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Don B. Jan 24, 2010 1:57 PM

^ I was going to organize a team for that, but I had a conflict with another event on my schedule.

But, the Brides of March is coming up fast!

http://www.azcacophony.org/brides/

:)

--don

HooverDam Feb 6, 2010 9:18 PM

I had my lunch at the Civic Space park today, those trees with the white blossoms that are blooming are quite lovely and I'm sure will look even nicer when they're mature. Does anyone know what type of tree that is?

EDIT: VV Cool thanks, luckily I was a bit stuffed up today so I didnt catch a stinky odor.

NIXPHX77 Feb 7, 2010 6:46 AM

Flowering or Ornamental Pear. i have one. they're great, tho the blossom scent is not that great.

phoenixwillrise Feb 7, 2010 8:13 PM

Phoenix Developement
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Leo the Dog (Post 4672435)
Agreed. This is exactly what I was saying a couple weeks ago. We're wasting our "good" years hoping that Phx will somehow magically transform into one of those other cities that we envy on SSP. Perhaps one day, Phx will be world class, but we'll all be old-timers by the time that happens.

Having been interested in Phoenix Development for over 50 years all I can say is hang in there. I have seen the good and the bad and the ever so slow.
The things that I see as having had a severe deterimental affect on Phoenix develpoment during those years are as follows:
1. The city allowing high rises to be built down midtown Central Ave. In particular the Del Webb Complex that sits between Osborn and Indian School,
on the west side of Central. Worthy of note the picture, Vice Lord, shows of the building that from the backside looks like an old IBM COMPUTER CARD,
was originally suppose to be a three building complex with a much higher high rise in the middle of two building the size of that existing building.
2. The voters rejection in the 70'sof a "Bart" Type Transit System that could have been built to bring people downtown rapidly from all points of the metro area.
3. The stall and delaying of freeway construction which would have, yes, maybe increased sprawl, but at the same time made it easier to get to the heart of the city. Most people back then, including writers for the AZRepublic
saw freeways as all having to be like the original ugly Black Canyon Freeway,
with ugly cement walls and no landscaping, vs a beuutiful landscaped freeway
like most of the ones we have now. They feared Phoenix becoming an L.A.
yet had no alternative solutions for sprawl and traffic, their myopic solution, was don't build freeways. Tucson is repeating that same mistake.
4.Lack of City incentives for hospitals, businesses, and shopping to be built in the cities core.
5. In most recent time, not having the Cardinals and Coyotes build their facilities in downtown Phoenix, which with the Light Rail and Convention Center would have give the city some incredible momemtum to accelerate the buildiing of a city with a much larger core.
6. The city of Phoenix needs a more proactive mayor, (yes he has done some good things), to convice people who are building projects to build them downtown, examples of this are the Apollo Groups Headquarters of the I-17 in South Phoenix. Why not get them to bring those buildings downtown?
Another example is the new Instrument Museum out on Tatum and 101. Why not pitch the guy who built that to create some synergy, by building downtown, or at least near the Phoenix Art Museum and Heard Museum.

My frustration on these types of things eventually played a factor in my moving to San Diego, but I have always come back to Phoenix often as I have family here plus I was in the electrical sign business and did signs in the Phoenix area, mostly in malls but also some high rises. I have sold my half of my business and spend more time now in Phoenix as I bought a condo near the Light Rail. I have always been a big ASU and Suns fan which is another reason I live with in walking of LRT.
In closing it's my opinion that as we come out of this recession Phoenix needs
to attract business etc, downtown and also find ways to get infill projects built, mix use, townhomes, and condos, some of those very high end,near it's core to really become a vibrant city over time.

RTD Feb 8, 2010 12:14 AM

Does anyone have any insight on the housing prices in Metro Phoenix in terms of which direction they are likely going to be heading? I plan on moving down there within 3-5 years and am curious to know if I will be able to take advantage of the current low prices that are available on the market in the near future. Thanks!

HooverDam Feb 8, 2010 5:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixwillrise (Post 4686826)
5. In most recent time, not having the Cardinals and Coyotes build their facilities in downtown Phoenix, which with the Light Rail and Convention Center would have give the city some incredible momemtum to accelerate the buildiing of a city with a much larger core.

Its a blessing in disguise Downtown Phx didn't get those venues, especially the Cardinals stadium. The Cardinals stadium would've destroyed the Arts district thats finally bringing some culture and life to Downtown and its only used for 8 home games a year. Theirs a reason why most NFL stadiums aren't in downtown, they're huge, create super blocks, need a ton of (preferably surface) parking for tailgates, etc. Getting the Coyotes stadium and its smaller footprint may have been OK, but its unlikely to think we would've ever had to very similarly sized arenas within a mile or two of each other.

Quote:

Originally Posted by phoenixwillrise (Post 4686826)
6. The city of Phoenix needs a more proactive mayor, (yes he has done some good things)

Thats not really on the Mayor himself, Mayor Gordon has been vastly more proactive in promoting Downtown than any other Mayor in my (admittedly short) lifetime. If you want a system like many cities have where one executive can have a stronger influence and stear the direction of the city you'd have to scrap Phoenix's charter government/Council Manager set up. While scratching that system would have benefits, it also has pitfalls, it opens things up for more corruption and what if you end up with a looney big Mayor who uses his increased power to do shitty things like promote sprawl? In this town where most politicians are tied to the land development game that seems quite likely.

I agree with the rest of what you were saying though :D

Evil Empire Feb 8, 2010 2:49 PM

^^^ Definitely agree with everything in that post.

And your post in the transit thread...you're on fire today :D :tup:

Don B. Feb 8, 2010 4:48 PM

I still think building the Cardinals stadium out in Glendale was a mistake. We would have been better off razing some blighted areas south of downtown and building it next to a revitalized lake in the Salt River.

Oh well...

--don

NorthScottsdale Feb 8, 2010 5:20 PM

THey should have built it on that piece of open land by 40th st and mcdowell

somethingfast Feb 8, 2010 6:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don B. (Post 4687923)
I still think building the Cardinals stadium out in Glendale was a mistake. We would have been better off razing some blighted areas south of downtown and building it next to a revitalized lake in the Salt River.

Oh well...

--don

i love this idea. yes, no offense to glendale but the decision to build out there is antithetical to the idea of creating urbanity in phoenix. if that's the goal there. maybe not? never sure about phoenix.

Leo the Dog Feb 9, 2010 2:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don B. (Post 4687923)
I still think building the Cardinals stadium out in Glendale was a mistake. We would have been better off razing some blighted areas south of downtown and building it next to a revitalized lake in the Salt River.

Oh well...

--don

Glendale was a mistake. Should've been built on the original site at the corner of Priest and Washington in Tempe.

Unfortunately, politics got involved between Tempe, Phoenix and Sky Harbor and then 9/11 happened and we all know what happened after that.

HooverDam Feb 9, 2010 2:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Don B. (Post 4687923)
I still think building the Cardinals stadium out in Glendale was a mistake. We would have been better off razing some blighted areas south of downtown and building it next to a revitalized lake in the Salt River.

Oh well...

--don

Id still like to see something like that happen on a smaller scale. With the recent quasi news of LRT perhaps running down South Central Id love it if down the road a new Spring Training facility was built on either bank of the river, just off Central with a dedicated LRT stop (though their probably needs to be stops on both the North and South banks in all likelihood). If the Cactus League can lure any 2 of the Twins, Cardinals or Astros here that would be a good spot. You could do it in conjunction with continued revitalization of the river bed and making it more parklike.

But now we're way off topic, perhaps Sean can lift this whole thread of conversation into the coffee talk thread.

EDIT: Ask and you shall receive, thanks!

PartyLine Feb 9, 2010 4:56 AM

I don't live in Phoenix but outside of Texas Arizona and Phoenix is my favorite place to visit I used to go out there every year with my parents (probably been going out there since the early 90's) but I haven't been out there in a few years cause the resorts got expensive but my dad's telephone company does business in Arizona my parents may move out there in a year or two to Carefree or Tucson so I may end up out there. I'm shure it's changed alot since the last time I was out there (i'm 28).

phxbyrd Feb 9, 2010 6:03 AM

Cardinals stadium
 
the football stadium didn't necessarily need to go downtown across from Heritage Square where it was proposed. It should have gone either at the original Tempe site or at the fair grounds. With those two spots at the furthest, any site closer to downtown west of 19th ave or south of E. Van Buren would have been even better. Any kind of synergy between downtown and the Super Bowl, Fiesta Bowl, or big soccer would have just been great.

speaking of the fair grounds I've decided it should move to south of the new south mountain freeway on the Indian Reservation.

Vicelord John Feb 9, 2010 6:08 AM

when was it supposed to go across from heritage square? My house has been here since 1986 and they sure as hell werent gonna tear that down. Neither the convention center site, mercado, or garage mahal are large enough parcels.

HooverDam Feb 9, 2010 6:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vicelord John (Post 4689333)
when was it supposed to go across from heritage square? My house has been here since 1986 and they sure as hell werent gonna tear that down. Neither the convention center site, mercado, or garage mahal are large enough parcels.

I believe there was some talk about putting it at the site of the old Montgomery stadium at some point, though I dont think they ever got far or were too terribly serious.

combusean Feb 9, 2010 12:01 PM

There were two sites:

Fourth to Seventh Street, Fillmore to Garfield

Had they did that, there would be no First Friday.

The other was Fourth to Seventh Avenue, Jefferson to Jackson.

Leo the Dog Feb 9, 2010 2:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by combusean (Post 4689523)
There were two sites:

Fourth to Seventh Street, Fillmore to Garfield

Had they did that, there would be no First Friday.

The other was Fourth to Seventh Avenue, Jefferson to Jackson.

Instead, we're left with empty lots with a lot of promise.

FF would've survived, it just wouldn't be in that area.

phxbyrd Feb 9, 2010 4:18 PM

stadium question
 
I hadn't remembered that W. Jackson St. proposal. I still think at one point the Rep. reported a 7st site on Van Buren but either way it didn't need to impact Roosevelt. Considering they decided to build the new court tower at a different location it's a real shame the Cardinals didn't end up there. Can you imagine having UOP at one end of Jackson and Chase field at the other?

I didn't realize Plaza de Maricopa was going to be more than just the tower. What other buildings were going to be included in the project?

Vicelord John Feb 9, 2010 4:23 PM

I still dont think football stadiums really belong downtown. Tooooooooo big.


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