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ACT7 Jan 16, 2012 3:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jmt18325 (Post 5551596)
I don't think that you have enough exposure to American conservative media if you think that almost all Americans embrace NY.

In general, I would say that is true, just anecdotally and pure obsevation having travelled around the U.S. But, true, American conservative media may not think that way...nor should they be the measuring stick of how Americans think.

ACT7 Jan 17, 2012 9:59 PM

Posted in the YYC airport discussion too...

November results are in for YYC, and although overall pax numbers for the month are down, international is way up compared to last November. Still down for the year but it makes me wonder what went on this Nov. to have such a jump. It's not like there was a significant increase in flights or capacity. Almost makes me wonder if it's a typo that will be adjusted.

http://www.yyc.com/data//1/rec_docs/33_BR_PaxTotal.pdf

CanadianCentaur Jan 17, 2012 11:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACT7 (Post 5551008)
Too bad the growth isn't there...22 gates is overkill imo.

If major growth in air traffic returns like it did before 2008, you'll be glad they built that many gates in YYC beforehand! Major world economic crises don't last forever, you know.

ACT7 Jan 18, 2012 2:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianCentaur (Post 5553750)
If major growth in air traffic returns like it did before 2008, you'll be glad they built that many gates in YYC beforehand! Major world economic crises don't last forever, you know.

Well considering Pier F at T1 at Pearson has 23 gates and YYZ handles almost 10 times the international traffic that YYC does, imo it's overkill...even though, yes, world crises don't last forever. I'm not saying that an expansion is necessarily a bad idea but this was obviously in the works when growth was double digit. That may happen again in a decade but only for a couple of years again.

rbt Jan 18, 2012 4:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ACT7 (Post 5553878)
Well considering Pier F at T1 at Pearson has 23 gates and YYZ handles almost 10 times the international traffic that YYC does, imo it's overkill...even though, yes, world crises don't last forever.

Most of Pier F handles very large aircraft. The number gates (number of aircraft) is more related to destination count rather than passenger count.

Those Emerites A480 flights with 800 passengers at YYZ are equivalent to 5 or 6 gates at YCC for 737s and A320s going to sun destinations for the same 800 passengers.

Andrewjm3D Jan 18, 2012 4:50 AM

A380 not A480 :)

eemy Jan 18, 2012 1:07 PM

You also have to remember that a lot of International flight are out of T3 including pretty much all non-Star Alliance airlines (with some exceptions) and vacation charters.

ACT7 Jan 18, 2012 3:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rbt (Post 5554078)
Most of Pier F handles very large aircraft. The number gates (number of aircraft) is more related to destination count rather than passenger count.

Those Emerites A480 flights with 800 passengers at YYZ are equivalent to 5 or 6 gates at YCC for 737s and A320s going to sun destinations for the same 800 passengers.

Yes, but even still, destination count, number of aircraft and movements are all substantially higher out of T1 alone than YYC. I don't think anyone would disagree that 22 additional international gates at an airport that handles 1.3 MM international pax (or even 3.7 MM if you include transborder) is overkill. But, hey, maybe the Calgary Airport Authority knows something we don't :)

Andrewjm3D Jan 18, 2012 5:46 PM

If you can build it why not? Better to be ready for the future then to scramble when the time comes. I think it's a smart move by YCC.

YYCguys Jan 19, 2012 4:23 PM

YCC=Cornwall, Ontario, YYC=Calgary, Alberta :)

MolsonExport Jan 19, 2012 5:17 PM

I can see all those A380s circling the air awaiting clearance to land in the teaming metropolis of Cornwall.

davidivivid Jan 19, 2012 6:31 PM

The Quebec City airport's $225M expansion has recently begun. A first $70M expansion occurred in 2007 but the number of passengers increased so quickly that the airport already functions at almost full capacity.

The bulk of the money will be funnelled towards the expansion of the international terminal (it will be 4 times larger), which will basically double the size of the airport. However, the construction of this terminal will occur only in 2014. This year, a multi-level parking lot will be built, followed by the construction of a new hotel in 2013. Obviously, through all of this, the service facilities for passengers and airline companies will also be improved.

Detailed renderings of the new terminal haven't surfaced yet so the only picture I could find is the following one. From what I can see, the new international terminal will look like a bigger version of the beautiful terminal added in 2007:

http://storage.canoe.ca/v1/dynamic_r...7&t=1325850717
http://argent.canoe.ca/lca/affaires/...06-064859.html

Here's what the airport looks at the moment. The new terminal would be on the left end side in the following picture and would most likely look like a bigger version of the terminal on the right end side.

http://www.praa.qc.ca/includes/templ...esage_0441.jpg
http://www.praa.qc.ca/fr/projets/tra...an-lesage.html

http://www.praa.qc.ca/includes/templ...esage_0427.jpg
http://www.praa.qc.ca/fr/projets/tra...an-lesage.html

http://images.lpcdn.ca/924x615/20111...e-aeroport.jpg
http://www.cyberpresse.ca/le-soleil/...-laeroport.php

MTLskyline Jan 20, 2012 3:28 AM

Quebec City has to have one of Canada's nicest airports.

isaidso Jan 20, 2012 9:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by taal (Post 5551037)
I live in Toronto, and everyone I know shares a similar sentiment with me regarding YYZ.

I argued that the culture of Toronto is reflected in the buildings it constructs. It's no shock that most Torontonians consider the amenities at Pearson to be sufficient. You've basically made my case for me. ;)

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrewjm3D (Post 5551060)
Well most of that has to do with the fact that we as Torontonians know we have to scream and beg for any reinvestment from the feds to get anything done around here. We either pay for it ourselves like the TTC or take what we can get from the federal level. The rest of Canada hates to see any tax money being spent in Toronto even though the GTA represents over 1/5th of all the tax generated in this country.

If we started demanding more money and better quality the rest of the country would scream bloody murder. It's been that way for the past 30 years and will continue that way until mentalities in this country change. The fact is the rest of the country loves to hate us but loves our money, and any federal government that is seen as Toronto friendly might as well not run in the next election.

With that said, I think we've seen the construction of a very impressive structure with seamless additions making it the most modern airport in the country. It really wouldn't take much to turn it into a more friendly airport to spend a few hours waiting in.

There's certainly a huge disjoint between the needs of Canadian municipalities and the tax generating ability of municipalities, but that's something all cities in Canada have to contend with.

Pearson's bones are very good so I'm hopeful that it will evolve over time like you said. That said, it still startles me sometimes how bare bones some Toronto buildings are. Pearson and Toronto Life (at Dundas Square) are the most noticeable examples. Pearson will be great some day, that other building is almost unsalvageable.

Andrewjm3D Jan 20, 2012 9:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by isaidso (Post 5557785)
I argued that the culture of Toronto is reflected in the buildings it constructs. It's no shock that most Torontonians consider the amenities at Pearson to be sufficient. You've basically made my case for me. ;)


You're right but there is a reason for that. We don't see the investments from the federal level on an equal footing with other cities. If we got to keep even 10% more of what is taken out of the GTA in taxes we'd have much better public spaces and amenities. If we want something done right we have to fight for years and years, and then when we get it expect it to take just as long to come into place. Union Station is a prime example. When Toronto does getting any sort of federal investments the rest of the country moans. We could just as easily argue that it's not the culture of Torontonians that are reflected in our bare bones public spaces, it's what the rest of Canada wants for us. Still to this day I don't understand the love of loathing this city from the rest of the country. We love you guys.

People do want nice things here as can be found in privately funded buildings.

WhipperSnapper Jan 20, 2012 9:51 PM

I don't know a single soul who travels through Person that finds the amenities adequate. I'm glad that at least urbanized Toronto is largely bucking the trend for cheap inspired historicism. If the lack of a tacky crown unnecessary twists, turns, and curves and supertall status is conservative than so be it.

Andrewjm3D Jan 20, 2012 9:56 PM

I will say this about Pearson, flying into it is one of the better airport experiences to be had. Fast efficient, good signage, and always more then enough custom agents on hand to process everybody fast and get them on their way. They seem to have getting passengers and their baggage out the door down to a fine art now.

ACT7 Jan 21, 2012 4:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrewjm3D (Post 5557866)
I will say this about Pearson, flying into it is one of the better airport experiences to be had. Fast efficient, good signage, and always more then enough custom agents on hand to process everybody fast and get them on their way. They seem to have getting passengers and their baggage out the door down to a fine art now.

That part is true - I generally fly through customs (well at T1 anyway; T3 is a bit slower since it's a bit smaller). While Pearson is certainly utilitarian and efficient, it lacks all the major retail that main hubs around the world have, and even airports a fraction of its size have. It has bush league retail at best and seems no one did any market research whatsoever with respect to who travels through the airport. Here's hoping that the rebranding will lead to MAJOR retail improvements!

isaidso Jan 21, 2012 9:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Andrewjm3D (Post 5557812)
You're right but there is a reason for that. We don't see the investments from the federal level on an equal footing with other cities.

But we see it in privately funded buildings as well. When a developer proposes something extravagant, locals complain that it's too showy, a 'look at me building', or just stroking someone's delicate ego. Why can't we once in a while build a showpiece for the sake of wanting something 'top shelf' and gorgeous? A large proportion of Toronto is completely uncomfortable with any outward displays of luxury or opulence. I've always found this reaction plain bizarre.

LeftCoaster Jan 26, 2012 4:16 PM

Very cool video posted by Officedweller in the Vancouver local showing terminal expansion at YVR over the years. INcredible the amount of change that has happened.

Quote:

Originally Posted by officedweller (Post 5564082)



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