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-   -   SAN DIEGO | Boom Rundown, Vol. 2 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126473)

SDCAL Jun 1, 2007 1:42 AM

[QUOTE=sandiego_urban;2870599]Cosmo? Well, the times I've called their office to inquire about it, they keep saying they're finalizing details...I still have hope.
QUOTE]

Is it an office exclusive to that project?? If so, I say it's a good sign they actually have a working number with people answering it!! If a project was not planning to move forward I wouldn't think they'd have paid employees maintaining a business line? :banaride:

Derek Jun 1, 2007 3:08 AM

Helluva friggin game in Pittsburgh...

eburress Jun 1, 2007 5:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bushman61988 (Post 2870059)
WOW are you serious?? I HATE with a PASSION the Vancouver skyline...everything looks the freakin same! And it's all like a plateau-type skyline b/c of the height limit.

Yes, I am completely serious. Vancouver has a few stinkers, but I do really like the vast majority of the buildings built there over the last ten years. The similarity of the building style doesn't bother me as long as I like said style. The buildings in Rome or Paris all look the same too and nobody says "everything looks the freakin' same." ;)

I don't care for the plateau-type skyline, but for SD, there's not much we can do about that.

eburress Jun 1, 2007 5:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dl3000 (Post 2870523)
I remember reading somewhere that the city did a big study and now they have varying height limits based on some computer generated study to see where the least impact on views would be, and now it was once 500 ft now its in the 600s, they're building a 600 something foot hotel right now.

I think the height limits are around 500ft for most of downtown but there are certain spots in which they're able to build much taller buildings now. The Vancouver thread has a map of their height limits.

dl3000 Jun 1, 2007 5:49 AM

I agree, Vancouver has a great skyline, but there was a period when they were just building crap, but oh well, overall I'd be happy if San Diego became something like Vancouver is today.

Derek Jun 1, 2007 6:18 AM

^I agree.

sandiego_urban Jun 1, 2007 6:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SDCAL (Post 2870767)
Is it an office exclusive to that project?? If so, I say it's a good sign they actually have a working number with people answering it!! If a project was not planning to move forward I wouldn't think they'd have paid employees maintaining a business line? :banaride:

Here's a link to the developer's website www.simploncorporation.com. Try giving them a call to see if you can get anymore information.

Quote:

Originally Posted by dl3000
I agree, Vancouver has a great skyline, but there was a period when they were just building crap, but oh well, overall I'd be happy if San Diego became something like Vancouver is today.

I think Vancouver's skyline looks great a night, but during the day, it does nothing for me. There are just too many Allegro Tower look-alikes for my taste. I do realize that beauty is in the eyes of the beholder.

sandiego_urban Jun 1, 2007 7:10 AM

Nickelodeon Hotel -


For a kid-theme hotel, I think it looks great. :tup: I actually prefer this Gensler design to their other project a couple miles to the South, the Navy Broadway Complex.

http://www.nickmarriott.com/
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...ing_Aerial.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...ring_Canal.jpg




Latest news and more renderings -


14th & K St
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...03/14thK-1.jpg

Design approval was granted for 14th & K St, a 7, 11, and 23-story (65’ – 236’) residential tower located on the block bounded by J St, K St, 13th, and 14th. When completed, the 222-unit building will have ten shopkeeper units, 27 studios, 104 one-bedroom, and 81 two-bedroom condominiums; 318 spaces in a four-level underground garage. The three buildings are positioned around a seismic fault; this open area creates an urban canyon to be enjoyed by residents and those passing by. Retail (8,000 square feet) will be situated at the building’s corners. The building’s design is rustic in feel, using brick and exposed aggregate concrete at their bases with light glass and metal finish in the towers to compliment the rehabilitation of the existing historical building. East Village – Lower East Side Neighborhood.


1909 State
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12.../1909State.jpg
Design approval was granted for 1909 State, an existing commercial office building located at 1909 State Street. Property will be expanded to allow the addition of three (3) residential apartments with 1,000 square feet of office space. Anticipated construction to begin December 2007. Little Italy Neighborhood.



1st & Island
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12.../1stIsland.jpg
Design approval was granted for 1st & Island, a 3 and 39-story (45’, 440’) residential tower located on the block bounded by 1st, Island, 2nd, and J St. When completed, there will be 178 2-bedroom units, 22,580 square feet of ground floor retail with 460 spaces (including 23 commercial and guest parking) in a three-level underground garage. The elegant building with a sophisticated design has a polished limestone covering the entire 45’ base, light green colored glass, and very generously sized balconies creating a sense of transparency. The Martin Luther King Promenade will be extended through to J Street creating a large significantly landscaped plaza featuring a low linear water feature along almost the entire length of the plaza. Anticipated construction to begin September 2008. Marina Neighborhood.

Derek Jun 1, 2007 1:48 PM

Thanks for the update! The Nickelodeon hotel actually looks pretty good! I changed my mind about the water park since it's enclosed by the hotel. Is that the actual proposal for Pt. Loma?

eburress Jun 1, 2007 2:46 PM

I like the Nickelodeon hotel too. I don't like how the 1st and Island tower is heavier at the top though. Top-heavy is good on girls...but NEVER good on buildings.

mongoXZ Jun 1, 2007 5:27 PM

^^I'm all for the Nickelodeon Hotel. But it will be a matter of time when the NIMBYs get their hands all over this.

Did anyone see the front page of today's paper?

Sunroad's plan to build near Lindbergh Field troubles FAA
By Maureen Magee
and David Hasemyer
UNION-TRIBUNE STAFF WRITERS
June 1, 2007

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniont.../towers280.jpghttp://www.signonsandiego.com/uniont...ges/hotels.gif

At the same time Sunroad Enterprises has been battling over the height of an office tower near Montgomery Field, it has proposed building two hotel towers near Lindbergh Field that also exceed federal standards.
The hotels would be built on public land on the east side of Harbor Island, less than half a mile from the international airport where nearly 300 passenger and cargo planes depart daily.

One of the buildings surpasses Federal Aviation Administration height limits by 125 feet and the other by 69 feet, according to FAA documents and records obtained from the San Diego Unified Port District, which oversees development along San Diego Bay.

The Port Commission reviewed the initial Sunroad proposal, which did not cite building heights, in December 2005 and asked the company to go ahead with environmental reviews. Sunroad later specified heights – which it later said were preliminary – for the towers but ignored directives from the port district and the San Diego Regional Airport Authority to notify the FAA of its plans.

The port recently informed the FAA itself. Three weeks ago, the FAA issued eight separate findings concluding that the proposed hotels would be “hazards to air navigation.”

The port told Sunroad that the heights proposed were unacceptable.

“Our staff position is that any building on the East Harbor Island site will not exceed the FAA's recommended obstruction standards,” port officials wrote in a letter to the developer two weeks ago.

Sunroad cannot build without support from the Port Commission. Since it received the port's letter, Sunroad has questioned the way the FAA decides building heights in the area.
The company told the FAA in a letter sent earlier this week that its consultants say buildings as tall as 403 feet could be safely built on east Harbor Island because it is outside the primary approach and departure routes of planes using Lindbergh Field.

Sunroad remains committed to the project. Its reluctance to confer with the FAA, among other things, has caught some local agencies off guard.

“Maybe they think they have better experts than the FAA,” said Linda Johnson, the airport authority manager in charge of land-use planning. “It does seem like a very bold approach.”

The disagreement comes as Sunroad defends the 180-foot office tower across from Montgomery Field in Kearny Mesa that the FAA says exceeds the safe height limit by 20 feet.

The 12-story building has spawned a series of lawsuits and investigations in recent months, and it created a public rift at City Hall between Mayor Jerry Sanders and City Attorney Michael Aguirre.
Aguirre sued Sunroad in December, and the developer countersued the city for $40 million. The city attorney also filed conflict-of-interest charges against Sunroad Vice President Tom Story, who once worked for the San Diego Development Services Department.

Sanders issued a stop-work order on the top two stories of the Kearny Mesa project on May 18 – six months after the height dispute was first reported by The San Diego Union-Tribune and more than a year after the FAA said the tower would pose a danger to pilots.

Sunroad suspects that controversy motivated the port to act.

“I'm sure the port is acting out of an abundance of caution because of the situation that has come up around Montgomery Field,” Sunroad spokeswoman Karen Hutchens said.

Sunroad officials denied that the port directed them to inform the FAA of their plans for the hotel towers, even though letters from the port district to the company refer to such a request.

“Nobody asked Sunroad to submit anything to the FAA,” Hutchens said.

She said it was premature to seek an FAA study of the project because it is still in preliminary planning and years from construction. The building heights submitted to the FAA by port officials were maximum heights Sunroad used for planning purposes and do not reflect a final plan, she said.

“We are in the process of developing a concept for the property,” Hutchens said. “The timing wasn't right for this to go to the FAA.”

She said FAA rules do not demand a review sooner than 30 days before construction begins.

Sunroad executives presented revised plans for the Harbor Island project to commissioners in September, six months after the FAA told the company its office tower in Kearny Mesa was a danger to Montgomery Field pilots landing in bad weather.

The latest revisions call for 600 hotel rooms, 21,000 square feet of meeting space, restaurants, shops and landscaped plazas and promenades.

The project would be built around the existing Sunroad Resort Marina, on property the company leases from the port, and the popular Island Prime restaurant, which subleases its venue from Sunroad.

The Sunroad towers – at 221 and 281 feet, respectively – would far exceed the Sheraton San Diego Hotel as the tallest structures on Harbor Island. The 1,044-room Sheraton is 154 feet tall, just under the FAA's standard.

Since Sunroad objected to the FAA's conclusions, the agency has solicited comments from representatives of airlines, pilot groups, business associations and government agencies.

“We will review the comments and conduct further analysis to determine whether a final hazard determination is warranted,” said FAA spokesman Ian Gregor.

Port Commissioners Stephen Cushman and Robert Spane said they were unaware Sunroad's plans were deemed hazardous by federal regulators.

“Sounds like we did our job,” Spane said. “We did used to run the airport. Maybe that has something to do with it.”

The port operated Lindbergh Field for decades before that responsibility was turned over to the San Diego Regional Airport Authority in 2003.

Sunroad originally planned to negotiate a new lease, complete environmental reviews and begin construction by this fall. The Sunroad Harbor Island project was to be completed in early 2010.

All must first be approved by the Port Commission, the State Lands Commission and the California Coastal Commission. Finally, the city of San Diego would need to issue building permits.

Sunroad officials have requested a meeting with the federal regulators as soon as possible.

In a letter to the FAA dated May 24, Sunroad said it wants to “determine what alterations need to be considered to eliminate the obstruction of navigable airspace” for the Harbor Island project.

The letter was dated one day after a heated phone conversation between Story, Sunroad's vice president, and Ralph Hicks, the port's land-use director. Hicks documented the phone call in a memo that is now on file at the port district.

“Mr. Story rebutted that port staff had not asked Sunroad to submit this paperwork numerous times,” the memo says. “Mr. Hicks stated that staff has documented proof that these requests were made, and given Sunroad's failure to submit the paperwork or contact the FAA, port staff moved forward.”

Sunroad failed to notify the FAA of plans to build its Kearny Mesa tower near Montgomery Field, claiming it was exempt from the requirement.

According to documents obtained by the Union-Tribune, a company architect said there was an exemption for buildings under 200 feet.

However, the building fell into another FAA review category, one that covers buildings planned within three miles of the airport.

The FAA didn't learn of the $45 million office tower until an anonymous tip advised the federal agency of the developer's plans before construction began in March 2006, at about the same time the city issued a building permit.

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniont...es/view430.jpg
Sunroad's two-hotel development would be built at the tree-lined eastern tip of Harbor Island. The towers would surpass FAA height limits by 125 feet and 69 feet, records show.

mongoXZ Jun 1, 2007 5:34 PM

If you look at that last picture it is clear that planes approaching from the east are closer to the downtown skyscrapers when they're over Banker's Hill/Mission Hills compared to where these Sunroad buildings are proposed to be.

PadreHomer Jun 1, 2007 6:44 PM

The FAA and the city just have a hard on for Sunroad right now

Crackertastik Jun 1, 2007 6:59 PM

I give Sunroad props honestly. They are questioning the FAA restrictions. Hopefully what comes out of this is an updated height restriction overlay for the region that makes more sense and is more reasonable. opening up the skies further south in downtown to taller buildings. They just assume have the whole county limited as it stands now. Bastards! I think sunroad should keep fighting and say, you need to look at how outdated and unrealistic and overzealous your restrictions are. Maybe the port and ccdc will agree and make a movement for change.

SDDTProspector Jun 1, 2007 7:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crackertastik (Post 2872152)
I give Sunroad props honestly. They are questioning the FAA restrictions. Hopefully what comes out of this is an updated height restriction overlay for the region that makes more sense and is more reasonable. opening up the skies further south in downtown to taller buildings. They just assume have the whole county limited as it stands now. Bastards! I think sunroad should keep fighting and say, you need to look at how outdated and unrealistic and overzealous your restrictions are. Maybe the port and ccdc will agree and make a movement for change.

I give props to Sunroads.... I always thought that the sunroads center off the 163 was to test the "FAA waters" for something bigger.....:tup: maybe this will indeed be the catalyst for changes D-town.....

eburress Jun 1, 2007 7:29 PM

I wish Sunroad was challenging the FAA on a downtown building instead of these because it seems like that would get us to our ultimate goal (taller downtown buildings) faster.

sandiego_urban Jun 1, 2007 8:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by crackerstick
I give Sunroad props honestly. They are questioning the FAA restrictions. Hopefully what comes out of this is an updated height restriction overlay for the region that makes more sense and is more reasonable. opening up the skies further south in downtown to taller buildings. They just assume have the whole county limited as it stands now. Bastards! I think sunroad should keep fighting and say, you need to look at how outdated and unrealistic and overzealous your restrictions are. Maybe the port and ccdc will agree and make a movement for change.

I couldn't agree with you more. :yes:

Wouldn't this be a perfect time for CCDC to get in on the action and ask why there couldn't be height limit variances as you move away from the airport? I, too, give props to Sunroad for their actions and hope it lead to a re-evaluation of the height limits surrounding the airport - keeping in mind that safety is most important.





Here's a slightly clearer and wider image of the 7th & Market proposal that includes a small portion of neighboring Cosmo -

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...20Market-1.jpg

sandiego_urban Jun 1, 2007 8:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mongoXZ (Post 2871972)
http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniont...es/view430.jpg
Sunroad's two-hotel development would be built at the tree-lined eastern tip of Harbor Island. The towers would surpass FAA height limits by 125 feet and 69 feet, records show.

The gaps are starting to fill in nicely from this angle. Just imagine what it will look like once Lane Field and NBC get started :tup:

eburress Jun 1, 2007 8:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sandiego_urban (Post 2872286)

Here's a slightly clearer and wider image of the 7th & Market proposal that includes a small portion of neighboring Cosmo -

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y12...20Market-1.jpg

If that's really what the top of the new 7th and Market tower is going to look like, then I don't like it. Like somebody else said, it looks like something out of the '80s...and not in a good way. Here's hoping they're not yet finished. :whip:

SDDTProspector Jun 1, 2007 9:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eburress (Post 2872390)
If that's really what the top of the new 7th and Market tower is going to look like, then I don't like it. Like somebody else said, it looks like something out of the '80s...and not in a good way. Here's hoping they're not yet finished. :whip:


I actually like it alot.... Its not the same boring crap that every other developer does... In san diego the top of building are a after thought... Anyways it will make the building stand out, I would have an issue if every building had a top like that, but it is only one so far..... We don't want to look exactly like Vancouver. Let's not be followers.

If you like Broadway 655 you will like this one because it is designed by the same firm.....


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