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Ya this isn't going to happen, the City need to tear up this contract and find someone more competent.
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Let's see what they say next week. Agreed that if they don't start showing something substantial soon, the City needs to look at exit options to the contract.
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I think what's the most disheartening aspect is if OVG doesn't get to work their magic because of the ineptitude of HUPEG.
OVG lists the project on their site still for whatever that's worth but this looks like a classic City Hall decision sadly. Just knock the arena over and sell the land. |
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https://imgur.com/a/6tkBJjv
Unfortunate new rendering from the GIC meeting today. |
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If they're just reclading, may as well just give it a powerwash or a paintjob and save a ton of cash - not much difference in aesthetics. Very disappointing.
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Image/link not working for me :(
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Oh. So pretty much nothing is being changed or improved... love that.
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So they wet the streets and painted the pig ! Great -- it's been Hamiltoned
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What a huge disappointment, now I’m regretting we didn’t go with Vrancor. It probably would’ve been under construction by now… |
I would love to see the contract that the city signed with these idiots and who is to blame for this. Totally unacceptable since the result is severely not as advertised.
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Lipstick and lights.
Let's hope the interior work will be much more impactful. A fool's hope, most likely, after seeing that render. |
They kicked the Bulldogs out for that? lol
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I hope they have a breakdown of interior and exterior costs - because I'd love to know what the cost is for putting lipstick on that exterior pig.
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I have a really hard time believing OVG is involved anymore because there's not a chance in you know what, that they're okay with that being under their banner.
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Consortium targeting fall 2025 completion for FirstOntario arena redevelopment
September 20, 2023 4:42 pm https://globalnews.ca/news/9973357/c...redevelopment/ HIGHLIGHTS: - Partners tasked with renovating FirstOntario say they’re hoping to complete $280 million worth of work in time for reopening in October 2025. - Confirmation that the ground-level concourse will be built out - Legal agreements are still being finalized, and the current goal is to reopen the arena in about two years. - OVG Canada president Tom Pistore said the final sign-offs on much of the development will happen in the next few weeks including one of the starting points: construction drawings from their architect. - It’s expected the group will reveal a community engagement process to align with other forthcoming downtown investments, like the LRT development, and launch a long-term social impact strategy.| - HUPEG offered to host Bulldogs if Brantford arena not ready. |
Holy hell that's absolutely pathetic! I would be having a good laugh if this was April Fools day but I just checked the calander....:runaway:
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While disappointing to see the exterior renovations scaled back, I'm not surprised. It's a lot of money to spend with no real return in investment.
The core aspects of the renovation, which seem to include extensive renovations and expansions of the interior spaces, still seems to be there. Some of those facade changes may have triggered site plan approval as well, which delays the project. A strict renovation with no changes to the building floor area allow them to skip that approval process. It's important to remember that the renovations have always been much more focused on the fan experience on the interior of the facility - exterior renovations are really just niceties. Disappointing for sure, but not a total let down. The functionality of the facility will still be greatly upgraded and I expect a much larger number of large-scale events to be scheduled here following the renovations still, and that's really what matters. |
I was more relieved reading that news article. $280 million should pay for a lot of improvement to the interior, and if they're still waiting for architectural drawings perhaps that image is still mostly a concept and not final.
Current concept: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F6eiDdTX...g&name=900x900 Previous concept: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/F6eiDlOW...pg&name=medium Source from the previous page: https://twitter.com/ham_bicycleguy/s...0Z7eDa1yg&s=19 |
That new render makes it look NHL-ready.
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That intersection will not have a good public realm until the homeless shelter is moved. Why would anyone want to hang out around there?
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Was never a huge fan of the previous concept, but it's better than the new one which does almost nothing to remove the outdated look of the arena. It will still scream 80's no matter how many screens you add to it.
This was a much better concept IMO: https://i.cbc.ca/1.4046563.149082205...t-art-2017.png I'd rather they only do renovations to the interior for the time being, and kick the exterior reno can down the road until they have a better plan and more resources. |
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I wouldn't mind a "box" if well-clad. In that render, to me, it looks like it should have a Costco sign on top. It would be the nicest looking (from outside) Costco in all the land, but still... :)
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I'm tired of boxes. Bring on some more interesting stuff. Almost everything is a box. I liked the bulldogs render one - wavey - at least it wasn't literally like everything else. When all you know how to make is boxes and picture frame jutouts - you're not designing architecture - you're choosing from preset blocks.
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Just gonna bring this back up for comparison and reminder sake. Here is the presentation given to council: https://pub-hamilton.escribemeetings...umentId=378717 My phone isn’t liking flikr right now, but there is another render of the interior during a concert among some others… Based on what I see: - Only the King St side concourse will have suites, suites which appear to be over old existing seats instead of in the concourse… (so decreased capacity) - The James St side lower bowl will not have entrances to the new concourse - There will be no new curtain system to cover the upper bowl like in the previous render - New scoreboard but same size as current… - Luxury Restaurant/Lounge on existing concourse on the York side of the arena. - Existing concourse seems to have a more luxury feel than a rustic feel (when comparing new and old renderings) - Continued use of stairs to access upper bowl. In short, it looks like all we’re getting is an exterior paint job, a cheap new scoreboard, new seats, a new concourse, a renovated concourse, a few box suites, and a premium lounge. Not gonna lie, right now I’m kind of upset we didn’t go with Vancor, atleast they would’ve been well underway by now. |
Thanks for the link to the presentation.
The larger image of the render pretty much assures the exterior's nothing more than a paint job (or the equivalent result of one). And the inclusion of other recently completed arena projects makes FOCs reno embarrassing by comparison. Weird they included a screenshot of a Globe and Mail article which happens to contain the image of the previous render. It just advertises what a disappointment the latest proposal is. |
So the exterior render looks pretty terrible and the presentation slides are pretty sloppily put together, but I am pinning my hopes on them spending in the stated neighbourhood of $280 million. That is not chump change and should pay for a lot of decent stuff.
I don't really understand how the whole arrangement and associated financials work, but let's hope this happens. Aside: the presentation team did state that there would be no reduction in total spectator capacity (though a small reduction would probably not have been a huge deal). |
Considering that the full capacity in it's current state gets used only maybe once every couple of years when an unusually large event happens - it's not a bad thing to have reduced capacity.
It sounds like the interior renovations continue to be pretty extensive. I'm still pretty excited for this. I never really expected some A-level facility equal to the ACC in Hamilton - the market just isn't there to support it. This looks like it will be an excellent mid-sized facility for what at the end of the day is really a mid-sized city. Honestly, hard to complain. The Spec Article also mentioned that the street activation is still there with the ground floor reconfiguration still happening, just without the expensive facade reconstruction above it. |
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And for reference, the entire cost of Tim Hortons field was something like $150 million. Even factoring into account inflation, if they spend $280 million in today's dollars on Copps, that is pretty darn massive. (The original $50 million number that was kicked around would have gotten us pretty much nothing).
And maybe the exterior will ultimately look better than in that crappy render. I really wish I understood the mechanics of this whole deal. |
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Don't think the issue is with the inside renovations (which yes is ultimately what matters) but the outside shots are awful. You could even argue the outside appearance is quite key to the renovation as well in regards to it's integration into a Distillery District vibe, spillover effect and making the corner of York & Bay more lively. That's not happening here and frankly where I assume most people's disappointment resides. However, maybe we will be pleasantly surprised. If it ends up like the most lipstick render, then it would be a let down.
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Edit. Nvm. Dated article
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For the sake of comparison, I made a gif to compare the current (StreetView) facility and the revised proposal for its renovation.
https://i.imgur.com/ZHN6kH2.gif Source (Google StreetView) and Source (rendering) |
Great gif, disappointing proposal.
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Looks like a trendy house flip - new grey vinyl siding and some exterior potlights = boom! profit!
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I wonder how long First Ontario's sponsorship has to go.
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Andlauer not sure rebuilt FirstOntario Centre has room for Bulldogs
Oak View Group plans to make concerts the anchor tenant of upgraded arena https://www.thespec.com/sports/hocke...3d8604ad7.html "The only other arena in the Golden Horseshoe similar to the size of our building is Scotiabank Arena in Toronto. The theory is that with all the acts touring these days it can’t handle everything. So there should be plenty of big shows available to come to Hamilton. We’re going to become an extension of the Toronto concert market. According to Pistore, OVG management will watch to see what dates are locked up for Maple Leafs or Raptors games — days a concert couldn’t be held there — and look to book FirstOntario Centre with travelling acts at those times. Since those teams often play on weekends, that could mean a lot of choice dates for concerts here. “I don’t know how you guys feel,” Pistore said. “Going to a concert on Monday is great. Going to a concert on a Thursday, Friday or Saturday is way, way better. So we think we can capitalize on the busyness of Scotiabank.”" |
$280M deal signed in revitalization of Hamilton’s FirstOntario Centre
https://www.chch.com/280m-deal-signe...ntario-centre/ |
I'm realizing now we don't really know what the planned renovations to the Concert Hall are, but I really hope they don't try to "modernize" it by pulling out all the beautiful vintage wood accents, covering the well thought brutalism. There are definitely some items that could use some touch ups, but overall it's a really stunning venue that I could see being viable for heritage status one day.
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I imagine Oakview is going all in on the arena and will do their contractual minimums on the other facilities - so don't expect much. $2.5 million on the concert hall will basically just buy some basic deferred maintenance.
Otherwise - this is super exciting and feels real this time, I think. Getting Copps up to modern standards is going to make a massive difference not only for the arena itself, but the wider downtown. With 150 events a year and 1 million annual visitors, that's a very strong customer base for restaurants, hotels, etc. downtown. It's a massive multiple over what the facility currently attracts, which is probably more like 150-200,000 visitors at most annually. Plus it'll be fun to get a lot more major shows in Hamilton too. |
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