That's what I was thinking too. I think it's pretty likely that the Patullo will have a rail component. When that's announced, however... this article will "seem" prophetic... which is perhaps why it's not mentioned.

The author also doesn't seem to have researched the actual corridor that might be used. I know the 176th St. Corridor seems like a logical choice for High-speed rail, but that hill before the #1 is awfully steep if it goes to the #1. 200th is too congested. All that is mentioned is cross the border near Cloverdale... which admittedly is on 176th.

I also don't know where high-speed tracks could be built alongside commuter LRT in any useful fashion unless it's built along the #1, which isn't too useful for LRT that connects people. Through Surrey it is bound to have level crossings, unless they build it elevated at intersections.

they should reopen that autombile level to bikes and pedestrians - get them off the patullo :yes:

What is the Level of Support or Opposition to Arbutus Corridor Development
 

I imagine this has been discussed at some point on this post or on others so sorry if a repeat.

But what is the level of support - or opposition - to developing the Arbutus rail corridor with some form of public transit? Street-car, light-rail, or anything.

It just always strikes me as such a waste of a viable link each time I drive through Kerrisdale and down towards Kitsalano. The stretch practically begs for some type of smart, savvy, green transit system, yet there it sits, with just a dusty walking trail, bits of green space and maybe a couple of community gardens. I don't even think there is a bike trail along it, is there?

What gives? Are the neighbors opposed? Just not on the priority list?

It just seems like a strange gap for a city trying to build out its green potential.

It is slated to eventually become part of the City's streetcar line.

Wow - I had no idea. All I had seen was the chart posted here many times seems to be mostly downtown lines and then the demo line under construction now.

But even after posting my initial comment I did find one vague reference on the city transportation site talking about "eventual" extensions that did mention Arbutus.

Are the neighborhoods supportive of those efforts? Has anyone studied that? I'm just curious. If I lived there, I'd be pushing and hoping for it. But you just don't know how folks will react.

My favorite tale in that regard is folks in the Georgetown neighborhood of DC resisting being part of the metro line system as it was being planned and built nearly three decades back. Now whenever talk of expanding the highly successful system comes up, they always want to be part of the mix. But the reality is the bulk of future planning is in the outer suburban areas or infill stations on existing lines within and outside the city, ares that embraced the original vision to a much greater degree and can be incorporated more sensibly into expanding the existing network.

I would hate to see that happen to communities in Vancouver. I think adding streetcar would enhance those communities by providing a modern transit system to the urban core and surrounding communities.

There was a vote on it and the neighbourhood was obviously against it. It would've went through anyway if we built the RAV line using the Arbutus LRT corridor over the Cambie one. Thank god that didn't happen.

The Arbutus corridor would be great for Streetcar.

Arbutus would be great as an LRT... but we'll call it a cute heritage street car so that the creme de la creme won't come out in force against it. A combined bike/LRT path would be awesome for that corridor. Somethink like the Central Valley Greenway but North/South.

Some would have them use that as a High Speed Rail entry into Vancouver, but I can't ever see that happening.

The City also won a court case that upheld its zoning bylaw that preserved the corridor for transportation purposes (CP Rail had wanted to sell off the land for development)

Develop what? An 8km strip of row houses?

I hope CoV fasttracks the streetcar plan, though they're probably broke right now. The longer they wait, the more likely CP Rail may appeal.

It is really not that good a corridor for a streetcar. Some of the major destinations such as Arbutus Village are quite a ways from the tracks. As well, given the long curve up the hill, it would probably be slower than the buses.

It would make a much better greenway for bikes and pedestrians. Keep the streetcars on the street.

If by far you mean 150m, then you are correct. Besides, if it was a really that big a deal, they could always run it in street along that stretch. I seriously doubt it would be slower than buses. Buses have to stop at lights, whereas, for much of the route, the LRT/Streetcar would have priority through intersections.

It would also serve the central Kerrisdale community and be a great thing for the stores around there on West Blvd. It practically travels through St. Vincent's Hospital and given that it's on its own ROW for much of the route, would be very quick.

Besides, it would make a better LRT route. In fact, it's a perfect fit for Streetcar/LRT. A partially segregated route on its own ROW with limited crossings. What better fit could you ask for?

Bombardier's Flexity Trams would work well. These "TRAMS" come in Long:
http://www.railway-technology.com/co...sels-metro.jpg

And short:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...n_Brussels.jpg

Besides, there's still room for a bike path in that corridor.

The Arbutus corridor is adjacent to the road, so hardly more distance to Arbutus Village. And the slightly longer route up to Kerrisdale (the long curve) would avoid contending with a steeper grade. In fact I don't think it would be possible to run it on that part of the road, at that grade, without some funky pulley system...

Not really. Separate bike and ped paths are required for such a high quality facility. It is an especially bad idea to mix commuter cyclists and seniors who are walking. As well, many seniors also use electric scooters and a bike path would be good for those as well. You might be able to squeeze in a bike path, a ped path and one track, but then the sevice would not be that great so what would the point be.

There are a lot of seniors living along the corridor, so you want lots of stops close to destinations and housing. With lots of stops, the street car would not be much faster than the bus.

It is not a good idea just to have a train just because there is a right-of-way. If there was not the right-of-way, no one would even suggest that Arbutus would be a priority for a tram.

150m for those seniors who can fly over the Arbutus Club. Otherwise, it is 300-350m from King Ed or Nanton to Arbutus Village and an additional 100-200m to the housing behind the Village.

If you run it up the street there, it would be difficult or impossible to get it back on the rail corridor.

I think it would depend on what part of the corridor you are on. There are many quiet streets that parallel the corridor that can be used for cyclist routes.
Though I think it would be faster than a bus... there is more to it than just speed, especially for seniors. Low floor trains are easier to ride in and you just can't compare the ride quality to a bus. Most standees are holding on with two hands to brace themselves (depending on the bus driver, of course)

The quality of rail transportation is in general better than bus transportation, especially when it's in its own ROW.

It would also connect several key destinations such as Granville Island, Arbutus & Broadway, Kerrisdale.

As with other transit-oriented projects, the partial solution to reducing the distance to Arbutus Village would be to build the mall out to the street. That could cut the distance by as much as 1/3 the distance depending on where the station is located.
i.e. expect that to happen with Brentwood Mall and Lougheed Mall - eventually...

2005 Global Air Photo:
http://www.globalairphotos.com/image...ch2005_189.jpg

That would cut a third the distance. You would have a rail stop at the ROW and close to Nanton Ave and create that street into a more pedestrian friendly route(200m) direct from the Arbutus Club beside it to the shopping centre's southeast corner.

There's homes on the south side of Nanton but the north side adjacent to the Club could see wider sidewalks, better lighting, etc. They might want to keep Nanton as a west-east through-street so I'm not sure how that would fit into things as far as traffic concerns or safety with an increase in use of the area.

I think the corridor that would be best served by HSR is Highway 1.

The tracks could follow the existing ROW from Pacific Central through the Grandview cut, then cross over/under the Fraser near the new Port Mann Bridge (I'm sure CP and CN would love that crossing point too).

Once over the river, the tracks can follow the highway ROW. Highway 1 is very straight and after 152nd street has a fairly level grade. The tracks would follow the highway to Abbotsford.

There, we just tricked the Americans into helping us build the first leg of a highspeed railway in the Fraser Valley linking Abbostford and downtown Vancouver. A short LRT line could serve the Abbostford Airport as well as run into downtown Abbostford. The tracks to Abbostford would not only serve Amtrak, but also Translink and VIA.

Not only are we linking two urban centers, but also two airports, meaning that some flights can be diverted from YVR to YXX, not to mention the fact that it also links the US airports with ours resulting in a major reduction in the need for overlapping flight coverage (YVR can finally lower prices for flights because it no longer needs to carry every destination every day and all flights between Vancouver, Seattle, and Portland can be cut to a bare minimum).

From there, the line could turn South crossing the boarder at Sumas. There is an old ROW where I think the tracks have been torn up (saving us from having to do it to replace them). The ROW runs right into Bellingham. From there it joins the already existing Amtrak network. But the Americans can worry about that.

The difference is only about 25km so at speeds over 150km/h it's not much of a difference. As well the ROW would probably be cheaper to install because it is very hilly around the peach arch near highway 99 and 15. As well, going out to Abbotsford jointly with Amtrak reduces the cost to BC for building a track out there anyway, which could be extended by BC to Chilliwack, Hope, and Kamloops.

Interesting ideas.

But with regards to the airports, Vancouver is already losing passengers to Seattle because Seattle prices are cheaper. I don't see how interconnecting the cities airpots could help. The airport's goal is to increase the number of flights to and from it, both to make it more money, and to make it and the city more prominent, which would mean even more money.

But on the other hand, as a consumer I would vastly prefer price competition than having a few million visitors pass through Vancouver every year.