

I'd like to see other neighborhoods of SD utilize the trolley as the backbone and have streetcar spurs come off of it.

What do you guys think?

Derek Mar 23, 2013 7:57 AM

Just come across this article. Thoughts?




Filner backs convention-stadium

Quote:

Mayor Bob Filner backed a Chargers stadium-convention center expansion combination Friday as good for the city and a possible money saver.

“I say we’re not going to put public money into a private effort,” he said. “But that leaves some kind of room to talk to them, and we will be talking.”

Filner, who outlined his thoughts at a San Diego Foundation forum on neighborhood revitalization, said the stadium idea opens up the possibility of generating new revenue to replace money no longer available from redevelopment agencies.

The mayor said he is interested in a dual-use facility because it could potentially save 25 percent off a combined $1.6 billion price tag for convention expansion and a downtown football stadium.

Continued: http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2013/...-sports-arena/

SDfan Mar 23, 2013 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo the Dog (Post 6062182)
Since we're talking about East County, I always thought that El Cajon has so much potential. It's a moderate sized city, confined in a valley, served by the trolley. I think they should create a street-car line through their DT that connects to the trolley. Their core could easily develop and densify and I'm sure the city would welcome large projects to revitalize the area.

I'd like to see other neighborhoods of SD utilize the trolley as the backbone and have streetcar spurs come off of it.

What do you guys think?

I agree their is potential, but it's East County - and they're known more for their Southern style living than urbanism. Aside from La Mesa, both Santee and El Cajon are conservative when it comes to development - and most things in general. Although their is a plan in the 2050 regional transportation map for a possible streetcar in downtown El Cajon.

SDfan Mar 23, 2013 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Derek (Post 6063634)
Just come across this article. Thoughts?




Filner backs convention-stadium




Continued: http://www.utsandiego.com/news/2013/...-sports-arena/

Eh. I'll believe is when I see it. And we probably won't see this for at least another 10-20 years.


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