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NYguy May 29, 2015 3:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sparkling (Post 7043568)


Why aren't those people running? Don't they realize they're under attack from the supertalls??

phoenixboi08 May 29, 2015 3:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy (Post 7043636)
Why aren't those people running? Don't they realize they're under attack from the supertalls??

They're dazed and confused by those monstrous shadows...

babybackribs2314 May 29, 2015 3:29 PM

Hope you guys like!!! :D :D

Onn May 29, 2015 4:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NYguy (Post 7043636)
Why aren't those people running? Don't they realize they're under attack from the supertalls??

The first paragraph of that article by the New York Times talks about the "long shadows" being spread over Central Park by the towers. Has to give you a little bit of a laugh. :)

sparkling May 29, 2015 4:39 PM

Such Great Heights: The Promise and Peril of Tall Buildings

Friday, May 29, 2015
Patrick Sisson


http://curbed.com/uploads/nycskylineshadows-thumb.png

Quote:

When it comes to real estate, London and New York can seem like transatlantic copies of each other. Stratospheric prices, increasing worries about income disparity, and a boom in ultra-luxe residential construction have many residents worried about the exponential pace of change in both metropolises, as more and more cranes cluster around high-end neighborhoods. Two recent stories have crystalized concerns about the current vertical boom and offered seemingly alternate reactions. In New York, Manhattan's Community Board 5 called for a moratorium on constructing towers over 600 feet tall, putting the brakes on further building along Billionaires Row, a stretch of Midtown on 57th Street near Central Park. (A report by the city's Municipal Art Society, The Accidental Skyline, suggests new towers will cast massive shadows across the park). In London, a group of housing experts released Superdensity: The Sequel, a report with suggestions to moderate the effects of the city's tower-fabricating frenzy (263 buildings over 20 stories are in some stage of development). With zoning regulations falling behind both construction technology and developers showing no sign of relenting, what's a mega-city to do?

Both the report and the response present many different ways to frame the debate. Is this about public versus private space, development versus parks, rich versus poor, or a combination of all three? What groups in both cities grasp, and are grasping at, is a means to moderate rapid construction without sacrificing the character of the city. While the MAS report says today's ultra-tall residential towers cater to the global elite, as opposed to earlier skyscrapers that stand as commercial and civic centers for the masses, it also captures the allure of these structures and a vibrant skyline, "the most stupendous unbelievable spectacle since the hanging gardens of Babylon."

http://cdn.cstatic.net/gridnailer/66...nstshaodow.jpg
The 1987 Stand Against the Shadow in Central Park. Photo by Vic Delucia via Architecture Boston

Opponents of construction in New York argue that the city's as-of-right system, which allows for construction without a lengthy reviews process, requires much-needed reform and more public input, but the issue has also been framed as a crusade to protect public lands. A similar situation occurred in 1987, when the Municipal Art Society mobilized protestors to assemble for a "Stand Against the Shadow" in opposition to the proposed New York Coliseum. A crowd of 800, including celebs such as Paul Newman and Jacqueline Kennedy Onassis, stood in line in Central Park and opened black umbrellas to simulate the shadow that would be cast across the park. It made for great imagery, and at the time, MAS won out. But now, with the Time Warner Center standing at that same site, more integrated into the surrounding neighborhood than the initial Coliseum proposal, MAS is fighting a similar battle against even taller towers, whose steady crawl upwards makes them more an inevitability than interim proposal.

Hyperdensity addresses this inevitability, proposing a broad array of mixed-use solutions that seek towers that make good neighbors. These suggestions—including mixed-use and responsible developments, focusing on mid-rise buildings to increase residential density, and promoting street life and street-level living—take a city-planning approach to solving the issue, spreading out residential growth and fixating on mid-level buildings that don't disrupt the city fabric.

While it's a sensible, citywide approach, structures like the Shard and a significant queue of new projects suggests the demand the supertalls isn't going anywhere. Perhaps the solution—better oversight and contemporary zoning laws—also requires a new look at supertall structures that aren't just starchitect statement pieces, but also new public spaces. New buildings such as the Shanghai Tower include generous park space within its many stories, while projects such as Stefano Boeri's Vertical Forest or CF Møller's wooden skyscraper integrate more public green space within the high-rise concept. Maybe the best way to allay our concerns that supertalls will stand astride our public spaces and spoil our civic landscape is to encourage designs that feature commons spaces that do a better job of inviting the public inside.

Zapatan May 29, 2015 8:50 PM

Sorry to be the bearer of bad news but...


Lead investor in JDS, PMG’s supertall 57th St. tower turns off cash pump - See more at: http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/05/....juKH2Wlj.dpuf

Quote:

The majority investor in Michael Stern and Kevin Maloney’s planned 1,428-foot luxury condo tower at 111 West 57th Street is no longer willing or able to pump money into the project and is in talks to reduce its stake, public records show. - See more at: http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/05/....juKH2Wlj.dpuf
http://therealdeal.com/blog/2015/05/...ff-the-spigot/

timpdx May 29, 2015 9:03 PM

The vibe on this tower has been troubled from the start, and has really dragged. Figures, the is absolutely my fave of the supertalls and its the most troubled. Meh.

chris08876 May 29, 2015 9:34 PM

Hopefully Stern and Maloney can find some other investor. Would be a major bummer to see a reduction on this or not even happening at all.

photoLith May 29, 2015 9:58 PM

Is this why the tower is no longer on the diagram?

Zapatan May 29, 2015 10:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by chris08876 (Post 7044177)
Hopefully Stern and Maloney can find some other investor. Would be a major bummer to see a reduction on this or not even happening at all.

I feel like people are going to hate me for saying this but I'm actually not that upset. This building, while awesome looking was just too skinny for my taste. It would be nice to have 2 1400' buildings right next to each other though.

Nordstrom at ~1,480 roof and Park lane at 1200+ will alter the skyline dramatically enough as is. Maybe there is still a chance of this going up somehow anyway. I would like to see it built, but it's not one of those buildings that would be devastating for me if it got cancelled, despite the height.

babybackribs2314 May 29, 2015 11:00 PM

It's a load of BS and the story was planted by the unions that JDS is currently fighting.

JR Ewing May 30, 2015 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapatan (Post 7044213)
I feel like people are going to hate me for saying this but I'm actually not that upset. This building, while awesome looking was just too skinny for my taste. It would be nice to have 2 1400' buildings right next to each other though.

Nordstrom at ~1,480 roof and Park lane at 1200+ will alter the skyline dramatically enough as is. Maybe there is still a chance of this going up somehow anyway. I would like to see it built, but it's not one of those buildings that would be devastating for me if it got cancelled, despite the height.

Don't get too excited, Zappo. Even if this story were true, which is far from established, there is an avalanche of money flowing into NYC to fund projects. Thus, this clearly will be built. I know you're purportedly "excited" about NY's projects, but your incessant penchant to propagate doom and gloom suggests otherwise. In any event, this is not the Chicago Spire. There is demand, and there will be funding.

Zapatan May 30, 2015 12:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR Ewing (Post 7044328)
Don't get too excited, Zappo. Even if this story were true, which is far from established, there is an avalanche of money flowing into NYC to fund projects. Thus, this clearly will be built. I know you're purportedly "excited" about NY's projects, but your incessant penchant to propagate doom and gloom suggests otherwise. In any event, this is not the Chicago Spire. There is demand, and there will be funding.


Yea I really would love to see NY never build anything again which is why I've spent years posting on this forum predominately in NY threads. :rolleyes:

You keep mistaking realism for negativity. Obviously it would be great if all these new towers would be built but it's better to be conservative with excitement. I'm just bracing for the same thing to happen to NY which happened to Chicago last decade. Of course NY is a bigger, more economically healthy city with more demand but I can't help but feel all these new supertalls are a little too good to be true, at least to some extent.

JR Ewing May 30, 2015 12:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zapatan (Post 7044345)
Yea I really would love to see NY never build anything again which is why I've spent years posting on this forum predominately in NY threads. :rolleyes:

You keep mistaking realism for negativity. Obviously it would be great if all these new towers would be built but it's better to be conservative with excitement. I'm just bracing for the same thing to happen to NY which happened to Chicago last decade. Of course NY is a bigger, more economically healthy city with more demand but I can't help but feel all these new supertalls are a little too good to be true, at least to some extent.

Since you don't really know NY and the market, in particular, take it from someone who's in the industry: this is not Chicago, and this will be built without delays.

chris08876 May 30, 2015 12:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR Ewing (Post 7044356)
take it from someone who's in the industry: this is not Chicago, and this will be built without delays.

:cheers:

NYguy May 30, 2015 8:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by babybackribs2314 (Post 7044252)
It's a load of BS and the story was planted by the unions that JDS is currently fighting.

And even as is, there was nothing to suggest the tower wouldn't get built. With the way things are going now (with more supertalls still to come), it would almost be silly to suggest the tower would have trouble moving along.

Onn May 30, 2015 6:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR Ewing (Post 7044328)
Don't get too excited, Zappo. Even if this story were true, which is far from established, there is an avalanche of money flowing into NYC to fund projects. Thus, this clearly will be built. I know you're purportedly "excited" about NY's projects, but your incessant penchant to propagate doom and gloom suggests otherwise. In any event, this is not the Chicago Spire. There is demand, and there will be funding.

Well there was demand and funding for the Chicago Spire, but anyway...I don't know who might be willing to invest in the project, but there do seem to be more than a few buyers in the market. So that's good news either way.

Of course any bad news for this tower means Extell will be rubbing its hands together.

JR Ewing May 30, 2015 6:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Onn (Post 7044824)
Well there was demand and funding for the Chicago Spire, but anyway...I don't know who might be willing to invest in the project, but there do seem to be more than a few buyers in the market. So that's good news either way.

Of course any bad news for this tower means Extell will be rubbing its hands together.

Once again. This is not Chicago. There was not demand for the Spire, nor was there serious funding. It was a hair-brained scheme by a plumber from Ireland.

111 will be built. The subject investor is a small player and the sums involved are a pittance vis-a-vis the total costs if this project.

Anyone who disputes this must have read Chicken Little recently and adapts his absurd concern about the sky falling.

Onn May 30, 2015 6:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR Ewing (Post 7044834)
Once again. This is not Chicago. There was not demand for the Spire, nor was there serious funding. It was a hair-brained scheme by a plumber from Ireland.

There was money and demand, not enough time to get it done. I'm not sure why the Spire was even brought up here.

Zapatan May 30, 2015 8:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JR Ewing (Post 7044356)
Since you don't really know NY and the market, in particular, take it from someone who's in the industry: this is not Chicago, and this will be built without delays.

I have no doubt you know a lot more than I do if you work in the industry, so yes, I'll take your word for it. But, this project has always seemed a little shaky from the get go so that's why the article made me worry.


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