so appropriate, so true

Monaco looks nice. Grigio is a monster.

Do you all realize that those new KMA renderings have been distorted to look shorter and wider? Check out how much fatter and squatter Grigio (aka Mondrian) is, compared to the same rendering that was released some time ago.

That said, I think the Monaco and Riviera renderings would look pretty good in their actual dimensions.


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Did someone post this article already?

I found this online regarding the proposal to redevelopment the Civic Center. I'm so glad to see that they going to reopen B St. to vehicular traffic again after 40 years!!! I hate the way it dead-ends like it does now. :tup:


City of San Diego Seeks Development Partner for New Civic Center Complex


SAN DIEGO-(Business Wire)-August 13, 2007 - The Centre City Development Corporation (CCDC), on behalf of the City of San Diego, issued a nationwide Request for Qualifications (RFQ) on July 31, seeking development partners to explore the possible redevelopment of the Civic Center Complex in Downtown San Diego. The process is the first step in an effort to revitalize the area, cut costs, and improve efficiency and service levels for San Diego taxpayers.

The Civic Center Complex site includes the blocks bounded by Third Avenue and Front, A and C streets, excluding the block at Front and C streets currently housing the County Jail and Chamber Building, and the block at the southwest intersection of Third Avenue and A Street housing the Civic Center Plaza and Centre City buildings.

"Public/private partnerships in redeveloping city administration facilities have become models across the country," said CCDC Chairman Fred Maas. "Exploring a possible redevelopment project that replaces our aging City Hall, cuts costs, consolidates our operations and improves efficiency levels could be a win for San Diegans."

Because of their extensive experience managing complex, high-density development projects CCDC was tasked with managing this process. Similar public/private partnership projects include the new city hall in Austin, Texas, and state-of-the-art courthouse facilities in New York City.

Currently, San Diego's City Administration Building accommodates only 600 employees, and the City has had to lease privately owned space for more than 15 years. City offices are now located within eight downtown buildings (four leased), representing more than one half million square feet of leased space.

Collectively, more than 3,000 employees work in these properties which include annual leasing costs of $13.5 million. Deferred maintenance on the City Administration Building alone is estimated to exceed well in excess of $10 million. With the majority of the leases coming due in 2013 and 2014 and rates projected to significantly increase, this RFQ is seen as a proactive approach to evaluate possible costs savings through redevelopment of the site.

"This project is an important opportunity to spark the revitalization of the area north of Broadway and along C Street," said CCDC President Nancy Graham. "We look forward to receiving proposals and evaluating whether a public/private model could work to solve multiple downtown redevelopment objectives."

The RFQ process will include a thorough financial evaluation to ensure that a project would only move forward if it could clearly demonstrate a significant reduction in operational and capital costs.

Goals of the RFQ include:

— Revitalizing the City's Civic Core

— Catalyzing private sector development in the Civic Center area

— Providing more accessible public spaces

— Providing smart growth transit-oriented development

— Opening up B Street which has been closed to pedestrian and vehicular traffic for 40 years

— Replacing aging infrastructure

— Constructing a more publicly accessible City Hall

— Increasing tax increment revenues generated to the City; and

— Utilizing sustainable development techniques

Responses are due October 12, 2007. A pre-bid conference has been scheduled for September 6 at 10 a.m. in the Silver Room of the Community Concourse (202 C Street). Additionally, public workshops are planned throughout the process to provide input, feedback and ideas. All dates will be posted on the CCDC website www.ccdc.com as they are scheduled.

The complete RFQ can be downloaded from CCDC's website in the Business Opps section at: http://www.ccdc.com/index.cfm/fuseac...etail/rfpID=96.

So I just got back from another trip to Vancouver and I gotta say, DTSD has a long way to go before we can even compare to downtown Vancouver. While the monotonous skyline still makes me throw up a little, their street level activity are much more vibrant during both day and night.

Check out this pic that I took while wandering around. It looks SO much like our Marina District
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_9671.jpg

They've got a bunch of twin towers, as well
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_9666.jpg

See what open space along the waterfront can do for a city? (ignore the ugly buildings in the background ;))
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_9652.jpg

More monotony
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_9656.jpg

View of the False Creek section from the Granville Bridge. While the buildings go close to the edge, there is still a continuous bike/walk path the surrounds the entire downtown area.
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_9553.jpg

^^ What you're calling monotony, I call beautifully stunning architecture. I WISH San Diego's buildings looked that good.

Agreed...screw height, this building is CRAP! Why couldn't they at least put some height on that damn thing! It isn't 500 feet, cuz it isnt even close to Symphony Towers height...BLEH!! I just threw up!

Same here, I think San Diego is the bland one, and Vancouver is more diverse and stunning.

Ok that rendering of Riviera does not have 40 floors, it only has about 28 or 30 unless I'm going blind. That does not look like a 40 floor building. So what are the chances that any of those highrise KMA designs get built??? Are all of those proposals basically cancelled or on hold?

About Vancouver: We have a LONG way to go and by that time Vancouver will be even better so I doubt we can ever catch them, just like downtown LA won't catch us. haha :haha:

The tall building on the far left of the first Vancouver shot is really nice, it looks taller then 500 feet too! That one looks new to me.

I also agree that some of Vancouver's talls are bland but by no means the majority of them. I think they are pretty nice, good colors lots of glass and not much exposed concrete (on the new buildings of course ;) )

Well, I guess it's true that beauty is in the eyes of the beholder. :yes:




Hmmmm....while the setting is certainly stunning, I don't think the buildings are diverse at all. Perhaps the newer ones going up in business district have more variety?

From my visit last late last year -

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_5078.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_5051.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_4982.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_4980.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...s/IMG_5049.jpg

I went into the Downtown Info Center today and saw that the mini model of Monaco has been added. Lookin good :tup:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...r/IMG_9868.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...r/IMG_9862.jpg

Looking West down Broadway shows how slender it is
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...r/IMG_9866.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...r/IMG_9855.jpg

^ nice styrofoam

MANOMANOMANOMAN I wish that's what San Diego looked like (just with more height). :)

You know, its interesting that most comments in this thread are vague wishes like the one above. Are most people refering to only height? Is the greater goal the image of our skyline? Or is the hope that our city will become what we all belive it can? One of the great places to visit in the world; along the lines of San Francisco, London, New york, and Paris. For any of you that have visited those cities, which I am assuming is many of you, what do skylines have to do with a city's greatness? When you go to Manhattan, do you go to the Financial District or the Meatpacking District? When you go to London do you go to Canery Wharf or Covent Garden? The greatest areas of a city aren't measured by the size of its buildings, but by the coulture and people that walk the streets.

^I think you're right that cities are not entirely defined by their skylines but they are at least identified with them (tell me when you last saw a picture of a major city that didn't either focus on or incorporate the skyline).

I would go so far as to agree with you in that the most vibrant and interesting areas of a city aren't necessarily the ones with the highest buildings BUT:

1. This is a forum dedicated to highrises/skyscrapers and urban development
2. This is a thread specifically dedicated to highrises proposed/under construction/ planned in san diego.
3. Height is important not only for aesthetics but also for increasing density and adding feet on the street.


But of course height isn't the only thing that's important. I don't think anyone in their right mind would think so. Smart, dense, pedestrian urban development is ultimately what we want for San Diego. What's wrong with saying that our skyline should be taller?

Well put! That's exactly what I was trying to say in an earlier post when I was mentioning to people that although we don't have the tallest buildings, we aren't doing to bad and our downtown is more alive than a lot of the cities with taller buildings. Take LA for example (no offense) It's like a crack whore...it looks great from a distance, until you get close. Then you're like WTF???

Monaco looks good in the downtown model. :tup:

i believe that what brings visitors to a city are its attractions. san diego has plenty of those and plenty of visitors. but, what makes it stand out on a large scale is the beauty of the place, landmarks. landmarks are what people identify with and use as symbolism for what the city may FEEL like when they visit.

Tall buildings, and iconic towers symbolize a dense core and a vibrant downtown. a nice skyline does that as well. as much as you would think a snapshot of gaslamp would do it, it wont. a huge dense skyline with iconic buildings do the trick.

we already have the weather and natural landmark going for us, but no one associates our city as a destination for urban activity, hussle and bussle.

those pictures of vancouver are horrible

the architecture is horrible

SD's is slightly better:)

and the model of Monaco looks a lot better than the rendering

That is not always true. Paris is one of the most dense cities in the world (more than NYC) and it has a six story cap on most of its city.