British architecture and urban design in Canada
 

Does your city have any notable buildings or building styles that could have been transplanted from the UK? These could be historical buildings, or more recent ones; they could be modest or grandiose.

When I think of British-style buildings over more American forms, I tend to think of things like:

- Georgian classical architecture made out of stone (Americans have less of this; and they seem to have torn down more of it during the late 1800s)
- Neo-Romanesque architecture of the Edwardian/late-Victorian era
- Streamline moderne moreso than Art Deco
- Euro-inspired housing projects of the late 1960s-1970s (e.g. False Creek south in Vancouver doesn't look like any affordable housing built in the US)

And little stuff. Houses like these on the right don't really look American, are much smaller than what was built in the US at the time, and they're actually built with things like brick structural walls (on the exterior) rather than wood framing.

But I'm not an expert on this, and I'd love to get more information from people who may know more about these things.

Anyway, compared to other former British Empire countries like Australia or South Africa, we probably have a lot less, but I think we have noticeably more of these building styles than comparable American cities.

Here's one I like in Halifax, completed 1818 (bonus points for statue of rifleman in pith helmet to the right celebrating the Boer War; I wonder how many years that one has left?). Most of the buildings there built prior to 1870 or so were heavily influenced by British styles and many of the builders were Scottish masons. Not much was built from about 1870-1930 but around the 1890's you see Chicago style buildings, etc. I have also noticed that as late as the 1970's or so there was a lot of British influence in city planning and public housing projects.

https://i.imgur.com/Cjv6J8b.jpg
(from streetview)

Wasn't most of of Old Montreal built by wealthy Scottish and English merchants influencing most of the style of the area? I remember hearing that on a tour years ago.

Obviously Upper and Lower Canada's architecture was influenced by where the builders/architects originated. Much of Montreal post 1780s was built by the Scots and is modeled after Glasgow. Toronto's style is small town Scots-Irish/Ulster with Old Toronto/York more Empire Loyalist English/American. The English and Scottish gentry frequently did business in London bringing with them the latest design trends. Rural immigrants brought with them designs for simple farm houses; eventually evolving into Ontario Gothic built on plans printed in the 1865 Canadian Farmer. My great grandfather built his own home inspired by his family's large estate home in rural Ireland.

I'd say we actually have quite a lot of British style architecture, in the East, and much more than in Australia. I've lived in Melbourne and Sydney and just like here, the older architecture is very British, and then it diverges. Sydney's architecture looks more like LA and Melbourne is more like Toronto.

I always found Front Street, looking toward the Dominion Public Building, reminds me of Oxford Street in London. And the high streets of Toronto are very reminiscent of the UK. From Queen to Eglinton, aside from the straightness (and careless public features like the obnoxious overhead yellow traffic lights and sidewalks), the feel is very English.

Central Ottawa's older buildings have a regal, London feel. where I found Canada feels really different than the England - but not Scotland, is how all our buildings are designed around winter. Save for BC, you don't get the indoor/outdoor spaces like Europe or even Australia. Here, you generally know for sure whether you're indoor or outdoor, there some newer retail buildings are more of a weather shell to keep the rain out.

Also, Lower Water Street in Halifax, beside Queen's Marque, jumps out to me as Belfast-like.

https://goo.gl/maps/snzqZ9M47iVwGAHw7 are you talking about this sort of street ?

or it's more favourite version

https://goo.gl/maps/t2fN8wio6TajysK69

This is a very common UK form of housing built in the 20's/30's
https://goo.gl/maps/VXr6KzeLPGDqWpev5

https://goo.gl/maps/86v1XQMCVZZSBStm7 I think these are from the 1890's. Up until the 80's I think they had a front garden.

Scottish builders are somewhat underappreciated in Canadian history, particularly as far as Quebec goes with many people thinking those are mostly old French colonial buildings (maybe people actually living in Quebec don't think this and it's an outsider misconception). Then later on there are architects like John M. Lyle who was born in Ireland and created a different style of building from what was common in the US at the time.

However it's still interesting to me how if you pick an old Montreal building from 1840 and pick one from Halifax from 1840 they still look completely distinct for the most part. Maybe you could find some very plain stone boxes that look similar. There is little overlap between historic Atlantic and St. Lawrence/Great Lakes masonry styles, even though many of the builders would have been recent immigrants from different parts of the UK. One aspect of this that might be a bit unfair comparison-wise is that the Central Canada buildings tend to be limestone while Atlantic is a mix of sandstone, granite, and ironstone (pyritic slate, which is less desirable as a building material than limestone/sandstone but the only easy-to-cut stone in some areas).

When the Scots came to Quebec, Montreal was a tiny village.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scots-Quebecer

Canada was built by the Scots and British Army. Winnipeg's grandiose architecture and layout was very Scottish.

From what I can observe, this kind of single family home style is very common in parts of interwar Toronto with a few regional differences. For example, the roof will be asphalt shingle rather than tile, and the window casements will be North American.

Those bungalows on the other side of your link are a dime-a-dozen in Toronto, with the same regional variances.

The BC Legislature could be in Liverpool, Calcutta or Melbourne, but it couldn't be in Seattle:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped..._Buildings.jpg

The architect had an interesting life: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Francis_Rattenbury

Their houses’ windows always seem to go right up to the level of the eaves.

I'll add to what others have said about Canada's British architectural legacy vs. Australia and South Africa (and to some degree the U.S.)

Canada IMO certainly doesn't have less British style than Australia or South Africa, minus road infrastructure and signage. We tend to be much closer to the UK (if not identical) in terms of climate and landscape and as a result available building materials also reflect that too.

I also find that there are some obviously English cues in New England that one sees, and that as others say in Canada things British actually often lean more Scottish than English.

Where did Montreal's "Walk'Ups" get inspired from? Most of them don't look much older then early 20th century. I never understood the appeal of them and they are very unique to Montreal and Quebec as a whole. I can't find any examples in France or the U.K.

It's almost as if they're really a homegrown genre. At least part of the style is apparently related to unique tax assessment rules or local regulations of some kind.

Why do you assume that they get their inspiration from somewhere else ? They are unique to Montreal. Most of them were build between 1890 and 1920.

You never understood their appeal? You don't see how urban and dense they make Montreal? While providing large appartements for families? The exterior stairs have become iconic to the city. They provide mode space inside while allowing front yard with trees and gardens. They make great street wall with a variety of bricks or grey stones and some architecture flourishes on the roof, windows, balconies, etc. What is it you don't understand ???

Why they were appealing at the time they were built, not now, was how I understood the question.

First of all I never "assumed" I asked a question. And for structures built between 1890-and 1920 most look like they were designed in the 1950's.
Urban and dense they are but I find them to be soulless structures The streetwalls they create look sterile and depressing. The lack of a break between them doesn't help. What don't you understand about not everybody not liking the same thing?????????

I do appreciate the genius of them having no internal staircases making for better layouts, and I do like that they are a quirky relic of Montreal's past urban planning but the esthetics of the vast majority of them don't do it for me. Is that ok by you? Am I allowed to have an opinion???????



You can feel free to post as many pictures you want right now but to me they have all of the charm of Toronto's post-war bungalows which I detest.

lol

They most definitely add a lot to the unique character of the city.

Even some of the criticisms are part of the mystique. Upon seeing them, an Aussie friend who was visiting asked: "who the fuck thought it was a good idea to stick outdoor staircases on houses in this climate?" and then burst out laughing.

While I appreciate everyone's opinions, I have to agree with your reaction.

The plexes' urbanscape effect is the complete opposite of soulless and depressing. These plexes are the main reason why Montreal's central boroughs have Canada's best urban experience when it comes to walkability, charm and aesthetics.

But whatever, not for everyone I guess.

They're also an example of what I would call "noble proletarian" architecture.

Canada's doesn't have much of that at all, definitely not outside of Quebec and to some degree Halifax and St. John's.

True. And they most definitely don't have a 1950's aesthetic, that's just the most absurd thing I read on this forum in long while. I've been inside hundreds of plexes in my life, visiting friends or just living in them, and they are spacious, very elaborate with decorative fireplace, columns, moldings, chandelier, woodwork, stained glass, etc. Many were designed for working class, but with a though for some refinement that you wouldn't expect, and many were designed to be more luxurious and they are (in Outremont, for exemple, there are hundreds of plexes that are as luxurious as Manhattan's brownstones).

Also, it's ridiculous to say that they are passé. I mean we are still building them!

To my eye as well, they definitely evoke the era when they were built.

In terms of "appeal", a word someone else used, well that's matter of opinion but they definitely made perfect sense as a type of housing. And still do to some degree.

Here's another "could have been built in the UK" building. A house in Port Hood, NS, along the west coast of Cape Breton:

https://odis.homeaway.com/odis/listi...16d182.f10.jpg
Source

I love Montreal's duplex/triplex walkups! They were obviously inspired by the Scottish tradition of living in tenements while outdoor staircases were common in the Scottish Borders 600 years ago! The Scots and English lived in the more ornate/luxurious flats in Mtl, while poor rural Francophones moved into cheaper modest apartments. Many Scottish businessmen owned the factories where the cast iron or pressed tin details, the brick or stone were manufactured. The Irish and French Canadians moved to Montreal for factory jobs/domestic help/service work and needed affordable housing. With increased densities came increased building setbacks resulting in maximizing layouts/profits: outdoor staircases don't need to be heated!

Spend a few months in Montreal and walk the streets. You can get a sense of where the Scots lived - sadly many of their mansions were torn down for the expressway.:(

Hum, I don't know of any expressway build in Montreal that implied the demolition of historic mansions. The Scottish entrepreneurs of Montreal build their mansions in the Golden Square Mile, where of course there is no expressway. According to Heritage Montreal, about 30 to 40% of those mansions were demolished to build high-rises, but the rest remain.

On a side note, it is interesting to note that there are tens of thousands of plexes in Montreal and very few were demolished over the years. That in itself is quite remarkable.

Not sure about this particular example, but sometimes the general form looks "European" to us but the details are all wrong. I was once in Pictou with an academic group that included a professor from a Scottish university and while she could see the influence, the stone was just not the type or colour she was used to and it didn't really resonate as "like home" as much as I'd anticipated.

Actually they make a lot of sense in our climate. It's that much space that you don't have to heat in the winter and that you don't have to clean everyday with melting dirty snow. When you have to clean the interior stairs from the second to the third floor, you get the appeal of having the first set of stairs outside.

This will always be in the eye of the beholder and builders had to work with what was available so it will always be possible to pick out differences. The stone would have been sourced regionally.

I guess one question to ask is whether they were aiming to build Scottish-style buildings at the time with what they had at their disposal, or something else. For the typical NS stonemason around the 1820-1870 period, the British styles and Scottish in particular seem to have been a dominant point of reference.

Yes, in that sense a city like Toronto is more "English" and a city like Montreal is more "Scottish".

I think the most solid residential architecture in the British Isles is in Scotland.

Even though London is a much bigger, more metropolitan city - and always was - its terraced housing feels like matchstick architecture compared to a rock solid Glasgow tenement building. And those tenements looked the same whether you were in the richer west end or the poorer east end. I have a friend who moved to Glasgow and lives in one of these tenements, and I admire his 10 ft ceilings, marble fireplace and enormous bay windows.

My Toronto semi probably costs 2-3X as much but it's seemingly made out of cardboard with a 6 ft-high basement. Basically anybody with any money who buys one of these homes immediately hires a structural engineer to gut the entire inside and remove the structural walls, since the interior of a pre-war Toronto home is not conducive to the needs of a modern family. In that sense, I kind of feel a connection with people in London who complain about their cramped, drafty homes.

Glasgow's architecture is great. One thing I wonder is if those crumbling stone tenement buildings were higher end or lower end housing around the time when they were built (there's also higher-end housing that clearly looks like it was built for the wealthy).

My impression is that Glasgow used to be a relatively wealthier city in the 19th century ("second city of the empire" days) compared to what it is today, with a higher proportion of the inner city areas being inhabited by wealthier people. These comparisons are always a bit challenging of course because people as a whole are better off today. But there are some clear-cut examples in some places where a home that might have been inhabited by a factory owner or ship's captain in the 19th century is used as working class apartments.

True, I'm sure. They were aiming at building buildings, not buildings in a style, so they would have built them the same as they'd always built them, unless the materials weren't available. My great great grandfather was a stonemason just across the way in PEI in the mid-1800s and I'm sure whatever he built was done in the way he'd learned from his father from the Isle of Skye.

Question. Are these British style? I loved the first one when I was in QC three years ago. Didn't know about the other one but just as cool.


https://image.shutterstock.com/image...-729317656.jpg
https://www.shutterstock.com/image-p...roof-729317656

https://s3-media0.fl.yelpcdn.com/bph...kvBJab-A/o.jpg
https://fr.yelp.ca/biz/aux-anciens-c...ns-qu%C3%A9bec

Not an expert but they strike me as "New France" style.

The houses in the second photo especially are IMO typical of the housing style with sloped roofs that the early French colonists developed in order that they not collapse under the weight of the snow.

Saint John

Most of the buildings in Saint John are Italianate or Second Empire (French) style, but there's a couple of British designs still around

Chipman Hill (mid-19th Century, interior Victorian)
https://www.historicplaces.ca/en/rep...?id=9377&pid=0
https://chipmanhill.com/wp-content/u...42-768x432.jpg
https://www.historicplaces.ca/hpimag...6056_Large.jpg

Holman Residence (Queen Anne Revival)
https://www.historicplaces.ca/en/rep...id=10833&pid=0
https://www.historicplaces.ca/hpimag...5314_Large.jpg

Although not technically British, the New England Federalist style of the Loyalist House is always nice:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Saint_John.JPG

One of my favourites is the Lunenburg Academy in Lunenburg, NS:
https://www.historicplaces.ca/en/rep...?id=1517&pid=0
https://www.historicplaces.ca/hpimag...6943_Large.jpg

The Algonquin in St. Andrews, NB is Tudor Revival:
https://www.historicplaces.ca/en/rep...id=17161&pid=0
https://www.historicplaces.ca/hpimag...7410_Large.jpg

I find the colonial French architecture in Quebec to be reminiscent of Brittany, where many of the French settlers originated.
Somewhere like Saint-Malo looks a lot like Quebec City in some spots
https://goo.gl/maps/Q2HtqxUHbb9qegr98

The British architecture in Quebec definitely has a bit of a Scottish slant (many of the anglophone business class were Scots), somewhere like the Golden Square Mile would have had a lot of great examples, but unfortunately much of it was lost in the 1960s and 70s. Montreal's current downtown is really largely on the site of the Golden Square Mile, which is why a lot of it is now gone (Old Montreal was the downtown until the post-war period). Most of what remains is near Sherbrooke or slightly above it.

https://goo.gl/maps/CxCRTiv7RXXEyLXQ8

Westmount's architecture also looks British in spots, and is generally better preserved than the Golden Square Mile. But it is newer (a lot is from 1920s-40s rather than Victorian). Something like the City Hall/Library/Selwyn House complexes look like something taken from a city in England.
https://goo.gl/maps/v4HEXwvS2k7eViek7

This style of fairly ubiquitous 2-storey brick box post-war housing has always vaguely reminded me of British suburbs of the same era:

https://goo.gl/maps/uYVKwhWuYwdxMiSSA


And in the multi-family department, stuff like these:

https://goo.gl/maps/ee7QAv5LwUKrsBkx9
https://goo.gl/maps/io4PjwPGJJYPuatB7


Of course, for a more literal comparison you've always got the late-19th century terraces like these:

https://goo.gl/maps/neHLDhg5uQg6kzhb9

Oskenonton Lane might be the ugliest residential street in Canada.

Vancouver has a lot of English Storybook houses, probably not found so much elsewhere in Canada.
Unfortunately they are being systematically erased from the landscape and replaced with modern monstrosities.

https://www.vancouverheritagefoundat...les/storybook/

https://www.vancouverheritagefoundat...jameshouse.jpg

They could film Top Boy (Canada) there.

Montreal's outdoor staircases were simply a matter of cost vs. living space. Stairs take up considerable space (more so when they span multiple floors) and in tenement-era Montreal, it was deemed that the space that would otherwise be taken up by stairs could be used for living. This design characteristic became the norm.

Of course, with the climate, it seems shortsighted. Not as bad, perhaps, as the outhouses that were common in the decades prior to the outdoor staircase triplexes.

These could also pass:

https://goo.gl/maps/Tu3nPyJd9PApfFgi7
https://goo.gl/maps/fCD4R7cHz9VSnNYv7
https://goo.gl/maps/8QWtbc9BktqF5gnP7


A bit more of an English country influence to these co-ops:

https://goo.gl/maps/drKJBrw2keXXCyXz9
https://goo.gl/maps/xzJKyPzAWTLy7zed7

London's semi-detached rows are immediately different than Toronto's after more than a cursory glance, but I do feel like ours were inspired by the style. Thinking of stuff like this (fairly random streetviews, I don't know London well enough):

https://goo.gl/maps/uYsCL1rXK1bnHtuN8
https://goo.gl/maps/VzyQBKD4vqufkT4QA
https://goo.gl/maps/ZkFZNopEadUdiPzH9
https://goo.gl/maps/SGBGEB65rsGiS3ng9

Toronto's tend to have steeper gables (bay and gable style), I assume for snow concerns and in general have less uniformity. The latter is simply because Toronto had less speculative built housing than most cities at the time so it's rare to have a full block of repeating styles. London houses also seem to remain more true to the original style - fewer additions and questionable siding choices - not sure if this is by policy design or personal choice.

This was alluded to earlier in the thread but I wouldn't be surprised if we actually have proportionately more UK influenced architecture than places like Australia and South Africa. They have the big colonial buildings and high streets, but residential buildings are quite different - they tend to single storey, airy construction styles which I can only assume is due to climate. Looking at streetviews of Sydney they seem to have a surprising amount of modern infill in post-1900 neighbourhoods which does give a bit of an LA vibe. Melbourne's rows seem distinct to me and quite different than what you find in the UK. Cape Town favoured Cape Dutch architecture in wealthier areas well into British rule, and while Johannesburg did have a large stock of Victorian/Edwardian architecture modeled after London of the day it was almost all demolished in the 20s-50s when they went Deco.

When I think of the classic Australian/South African pre-war colonial style house, variations of this are what comes to mind:

https://goo.gl/maps/einVNZrY2HP1nnSw7
https://goo.gl/maps/bUq6nVmksMLG2Mpm8
https://goo.gl/maps/vhpeAiyZSj89D8jdA

Lots of Tudor Revival in the Kingsway:

https://goo.gl/maps/ESN8QDbnNroqHh3S8
https://goo.gl/maps/za67BAgFLr6ZUnTP6


Small apartment complex on the other side of town:

https://goo.gl/maps/rqgPfGJ7HB2DXLDCA

Here's a particularly striking example from London. Very similar! I'm curious when these started going up in London as Toronto's first bay and gables started going up in the early 1870's, I believe.
https://i.postimg.cc/TY0RNCSn/sample.jpg

In London tonight, and thought of this thread coming through Chiswick into the Hammersmith flyover...

...until the big blocks kick in approaching Earls Court, its a pudgier Cabbagetown through and through.

Vancouver has never had any amount of brick houses but definatly had some very nice English architecture communities and lovely gardens.

Unfortunately they have almost all been razed to the ground to make way for ugly monster houses, with big ugly concrete fences, and the proper feng shui and pulled down many of the trees as they are considered back luck. When it comes to the destruction of our old homes and heritage, Vancouver could give Dresden a run for it's money. Anyone who hasn't been to Vancouver in 30 years would be truly horrified by the wholesale destruction of entire neighbourhoods.

Vancouver has not only willingly sacrificed it's soul but also it's heritage in pursuit of the almighty dollar and what's left is ugly monster suburban homes you find in Brampton dominating our inner city.

King's College in Halifax is conceptually modeled after Oxford, and the layout of its tiny campus on the edge of (larger and ostensibly "American-style") Dalhousie reflects this (apparently... I've never been to Oxford). Most of the dorms are based around a common UK design of narrow "bays" clustered around a central staircase. Some are clustered together as a block while others are incorporated into other buildings. Most of the buildings on campus are connected by a weird labyrinth of underground tunnels. This is true of the main Dal campus as well, although the two networks don't directly connect. The College is nominally "Anglican" and maintains a neat little chapel on campus, with an interior that looks like an inverted wooden ship.

https://ukings.ca/wp-content/uploads...JIV0845-og.jpg

https://images.squarespace-cdn.com/c...g?format=1500w
Source

Do people still build monster homes? Most of whats been recently built in Vancouver is pretty decent.

The monster home are fairly ubiquitous and have probably been around long enough to be considered part of the "historic" housing stock in Vancouver now. To be honest, as ugly as they are, I don't find them any less attractive than the gablefront houses or the Vancouver specials they replaced.